Z06 Corvette Killer-We will see more of this.
10-20-2007, 03:36 AM
#241
Team Owner
All you guys are acting like how P/F/L owners act when we talk about the Z06, they call it "just a POS", "just a vette", "just a chevy", "just a plastic bag" etc etc..
so plz refrain, this car is as iconic as the Z06 and there is nothing wrong in comparing it to the Z06 as in price and in performance numbers they seem very close, so in mybooks, this is an awesome machine..
so plz refrain, this car is as iconic as the Z06 and there is nothing wrong in comparing it to the Z06 as in price and in performance numbers they seem very close, so in mybooks, this is an awesome machine..
10-20-2007, 09:51 AM
#242
Burning Brakes
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Well not really - completely new platform etc. After going through all 12 pages I got post some comments, but didn't want to even begin quoting some of the ****.
1. The numbers are unconfirmed on all accounts so leave that at the door. The performance figures for the GTR are probably close but could go either way once real testing is performed. That said the car we are seeing is in the actual production form. The car is months away from hitting dealer lots in japan so there isn't going to be any major changes besides minor tweaks.
2.I have to say posting this on corvette forums and trying to convince a vette owner that their car is slower is pointless... People that have spent their hard earned $$$ on anything don't want to be told its inferior, (not saying it is, this is just for the GTR die hards)
3. Simply put the GT-R from the beginning was built to beat the 997 turbo. Even though the Z06 owners enjoy having their car as the accepted performance target, it wasn't the case in this instance. Look at the specs of the two cars
Porsche---------Nissan
2+2 coupe---2+2 coupe
AWD------------AWD
TT 6-----------TT 6
Similar power and torque for both vehicle
Now the magazines are out trying to compare the Zoh and GTR, but its stupid IMO. The GTR is a grand touring car that was built to not only be fast, but to be usable every day, even in inclement weather. The Z06 is closer to a road going race car, more sacrifices made for comfort and usability, but its light and fast as hell
LS7 = drool
4. The GT-R in current form and past has always been a technological show case for automotive engineering. Where the vette has used brute force, a tried but true suspension, and light weight to make a great performing vehicle, nissan has continued the tradition of the GTR's of past with this one and I think that was a good move.
5. As far as the track times, the AWD is a big difference, having a system constantly moving the power from wheel to wheel as needed is HUGE. Also the DSG gearbox is exciting news, many people say manual or nothing, but I don't think they've had any experience with a DSG. Personally, as someone that refuse to own anything without a clutch pedal, I've driven several audi/vw cars with VAG's DSG tranny and it is the only "auto" I would ever own!
Is all I can say, it is amazing how fast it shifts, the feeling is amazing and the performance is perfection. A human could never come close to the speed, never missing a gear, and perfectly rev-matched downshifts every time is awesome. Think about the advantage of this with any car on in a race or on a long track... All that time saved in between shifts over a traditional manual adds up quickly. There is a reason so many race cars and motorcycles use "auto manuals", MOTO GP for example, all the shifts you make around a track add up.
The one thing that makes me think that the 7.40ish lap time at the ring may be accurate is due to Nissan aiming at beating the 911 since day one. I don't see why they would have set a performance goal that drastic, just to finish the day 15secs behind the 911 at the ring, send it to production and go home... It just doesn't make sense. Since there is a confirmed 911turbo time of 7.40, I would believe that they have achieved at least that time.
So after all that: The Z06 is simply an amazing vehicle, and I would drive the S**t out of it any day of the week. The GT-R is going to be amazing in its own ways, and will be very close to the performance of the Zoh. If its beating 911turbos for nearly half the $$, and you are still calling it S**t, then you really need to wake up, and drop the brand loyalty to the grave BS. I'm a car lover, and anytime a company tries to take performance to a new level I can respect the hell out of it! At the end of the day the Z06 is still the king of the street, and no one will have the true story on the GT-R in the united states till mid 08' when they will hit the lots. Its definitely a good time to be "car guy", there are so many awesome vehicles out there by many different manufacturers its tough to even know where to turn next!
1. The numbers are unconfirmed on all accounts so leave that at the door. The performance figures for the GTR are probably close but could go either way once real testing is performed. That said the car we are seeing is in the actual production form. The car is months away from hitting dealer lots in japan so there isn't going to be any major changes besides minor tweaks.
2.I have to say posting this on corvette forums and trying to convince a vette owner that their car is slower is pointless... People that have spent their hard earned $$$ on anything don't want to be told its inferior, (not saying it is, this is just for the GTR die hards)
3. Simply put the GT-R from the beginning was built to beat the 997 turbo. Even though the Z06 owners enjoy having their car as the accepted performance target, it wasn't the case in this instance. Look at the specs of the two cars
Porsche---------Nissan
2+2 coupe---2+2 coupe
AWD------------AWD
TT 6-----------TT 6
Similar power and torque for both vehicle
Now the magazines are out trying to compare the Zoh and GTR, but its stupid IMO. The GTR is a grand touring car that was built to not only be fast, but to be usable every day, even in inclement weather. The Z06 is closer to a road going race car, more sacrifices made for comfort and usability, but its light and fast as hell
LS7 = drool 4. The GT-R in current form and past has always been a technological show case for automotive engineering. Where the vette has used brute force, a tried but true suspension, and light weight to make a great performing vehicle, nissan has continued the tradition of the GTR's of past with this one and I think that was a good move.
5. As far as the track times, the AWD is a big difference, having a system constantly moving the power from wheel to wheel as needed is HUGE. Also the DSG gearbox is exciting news, many people say manual or nothing, but I don't think they've had any experience with a DSG. Personally, as someone that refuse to own anything without a clutch pedal, I've driven several audi/vw cars with VAG's DSG tranny and it is the only "auto" I would ever own!
Is all I can say, it is amazing how fast it shifts, the feeling is amazing and the performance is perfection. A human could never come close to the speed, never missing a gear, and perfectly rev-matched downshifts every time is awesome. Think about the advantage of this with any car on in a race or on a long track... All that time saved in between shifts over a traditional manual adds up quickly. There is a reason so many race cars and motorcycles use "auto manuals", MOTO GP for example, all the shifts you make around a track add up.The one thing that makes me think that the 7.40ish lap time at the ring may be accurate is due to Nissan aiming at beating the 911 since day one. I don't see why they would have set a performance goal that drastic, just to finish the day 15secs behind the 911 at the ring, send it to production and go home... It just doesn't make sense. Since there is a confirmed 911turbo time of 7.40, I would believe that they have achieved at least that time.
So after all that: The Z06 is simply an amazing vehicle, and I would drive the S**t out of it any day of the week. The GT-R is going to be amazing in its own ways, and will be very close to the performance of the Zoh. If its beating 911turbos for nearly half the $$, and you are still calling it S**t, then you really need to wake up, and drop the brand loyalty to the grave BS. I'm a car lover, and anytime a company tries to take performance to a new level I can respect the hell out of it! At the end of the day the Z06 is still the king of the street, and no one will have the true story on the GT-R in the united states till mid 08' when they will hit the lots. Its definitely a good time to be "car guy", there are so many awesome vehicles out there by many different manufacturers its tough to even know where to turn next!
Datsun is downright infamous for over-promising and underdelivering. The 240 Z and the 350 Z were both supposed to make us forget the Vette. Uh Huh!
Hey, I like AWD for the STREET. My DD is an Audi and I love it. But quit with the AWD being a big advantage at the track. This is just not so.
FWIW, I'm not a diehard Vette guy. THe last new one I owned before this was in '74 and it was a turd (not as big a turd as the 240 Z however, owned one of them too). It's just that in the real world today the Z 06 is an astonishing performance car/value.
10-20-2007, 01:17 PM
#243
Racer
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Wow, please let me know what your smoking. Because you are so wrong.
Oh, please.
Datsun is downright infamous for over-promising and underdelivering. The 240 Z and the 350 Z were both supposed to make us forget the Vette. Uh Huh!
Hey, I like AWD for the STREET. My DD is an Audi and I love it. But quit with the AWD being a big advantage at the track. This is just not so.
FWIW, I'm not a diehard Vette guy. THe last new one I owned before this was in '74 and it was a turd (not as big a turd as the 240 Z however, owned one of them too). It's just that in the real world today the Z 06 is an astonishing performance car/value.
Datsun is downright infamous for over-promising and underdelivering. The 240 Z and the 350 Z were both supposed to make us forget the Vette. Uh Huh!
Hey, I like AWD for the STREET. My DD is an Audi and I love it. But quit with the AWD being a big advantage at the track. This is just not so.
FWIW, I'm not a diehard Vette guy. THe last new one I owned before this was in '74 and it was a turd (not as big a turd as the 240 Z however, owned one of them too). It's just that in the real world today the Z 06 is an astonishing performance car/value.
10-20-2007, 04:32 PM
#244
Burning Brakes
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10-20-2007, 04:39 PM
#245
Drifting
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Oh, please.
Datsun is downright infamous for over-promising and underdelivering. The 240 Z and the 350 Z were both supposed to make us forget the Vette. Uh Huh!
Hey, I like AWD for the STREET. My DD is an Audi and I love it. But quit with the AWD being a big advantage at the track. This is just not so.
FWIW, I'm not a diehard Vette guy. THe last new one I owned before this was in '74 and it was a turd (not as big a turd as the 240 Z however, owned one of them too). It's just that in the real world today the Z 06 is an astonishing performance car/value.
Datsun is downright infamous for over-promising and underdelivering. The 240 Z and the 350 Z were both supposed to make us forget the Vette. Uh Huh!
Hey, I like AWD for the STREET. My DD is an Audi and I love it. But quit with the AWD being a big advantage at the track. This is just not so.
FWIW, I'm not a diehard Vette guy. THe last new one I owned before this was in '74 and it was a turd (not as big a turd as the 240 Z however, owned one of them too). It's just that in the real world today the Z 06 is an astonishing performance car/value.
Allegretto you won't convince the Nissan fanboys in a hundred years. They just don't want to hear anything.
But the biggest problem is that they do not provide any evidence to their claims. Maybe we should ask the mods to kick them out.
For the AWD fans:
If AWD is so great, why the 997 GT3 (RWD and with less power), is faster than the 997 Turbo (AWD)?
Also why the 997 GT2 (RWD and more power) is way faster than the 997 Turbo (AWD)?
Why Porsche did not make their top of the line cars (Carrera GT, 997 GT2) AWD??
10-20-2007, 04:42 PM
#246
Drifting
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10-20-2007, 05:12 PM
#247
Racer
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Well you did make your self look like an idiot when you said the 240Z and 350Z were supposed to compete with the corvette. The only Z car that was ever even partially aimed at the Corvette was the 300ZX. Nissan very rarely uses American cars as benchmarks or competitors.....The GTRs and Z cars have always been aimed at Porsche. 350Z - Boxster S/Cayman competitor, GTR - 911 competitor.Just like Infiniti is aimed at BMW.
Last edited by RedBeauty84ZX; 10-20-2007 at 05:14 PM.
10-20-2007, 11:28 PM
#248
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Allegretto you won't convince the Nissan fanboys in a hundred years. They just don't want to hear anything.
But the biggest problem is that they do not provide any evidence to their claims. Maybe we should ask the mods to kick them out.
For the AWD fans:
If AWD is so great, why the 997 GT3 (RWD and with less power), is faster than the 997 Turbo (AWD)?
Also why the 997 GT2 (RWD and more power) is way faster than the 997 Turbo (AWD)?
Why Porsche did not make their top of the line cars (Carrera GT, 997 GT2) AWD??
Please answer this then:
Why is AWD banned from certain racing events? Because it gave the 2 wheel drive cars a unfair disadvantage. If you really think RWD cars are better than AWD on a track your sadly mistaken.
10-20-2007, 11:30 PM
#249
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Well you did make your self look like an idiot when you said the 240Z and 350Z were supposed to compete with the corvette. The only Z car that was ever even partially aimed at the Corvette was the 300ZX. Nissan very rarely uses American cars as benchmarks or competitors.....The GTRs and Z cars have always been aimed at Porsche. 350Z - Boxster S/Cayman competitor, GTR - 911 competitor.Just like Infiniti is aimed at BMW.
So true. That is why the 350z even looks like a Porsche. The 300ZX TT is the only car that got close to the performance of the Vette at that time. 350z was never meant to be.
10-20-2007, 11:45 PM
#250
Drifting
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Well you did make your self look like an idiot when you said the 240Z and 350Z were supposed to compete with the corvette. The only Z car that was ever even partially aimed at the Corvette was the 300ZX. Nissan very rarely uses American cars as benchmarks or competitors.....The GTRs and Z cars have always been aimed at Porsche. 350Z - Boxster S/Cayman competitor, GTR - 911 competitor.Just like Infiniti is aimed at BMW.
You don't deserve to be here. Telling me that I am "retarded" and "idiot" shows your true colors and intelligence.
You are ignored.
10-20-2007, 11:50 PM
#251
Drifting
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You don't deserve any answer. Learn how to treat people here first.
10-21-2007, 12:00 AM
#252
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"The 240 Z and the 350 Z were both supposed to make us forget the Vette. Uh Huh!"
Sounds like you're trying to say the 240Z/350Z were supposed to eclipse the Corvette which would mean it was a competitor. Which they CLEARY were not. Did you even bother to THINK about why the GT2 and GT3 porsches were faster??? Seriously, at least try to make thought out and educated posts...
10-21-2007, 12:01 AM
#253
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10-21-2007, 12:15 AM
#254
Drifting
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It is Allegretto that posted that phrase GENIUS, not me:
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...&postcount=242
I know, I have said that I will ignore you, which you 100% deserve.
Now you are on my ignored people list so I won't even see your crap anymore.
10-21-2007, 01:17 AM
#255
Drifting
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Have you seen a 505 hp Z06, it costs about 80k, is made of plastic, seats arnt even real leather and is really poorly put together, take all the money it would take to correct these errors and you will be in the 100k range and then add the cost of Euro into this and you wouldnt be very far from the 135k pricetag, so there is a reason why things are cheap, its no magic that chevy has in their back pocket..
I own a C6 so i know how the car is put together..i aint a fan of that, but surely i am fan of what else comes with it..
10-21-2007, 01:19 AM
#256
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10-21-2007, 01:24 AM
#257
Safety Car
Gee it weighs over 500lbs less, has a much improved suspension setup with Porsches PASM setup, and "zero lift" aerodynamics. This car was DESIGNED To be a track car....power isnt everything, look what the new GTR is doing. 
Um...the GT2 ALSO weighs a 400+lbs less, has MORE power, and improved aerodynamics.
Um...the GT2 ALSO weighs a 400+lbs less, has MORE power, and improved aerodynamics.
But for anyone how is interested:
450+ less lbs
cup car suspension (same dynamics and deveolpement)
more down force
higher revving
lower center of gravity
You could put those thing alone on a TT, and it would burn a GT3 up on the track, I mean like rapage. Most people can beat the GT3 by simply adding some power to make the hp weight ratio more even, and adding coilovers, that is enough to put the TT past the GT3.
In fact if Porsche makes a 997 Turbo S, like they did the 996 it could eclipse the GT3 on many tracks for the best lap time, but would never be as good a car in a race as a GT3. Low Weight, Hidh revving, and better suspension make the GT3 a straight out of the box enduro car, that can still blaze a fast lap.
