DaveFerrari458

Cadillac is moving the CTS more upmarket hence the CTS is no longer an entry level Cadillac. It is now the ATS. The new CTS would now be a true XF, E Class, 5 Series, GS, competitor.

Now about the C7, I highly doubt we will see 450 HP. I would have to guess at least 475 HP.

RocketGuy3

"Entry level" essentially refers to both trims of the regular CTS. When people talk about entry level luxury cars, they're talking about the IS, the 3-series, the C-class, etc. Not just the IS250, 328i, etc.

... Although to be fair, I suppose the CTS has become more of a GS, 5-series, E-class, etc competitor than an entry-level competitor. So maybe that's where I slipped up.

Regardless, I still can't imagine GM allowing the Vette to not blow the doors off of any Cadillac without a "V" at the end of its name. And yes, I know the C7 will still be way faster overall than a 420-hp CTS, and a good bit faster even in a straight line, but I would still expect more differentiation. Even just having power numbers that similar on paper is kind of strange IMO.

janky

You could make the same argument regarding the Camaro, but then neither vehicle actually competes with one another for sales on the market. The Cadillac is going to appeal to a different buyer than the C7, regardless of straight line performance differential.

JudgeNjury

I believe the original posters assumption that the LT1 will have more hp is in fact correct.

450 was for the competition to hear and I believe whatever hp and tq numbers are needed to equal the awesome 427 convertibles acceleration times is what the LT1 will have...

Taking into consideration of the lighter c7 curb weight.

Jmo

Guibo

Even if it is the CTS we are talking about, the entry level CTS does not come with that engine. There are two lower-powered trim levels below that.
I'm not so surprised that power levels of sedans have crept up. After all, they have so much more weight to blunt that power. Realistically, these two cars are, as they say, as different as chalk and cheese.

tuxnharley

Not sure that has been confirmed yet? Just as with hp/tq, the weight figures are not out there yet. Yes, the frame has been announced as being 99 lbs (?) lighter, but other elements add weight back in. I have not yet seen a final total vehicle weight be announced by GM.

RocketGuy3

Well the difference with the Camaro was that it was released half a decade *after* the C6 was released, so it was only natural that technology would have advanced to a point that the Camaro could offer comparable power output.

This CTS and the C7 are both going to have a similar release window, however, so they will give us a pretty good idea of GM's longterm plan for how to position these models. Yes, they are very different cars, but there is at least some overlap in the target demographic here. Hell, you can already see at least one person in this thread mentioning how he might be buying a Caddy over the C7. And depending on how the C7, ATS-V, and next gen CTS-V turn out, I might be another such person. They're all high-powered, RWD, domestics from GM, so some of the appeal is common.

Z0Sick6

The NEW CTS is now the 550, A6, and E550 competitor (the ATS will fight the 3 series, a4, and C Class Mercedes).

I expected this because the 550 bmw for 2012+ has 400 hp / 450 tq

Mercedes E550 - 402 hp / 443 tq


Both Mercedes and BMW are V8 TTs... they run 4.3 - 4.5 0-60s

GM is always a bit conservative... so its definitely right in the thick of the 550 and E550.

CPhelps

GM claims "under" 4 seconds 0-60 in the Stingray, 4.6 seconds from the TT V6 won't be encroaching on the C7's straight line acceleration.

I'm pretty sure they meant C7 is lighter than CTS. Considering the Gen 3 CTS is growing in size to match up with the M5, if the C7 is not lighter than the 4 door sedan CTS, there is a problem. The CTS will be based on a stretched alpha. Alpha is what ATS is on. The LIGHTEST ATS with 2.5L inline 4 is ~3400 lbs, I would expect the 3G CTS to be at least 200 lbs heavier than that with the 3.6L TT

RocketGuy3

The more I think about it, the more I realize that this doesn't really encroach on Corvette territory at all. As I mentioned, and as several others have pointed out, the CTS is now a midsize luxury competitor -- not an entry level competitor. So my comparison in the OP was kind of silly.

Now if this engine was available in a non-V version of the ATS, THEN I would have a more legitimate case here...

... Regardless, I still really think [and hope] the LT1 estimate is very conservative, and we see something closer to 500 hp by the time it's officially rated.

JudgeNjury

The 427 c6 convertible acceleration times will be what the c7 achieves.

The awesome new TT v6 CTS can not compete but it's a dam fine sports sedan from Cadillac

LIVetteFan

I agree with the OP - Chevy must have 25-30 more HP under wraps. They are playing a very good PR campaign here - something they have also done significantly better than the miserable C6 launch.