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Failure to launch: Why so many American millennials feel adulthood is a lie

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Failure to launch: Why so many American millennials feel adulthood is a lie

 
Old 02-24-2019, 11:48 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by jashmore1234 View Post
Boo ******* hoo. Bet that little punk would grow up and be responsible if mommy and daddy didnít pay his bills.
I'm this guy's age... Give or take.

I did not come from a wealthy family. No big dollar private school or daddy's check book.

I have an engineering degree that led me to a solid career, a retirement plan, a wife and a kid, a house with a mortgage that is nowhere near upside down,.... I'm not "rich" but I'm nowhere near struggling for money. I can buy what I want, when I want and still have plenty to plan for the future.

You think your lazy *** buddy validates your pathetic life? Yea. My college buddy and I have a quickly growing business in addition to our other careers.

Short answer, you're a lazy piece of **** and your pathetic place in life is your own damn fault.

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Old 02-24-2019, 12:08 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by Red99SS View Post
It also has to be taken into account what the world was like when these millennials found themselves in it. Somebody in their early 30s was told all their life by people they were supposed to be able to trust that the ticket to success was to go to college, they did that and found themselves in the midst of the Great Recession with zero job prospects and creditors ringing their phone off the hook. Somebody like that thinks adulthood is a lie because... the way they were told things work WAS a lie.

What, you're going to fault them for listening to their parents and teachers and doing what they were told was the right thing to do?
I suspect that you're being half sarcastic and half serious.

There's no doubt there are parenting issues that come to bear in a lot of these cases. And there are systemic educational issues that also come to bear. Doesn't alter the fact that these are excuses, not reasons, for avoiding adulthood.
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Old 02-24-2019, 12:24 PM
  #43  
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Two of my close friends pretty much summed up the problem to me pretty clearly.

One is a Dentist and the other a Oral Surgeon.

Getting your Degree is just the beginning of the process,YOU have to apply what you've learned to become successful and that's hard work also.

There seems to be a Delusion nowadays that just because you have a Degree you are automatically guaranteed everything.

I became a Carpenter because I can take pride in what I build,I feel good at the end of the day,Sure I could do other things that I could make more $$$ but...

It took years to get good enough to make real money

Success is relative

Feeling like a Adult is a inside job,You just know when you become a Man by the way you handle life's problems not by you assets.
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Old 02-24-2019, 12:33 PM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by Turbodude View Post
The solutions offered by the right involve work and responsibility. The solutions offered by the left involve more sitting on their asses and taking from those who opted for work and responsibility...with assistance from the gov't to do the taking.

They're taught to hate us which helps them rationalize their self-centered parasitic behavior.

Excellent observation and spot on.

Personal responsibility seems to be like kryptonite to these millennial losers.
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Old 02-24-2019, 12:39 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by NY09C6 View Post
The point about going to college not necessarily leading to success is 100% correct. If you are going to pay todayís prices you better make sure you are a take charge type of person so you are not left worse off than if you didnít go.
Have you seen what passes for college classes these days? How stupid does one have to be to think that a degree in Transgender Underwater Basket Weaving is going to net them a six figure income?
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Old 02-24-2019, 12:47 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by BenThere View Post
I suspect that you're being half sarcastic and half serious.

There's no doubt there are parenting issues that come to bear in a lot of these cases. And there are systemic educational issues that also come to bear. Doesn't alter the fact that these are excuses, not reasons, for avoiding adulthood.
I'm being serious. You have all these people that entered the real world and realized that their last sixteen years of preparation was a waste of time and the image of life they'd been sold was a farce. They're avoiding adulthood because they're unprepared for it. They have been practicing baseball their whole lives only to find life is a game of basketball. It's pretty easy to see why they support high taxes on the demographic that sold them a raw deal. I'm not condoning it, but it's pretty understandable.

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Old 02-24-2019, 01:03 PM
  #47  
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I'm still amazed that anyone thinks what Millenials are going through is really any different than what Boomers went through.

What a cynical group of old Farts we've got around here ......

As a Generation looking back......a lot of you guys in this thread are failing to recognize how many Boomers were slow to mature also and how a great many never did wake up to the idea of how it's up to an individual to make something of his or her life. (Good Grief ........ How do you not understand that this is where so very Boomers who voted Bernie in the last election cycle got their own original views? Sander's support went well beyond just Millennial vote alone)

Mean-while attempting to pigeon hole "Millennials" as an entire group of whiners incapable of taking personal responsibility is just as DUMB as the Bernie Supporting young people who imagine that all of us Successful Boomers were all Liberal Dumb *** Hippies who went off the rails and became the Greedy Geezers they know us as now.

Wake up for God Sake. There are LOTS OF WINNERS in this Millennial generation and that's a GOOD THING because they are now a larger group than us Boomers and as we age and start to pass on they will run this country for as long and as completely as we did.

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Old 02-24-2019, 01:18 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by Red99SS View Post
I'm being serious. You have all these people that entered the real world and realized that their last sixteen years of preparation was a waste of time and the image of life they'd been sold was a farce. They're avoiding adulthood because they're unprepared for it. They have been practicing baseball their whole lives only to find life is a game of basketball. It's pretty easy to see why they support high taxes on the demographic that sold them a raw deal. I'm not condoning it, but it's pretty understandable.
Sorry, man, I get your point, but I can't agree, not completely. What you have now is a huge part of a demographic (millenials) that's living in an echo chamber and convincing themselves that another demographic (Big Business/Fat-Cats/Old White Men) is the reason they can't get a grip on reality and take some responsibility for some of their own bad decisions in life and just keep working themselves into a blame-the-man lather to avoid taking ownership of their destiny. Or it's an excuse to remain lazy. In either case, it's an excuse to take other people's money as "reparations" and in some cases support their lazy asses. "Understandable"? I can't use that in this context, it implies objectivity is used to come to their conclusion/position.

Look, I'm not saying all millenials fit this particular stereotype. Not at all. I've been managing construction (among other things) most of my career. The preponderance of millenials I have worked with are solid contributors and have grown up pretty much as expected. But there is a large part of this particular demographic that hasn't and/or won't. It's concerning for all the obvious reasons.
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Old 02-24-2019, 02:00 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by Krystal View Post
I'm still amazed that anyone thinks what Millenials are going through is really any different than what Boomers went through.

What a cynical group of old Farts we've got around here ......

As a Generation looking back......a lot of you guys in this thread are failing to recognize how many Boomers were slow to mature also and how a great many never did wake up to the idea of how it's up to an individual to make something of his or her life. (Good Grief ........ How do you not understand that this is where so very Boomers who voted Bernie in the last election cycle got their own original views? Sander's support went well beyond just Millennial vote alone)

Mean-while attempting to pigeon hole "Millennials" as an entire group of whiners incapable of taking personal responsibility is just as DUMB as the Bernie Supporting young people who imagine that all of us Successful Boomers were all Liberal Dumb *** Hippies who went off the rails and became the Greedy Geezers they know us as now.

Wake up for God Sake. There are LOTS OF WINNERS in this Millennial generation and that's a GOOD THING because they are now a larger group than us Boomers and as we age and start to pass on they will run this country for as long and as completely as we did.
Wait, what? It's the author of the OP that thinks "what Millenials are going through is really (any) different than what Boomers went through", which is what we've been discussing. I'm not seeing much of us here suggesting that he represents ALL millenials, but we are showing concern that he does represent a lot of millenials. I'm really not getting the sense that many of the posters here are pigenholing ALL " 'millenials' (into an ) entire group of whiners incapable of taking personal responsibility". We are showing concern and taking issue with those that are.

Please don't pigeonhole us into a group of "cynical old farts". "Old farts", yeah, guilty here, but being concerned doesn't necessarily make us cynical. What we're concerned with is that the winners may be outnumbered by the whiners and continue to elect the likes of AOC, Bernie, Fauxcahantus, Spartacus, Kamala, et al.

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Old 02-24-2019, 02:27 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by BenThere View Post
Sorry, man, I get your point, but I can't agree, not completely. What you have now is a huge part of a demographic (millenials) that's living in an echo chamber and convincing themselves that another demographic (Big Business/Fat-Cats/Old White Men) is the reason they can't get a grip on reality and take some responsibility for some of their own bad decisions in life and just keep working themselves into a blame-the-man lather to avoid taking ownership of their destiny. Or it's an excuse to remain lazy. In either case, it's an excuse to take other people's money as "reparations" and in some cases support their lazy asses. "Understandable"? I can't use that in this context, it implies objectivity is used to come to their conclusion/position.

Look, I'm not saying all millenials fit this particular stereotype. Not at all. I've been managing construction (among other things) most of my career. The preponderance of millenials I have worked with are solid contributors and have grown up pretty much as expected. But there is a large part of this particular demographic that hasn't and/or won't. It's concerning for all the obvious reasons.
I agree with you except for one point. I'm on mobile and copying and pasting the quote coding is tedium I'm not ready for, so here's the line I don't agree with.

the reason they can't get a grip on reality and take some responsibility for some of their own bad decisions

Was it their decision? I'm one of the millennials who graduated college in 2008 and couldn't find **** for a job. The difference is it has the opposite effect on me, I took a look at the things I saw going on and turned hard right. The problem wasn't people with money, the problem was the people who told me a college degree was a golden ticket to making money. There never any choice to me, going to college was always what was going to happen, it was discussed as a done deal in early grade school. That's how life works, you finish high school and you go to college. At no point did I see a decision to be made, and my experience is not unique. I did what I was told to do by the people I was supposed to be able to trust. "You're too smart to work with your hands." That's the line I heard on a regular basis. I wasn't going to do peasant grade work, I was going to college and I was going to make a lot of money! I even got a real degree. Bachelor of science in information systems management. What do I do now? I'm a welder/ironworker and I love it.

A lot of people aren't as forgiving as I am. My parents fucked up raising me and bought into the rhetoric, but I don't blame them for anything. They did the best they could with the information they had. Which is exactly what these millennials did, and I just find it understandable that they are vengeful at the generation that sold them a bill of goods that they didn't get.

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Old 02-24-2019, 02:47 PM
  #51  
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Originally Posted by Red99SS View Post
I agree with you except for one point. I'm on mobile and copying and pasting the quote coding is tedium I'm not ready for, so here's the line I don't agree with.

the reason they can't get a grip on reality and take some responsibility for some of their own bad decisions

Was it their decision? I'm one of the millennials who graduated college in 2008 and couldn't find **** for a job. The difference is it has the opposite effect on me, I took a look at the things I saw going on and turned hard right. The problem wasn't people with money, the problem was the people who told me a college degree was a golden ticket to making money. There never any choice to me, going to college was always what was going to happen, it was discussed as a done deal in early grade school. That's how life works, you finish high school and you go to college. At no point did I see a decision to be made, and my experience is not unique. I did what I was told to do by the people I was supposed to be able to trust. "You're too smart to work with your hands." That's the line I heard on a regular basis. I wasn't going to do peasant grade work, I was going to college and I was going to make a lot of money! I even got a real degree. Bachelor of science in information systems management. What do I do now? I'm a welder/ironworker and I love it.

A lot of people aren't as forgiving as I am. My parents fucked up raising me and bought into the rhetoric, but I don't blame them for anything. They did the best they could with the information they had. Which is exactly what these millennials did, and I just find it understandable that they are vengeful at the generation that sold them a bill of goods that they didn't get.
We're good, Red.
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Old 02-24-2019, 02:52 PM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by Red99SS View Post
I'm being serious. You have all these people that entered the real world and realized that their last sixteen years of preparation was a waste of time and the image of life they'd been sold was a farce. They're avoiding adulthood because they're unprepared for it. They have been practicing baseball their whole lives only to find life is a game of basketball. It's pretty easy to see why they support high taxes on the demographic that sold them a raw deal. I'm not condoning it, but it's pretty understandable.
With all due respect, I have a slightly different take on that. I took the STEM route through high school, then went to a four year school and got out with a BSME. I guess I thought that my first job would involve the classes that I had just sweated through. It didn't. I got picked up right away by a Naval Shipyard looking for new engineers. My title was engineer, but the job was just a lot of documentation and paper pushing. The pay sucked, the commute sucked, and the job was a letdown from what my expectations had been. An older fellow I knew pulled me aside and told me to stick it out for three years. I took his advice and stuck it out three years to the day. I used the clearance that I had obtained working on nuke subs and moved to DC where I found true engineering work in the defense industry. I didn't start making what I considered real money for three more years after that. My point is that you have to be resilient as a person when things aren't going strictly as you planned. To this day I have never used three quarters of the classes that I had to take. Thirty years ago I would think about those classes and muse on what a waste of time and money they were. Today, I realize that they made me a better thinker and problem solver. Except for those two semesters of Chemistry that I was forced to sweat through. Those were a waste of time no matter how you look at it.
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Old 02-24-2019, 03:03 PM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by tikiman View Post
With all due respect, I have a slightly different take on that. I took the STEM route through high school, then went to a four year school and got out with a BSME. I guess I thought that my first job would involve the classes that I had just sweated through. It didn't. I got picked up right away by a Naval Shipyard looking for new engineers. My title was engineer, but the job was just a lot of documentation and paper pushing. The pay sucked, the commute sucked, and the job was a letdown from what my expectations had been. An older fellow I knew pulled me aside and told me to stick it out for three years. I took his advice and stuck it out three years to the day. I used the clearance that I had obtained working on nuke subs and moved to DC where I found true engineering work in the defense industry. I didn't start making what I considered real money for three more years after that. My point is that you have to be resilient as a person when things aren't going strictly as you planned. To this day I have never used three quarters of the classes that I had to take. Thirty years ago I would think about those classes and muse on what a waste of time and money they were. Today, I realize that they made me a better thinker and problem solver. Except for those two semesters of Chemistry that I was forced to sweat through. Those were a waste of time no matter how you look at it.
Gawd, I HATED chemistry!! But sweating through it and picking up enough despite my best efforts to do otherwise, it really helped me later in one of my careers developing ultra-high purity gas and chemical systems for installation in high-tech semiconductor facilities. I became the "high-purity guru" for my companies. I never wudda thot it.......

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Old 02-24-2019, 03:16 PM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by Krystal View Post
I'm still amazed that anyone thinks what Millenials are going through is really any different than what Boomers went through.

What a cynical group of old Farts we've got around here ......

As a Generation looking back......a lot of you guys in this thread are failing to recognize how many Boomers were slow to mature also and how a great many never did wake up to the idea of how it's up to an individual to make something of his or her life. (Good Grief ........ How do you not understand that this is where so very Boomers who voted Bernie in the last election cycle got their own original views? Sander's support went well beyond just Millennial vote alone)

Mean-while attempting to pigeon hole "Millennials" as an entire group of whiners incapable of taking personal responsibility is just as DUMB as the Bernie Supporting young people who imagine that all of us Successful Boomers were all Liberal Dumb *** Hippies who went off the rails and became the Greedy Geezers they know us as now.

Wake up for God Sake. There are LOTS OF WINNERS in this Millennial generation and that's a GOOD THING because they are now a larger group than us Boomers and as we age and start to pass on they will run this country for as long and as completely as we did.
Could not disagree more. Where I grew up (which certainly wasn't in California where kids were coddled) our ENTIRE existence was owed to our parents. It was a respect thing, an appreciation of not starving thing, and I know of no contemporaries who did not share the guilt, obligation, honor and respect of our parent. Part of that was that our folks taught us humility (but it often went way too far). Someone watching TV back in those days might imagine that kids were allowed to protest and make choices but that was a liberal portrayal not replicated in what I lived.
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Old 02-24-2019, 04:41 PM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by Red99SS View Post
I agree with you except for one point. I'm on mobile and copying and pasting the quote coding is tedium I'm not ready for, so here's the line I don't agree with.

the reason they can't get a grip on reality and take some responsibility for some of their own bad decisions

Was it their decision? I'm one of the millennials who graduated college in 2008 and couldn't find **** for a job. The difference is it has the opposite effect on me, I took a look at the things I saw going on and turned hard right. The problem wasn't people with money, the problem was the people who told me a college degree was a golden ticket to making money. There never any choice to me, going to college was always what was going to happen, it was discussed as a done deal in early grade school. That's how life works, you finish high school and you go to college. At no point did I see a decision to be made, and my experience is not unique. I did what I was told to do by the people I was supposed to be able to trust. "You're too smart to work with your hands." That's the line I heard on a regular basis. I wasn't going to do peasant grade work, I was going to college and I was going to make a lot of money! I even got a real degree. Bachelor of science in information systems management. What do I do now? I'm a welder/ironworker and I love it.

A lot of people aren't as forgiving as I am. My parents fucked up raising me and bought into the rhetoric, but I don't blame them for anything. They did the best they could with the information they had. Which is exactly what these millennials did, and I just find it understandable that they are vengeful at the generation that sold them a bill of goods that they didn't get.
The parallels between 2008 and 1978 interesting because I heard the same rants voiced by some of the "late Boomer's/early GenX's," back then in the late 1970's and early 1980's, when the economy was imploding due to ill advised politics.

I do note a number of differences and similarities between the two era's of economic retraction:

A difference is that today the complainers get sympathy, when back then I was told, "you should have been born earlier, but you were not, and feel good that you don't have to worry about Vietnam, so suck it up" (and we didn't have social media as a worthless eco-chamber of sympathy for those seeking to be enabled in pity, something new that weak Millennials must escape).

A similarity is the expectation to achieve a degree in four years, and if you don't get a degree in four years you missed out somehow. I heard a lot of discouragement in school from other students who changed majors just to graduate in four years, rather than stick it out an extra year or two to achieve a valued STEM degree, and I hear the same complaints today. Today however the pressure is not just social but also financial with the accepted dependence on student loans.

These two (above) aspects lead into a major difference in advice, where I was getting advice to not grow up too fast, and not worry about graduating in four years, and to avoid getting into debt, or starting a family too young. These Millennials are being condemned for practicing what I was told to try to do (by older people who suffered from those mistakes). This advice to enjoy my 20's is contrasted with the fact that I was also told to take my time to learn a trade and endure the college grind, so that if and when the college experience didn't reward a good paying job I could always go back to "hard work" and a good trade income (and yes, some of the mentors working the skilled trades held college degrees and felt no shame in working in the trades). Millennials today are being told to grow up, and get out of college fast regardless of the degree marketability (with the unfortunate advice that, "you can always become a Teacher"). Millennials today are also being told a "Service Industry" job is flipping burgers, and it's only later in their maturity, after the college promise disillusion sets in, that they learn that high paying skilled trades are also service industry jobs. Once we get through to a Millennial that a Pipefitter or Electrician can easily make $100,000 a year with benefits, and enjoy a 7 to 3:30 work week without homework, the stigma and self pity subsides (no different than any prior generation who sensed an opportunity to succeed better than their peers).

One aspect that will not become apparent to today's Millenials for another decade, at least to the Millennials who were/are working lower paying jobs and have been funding their 401k's, is that 2008 was an excellent time to start entering retirement savings into the stock markets. While boomers were complaining about losing half their net worth and enduring ten years to catch back up to their 2008 worth, these working Millennials were growing their retirement savings faster than any previous generation working and saving in their 20's. I have interviewed a number of Millennials for entry level skilled trade apprenticeship who express all the grief of being a failure at 29 years old, who have six figure 401k account balances from those dead end jobs (and they still live with their parents and have $20,000 in college loan debt, but also another thirty years of retirement investment growth to enjoy from that generous 401k nest egg). These Millennials may feel they wasted years in college and building website for peanuts, and competing with immigrants as a grocery bagger, but they were saving retirement money that is a much bigger head start than what older people had when we were their age. These Millennials may not have volunteered for differed gratification, but they will reap the benefit later in life.
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Old 02-24-2019, 04:58 PM
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TLDR, but who raised these people? Don't parents deserve the blame?
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Old 02-24-2019, 05:20 PM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by Red99SS View Post
It also has to be taken into account what the world was like when these millennials found themselves in it. Somebody in their early 30s was told all their life by people they were supposed to be able to trust that the ticket to success was to go to college, they did that and found themselves in the midst of the Great Recession with zero job prospects and creditors ringing their phone off the hook. Somebody like that thinks adulthood is a lie because... the way they were told things work WAS a lie.

What, you're going to fault them for listening to their parents and teachers and doing what they were told was the right thing to do?
Yup.

The educational system is a self-perpetuating fraud. The MSM is a fraud. Politicians are frauds. These kids were definitely led a line of BS.

HOWEVER, there is still free-will, logic, common sense and opportunity available. If you think for yourself and have a strong work ethic, success is available on whatever terms you like.
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Old 02-24-2019, 06:48 PM
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I see a lot of people talking about STEM degrees, and that's the next bubble that's going to blow up hard core. I work with teenagers at my church, I have friends who have teenagers, and it's STEM STEM STEM! "We were both C students, but our son is going to be a structural engineer!!" What happens when these kids start to get to 300 level courses and they find out really abruptly that they simply can't handle the math? You're left with another group of young people who did what they were told by people they thought they could trust realizing that the path they've been lead down was bullshit. Why can't we ever learn anything, as a society?

Bring back wood and metal shop and get young people into productive fields that they can earn a living in instead of selling them pipe dreams. I work with 20 year olds making $50k because their parents said "Go into the trades, steel work pays well!"

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Old 02-24-2019, 07:07 PM
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Originally Posted by jashmore1234 View Post
Boo ******* hoo. Bet that little punk would grow up and be responsible if mommy and daddy didnít pay his bills.
Originally Posted by Turbodude View Post
These people have no conception of adulthood at all.

Adulthood is measured by the responsibilities one successfully takes on in their life...especially responsibilities towards others. And how much they've struggled and sacrificed to achieve what they've attained.

WTF do they expect, a trophy for getting out of bed in the morning?


I've been "on my own", financially, since I was 19. Not because my parents were nasty people, it was simply because my father had a few bad breaks thrown in his path, during his life, and we didn't have the means for a lavish lifestyle. Just before I was going back for my second year of college (at a local, community college), a neighbor who was a manufacturing engineer, at a major corporation, approached me with an offer. His employer was starting up a work/college training program, and they were looking for some people to hire. My father highly suggested that I look into it, and the rest was history. I wound up working there for 37 years...
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Old 02-24-2019, 07:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Kobie View Post
Two of my close friends pretty much summed up the problem to me pretty clearly.

One is a Dentist and the other a Oral Surgeon.

Getting your Degree is just the beginning of the process,YOU have to apply what you've learned to become successful and that's hard work also.

There seems to be a Delusion nowadays that just because you have a Degree you are automatically guaranteed everything.

I became a Carpenter because I can take pride in what I build,I feel good at the end of the day,Sure I could do other things that I could make more $$$ but...

It took years to get good enough to make real money

Success is relative

Feeling like a Adult is a inside job,You just know when you become a Man by the way you handle life's problems not by you assets.
Amen!
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