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Bitcoin lol

 
Old 05-14-2019, 12:29 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by jfb View Post
What are they accepting, something that has no intrinsic value? Why? One day they will be worth nothing. Gold is a storehouse of value. In 1929 one ounce of gold would buy you a tailored suit or about 11 barrels of crude oil. Today one ounce of gold will buy you a tailored suit or about 11 barrels of crude oil.
I can see people trading BTC to take money out of this market but buying and holding is a losing proposition because one day it will be worth nothing.
Might be worth nothing today if it keeps going down as fast as it has during the last 15 minutes. Lol.
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Old 05-14-2019, 01:11 PM
  #22  
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I also have some GBTC shares, which have been doing very well the past few weeks.

The share price tracks the bitcoin price, although the shares trade at a premium to the value of the bitcoin held. This premium is due to the fact that there are very few bitcoin or other crypto-currency funds that are approved for public trading. As that changes, presumably the premium in the GBTC share price will go down, and eventually vanish. Or maybe there will always be a small premium, for the ease of trading and perceived liquidity (over actual bitcoin).

As the OP said - this is NOT a recommendation, as GBTC shares are a bumpy ride. I was down for a while, before becoming significantly positive.... (And it is only a very small piece of my portfolio, more of a "playing around" sort of thing....)
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Old 05-14-2019, 01:38 PM
  #23  
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10 years ago no one thought that we would need a transgender-incognito-not sure what sex I am today bathroom and yet here we are......same principle applies with BC, give it time.
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Old 05-14-2019, 02:05 PM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by SilverC1 View Post
I also have some GBTC shares, which have been doing very well the past few weeks.

The share price tracks the bitcoin price, although the shares trade at a premium to the value of the bitcoin held. This premium is due to the fact that there are very few bitcoin or other crypto-currency funds that are approved for public trading. As that changes, presumably the premium in the GBTC share price will go down, and eventually vanish. Or maybe there will always be a small premium, for the ease of trading and perceived liquidity (over actual bitcoin).

As the OP said - this is NOT a recommendation, as GBTC shares are a bumpy ride. I was down for a while, before becoming significantly positive.... (And it is only a very small piece of my portfolio, more of a "playing around" sort of thing....)
I would say GBTC is as good of a way to play bitcoin as any I've seen.
Plenty of volume, penny spread. Its otc exchange, but seems to be plenty liquid.
This is probably safer than owning actual bitcoins.
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Old 05-14-2019, 02:16 PM
  #25  
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2004 called. They want their 'woot' back.
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Old 05-14-2019, 02:24 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by LayZ View Post
Still blows my mind that this crap is actually worth anything. No ties to anything, not backed by a government, not backed by tangible assets, it's just a number out there.
Monopoly money. WOOT!

Last edited by Chambered; 05-14-2019 at 02:25 PM.
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Old 05-14-2019, 02:28 PM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by Chambered View Post
Monopoly money. WOOT!

You too?


******* noobs.
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Old 05-14-2019, 02:55 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by themonk View Post
10 years ago no one thought that we would need a transgender-incognito-not sure what sex I am today bathroom and yet here we are......same principle applies with BC, give it time.
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Old 05-14-2019, 03:03 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by jfb View Post
What are they accepting, something that has no intrinsic value? Why? One day they will be worth nothing. Gold is a storehouse of value. In 1929 one ounce of gold would buy you a tailored suit or about 11 barrels of crude oil. Today one ounce of gold will buy you a tailored suit or about 11 barrels of crude oil.
I can see people trading BTC to take money out of this market but buying and holding is a losing proposition because one day it will be worth nothing.
why not make a realistic comparison. gold is a physical element. compare paper money for example. neither are backed by anything but faith.

eggs in 1929 cost 45 cents. they are now around 2 bucks locally.

bread was ten cents a loaf in 1929, it is now around 3 bucks locally.

why are the multiples different. I can see putting cash in a mattress but someday it will be worthless. the economy makes sure of that via inflation
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Old 05-14-2019, 03:17 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by flange View Post
why not make a realistic comparison. gold is a physical element. compare paper money for example. neither are backed by anything but faith.

eggs in 1929 cost 45 cents. they are now around 2 bucks locally.

bread was ten cents a loaf in 1929, it is now around 3 bucks locally.

why are the multiples different. I can see putting cash in a mattress but someday it will be worthless. the economy makes sure of that via inflation
The ounce of gold vs new suit is commonly used to describe purchasing power. The reason being, is it takes about the same amount of labor to extract an once of gold from the ground, as it does to make a reasonable quality suit.
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Old 05-14-2019, 03:17 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by flange View Post
why not make a realistic comparison. gold is a physical element. compare paper money for example. neither are backed by anything but faith.

eggs in 1929 cost 45 cents. they are now around 2 bucks locally.

bread was ten cents a loaf in 1929, it is now around 3 bucks locally.

why are the multiples different. I can see putting cash in a mattress but someday it will be worthless. the economy makes sure of that via inflation
True. Inflation started its rise when the US government did away with silver and gold as backing for its paper money and they plugged in the money printing presses to 480 volts.
The same thing happened in Germany after WWI, the Mark became almost worthless,finally taking 1 million Marks for a stick of butter. The new Mark was backed by real estate and the government would trade 1 Million old Marks for 1 new Mark. I was told by a German immigrant that his father owned a grocery store and during the time of inflation would only accept German pennies for groceries. He had a large basement and stored the pennies. When the new Mark came out pennies were still worth 1/100 of a new Mark.
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Old 05-14-2019, 06:12 PM
  #32  
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Yeah, I have some "old Deutschmark" notes from the post-WWI era that belonged to my grandfather. He held on to a few of the essentially worthless paper when he came to the US in 1920. Maybe he thought they'd maybe be worth something someday, but I think it was more as a "reminder"....

I know there are some 100,000 DM notes in the bunch, but I can't recall if any of them were for the nice round number amount of 1,000,000.

My grandfather didn't have any "real money" to pay for his boat passage to the US, but instead he had his passage paid for by a German-American farmer living in Nebraska, in exchange for a commitment for my grandfather to work as a farm-hand for a couple/few years, to "pay off" the loan of the passage fare.

Being a hire farm-hand in 1920's Nebraska was no piece of cake, I'm sure, although he did manage to marry my grandmother, who had also come over to the US under a similar arrangement. (Even though both of them had basically been peasant farmers in Germany.) As soon as they had paid off their debt, they moved "back" to New York City (they had immigrated through Ellis Island), and lived there for the rest of their lives, basically.....
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Old 05-15-2019, 04:11 AM
  #33  
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real estate. lots of it.

Originally Posted by flange View Post
I am curious, which tangible asset backs your transaction when you swipe a visa card? Also, which tangible asset makes a piece of paper worth more because it has a ten written on it in lieu of a one?
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Old 05-15-2019, 04:13 AM
  #34  
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how so safer, and why pay a sizable premium for an underlying asset when you can own the asset directly, albeit as much a pain in the rear as it is to do so?

Originally Posted by PatternDayTrader View Post
I would say GBTC is as good of a way to play bitcoin as any I've seen.
Plenty of volume, penny spread. Its otc exchange, but seems to be plenty liquid.
This is probably safer than owning actual bitcoins.
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Old 05-15-2019, 06:41 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by SLO VETTE View Post
how so safer, and why pay a sizable premium for an underlying asset when you can own the asset directly, albeit as much a pain in the rear as it is to do so?
No one is going to steal your GBTC, and the broker/dealer network within which its traded, is not going to collapse from some sort of fraud or other chicanery.
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Old 05-15-2019, 01:29 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by PatternDayTrader View Post
No one is going to steal your GBTC, and the broker/dealer network within which its traded, is not going to collapse from some sort of fraud or other chicanery.
Your money has already been stolen by GBTC. Here is how:
Bitcoin per Share‎: ‎0.00098247
Annual Fee‎: ‎2%
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:02 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by jfb View Post
Your money has already been stolen by GBTC. Here is how:

Bitcoin per Share‎: ‎0.00098247
Annual Fee‎: ‎2%
Its just not practical trying to avoid the premiums you are complaining about. There are many more things at play besides those numbers.
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Old 05-15-2019, 04:54 PM
  #38  
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Do you know how or where the underlying Bitcoin is held for custodial purposes?

That's an important question.

Originally Posted by PatternDayTrader View Post
No one is going to steal your GBTC, and the broker/dealer network within which its traded, is not going to collapse from some sort of fraud or other chicanery.
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Old 05-15-2019, 08:52 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by SLO VETTE View Post
Do you know how or where the underlying Bitcoin is held for custodial purposes?

That's an important question.
You mean that backs GTBC ?
I don't know.
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Old 05-15-2019, 09:13 PM
  #40  
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Have you ever owned Bitcoin? If you haven't, you might take some time to learn what an exchange is, how they operate, and lo & behold how some exhanges get hacked and lose the Bitcoin assets owned by individuals.

Imagine if GTBC had it's Bitcoin stored at Mt. Gox, for example.


Originally Posted by PatternDayTrader View Post
You mean that backs GTBC ?
I don't know.
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