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Do prayers work?

 
Old 05-13-2019, 01:13 AM
  #281  
Zrxmax
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Originally Posted by FourPennyDoug View Post
Yes tongue in cheek to point out the irony. Fast's style of putting folks on his witness stand and rattling off questions is nothing new and he's established a pattern of this pious position.

I simply offered an objective metric.

"Faith without works is dead".... ring a bell?

The guy up on pedestal preaching to the "anti-god" guy actually hasn't preached Jesus as much as the "atheist" he's preaching to. It's classic self ownage irony. Lol
In an attempt to steer this dialog back to the answer to the question... "Does Prayer Work?" And, in the flavor of your bolded words above...

I take it "faith" could be construed as belief... and "work" could be construed as taking action by praying. If it rings a bell in your estimation,

then... I can only assume you are implying prayer works... or... to say it a bit more broadly... every thought matters... What do you say about that Doug?
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Old 05-13-2019, 01:38 AM
  #282  
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Originally Posted by pologreen1 View Post
Based on another thread, I am curious who has prayed for something they had no control over and it came to fruition?

Individual VS Group different?

What is the success rate?
have evolved more to the individual
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Old 05-13-2019, 02:05 AM
  #283  
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Originally Posted by Zrxmax View Post
In an attempt to steer this dialog back to the answer to the question... "Does Prayer Work?" And, in the flavor of your bolded words above...

I take it "faith" could be construed as belief... and "work" could be construed as taking action by praying. If it rings a bell in your estimation,

then... I can only assume you are implying prayer works... or... to say it a bit more broadly... every thought matters... What do you say about that Doug?
Fairly solid logic with the first part of steering it back to the question but you jumped the rails with your assumptions regarding if prayers work or not, and if thoughts matter.

Frankly, neither side has 100% certainty. Which dovetails me into, blessed are those who have not yet seen and still believe (I'm paraphrasing). My favorite story, "doubting Thomas".

Last edited by FourPennyDoug; 05-13-2019 at 02:44 AM.
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Old 05-13-2019, 02:52 AM
  #284  
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Originally Posted by FourPennyDoug View Post
Fairly solid logic with the first part of steering it back to the question but you jumped the rails with your assumptions regarding if prayers work or not, and if thoughts matter.

Frankly both sides of the argument are lacking proof. Which dovetails me into, blessed are those who have not yet seen and still believe (I'm paraphrasing). My favorite story, "doubting Thomas".
Frankly Doug... you are ignoring or rejecting the discoveries that have been brought out for the world to see through the study of Quantum physics.

You can only accept it if you dig through the data that has already been revealed on your own. Its unlikely some guy like me will ever convince you of anything.

My favorite story is the one being told right now... the evolution of science and the new discoveries that are coming are now in high gear.

The tools of science are now become other worldly in their capacity to reveal what can't be seen. Think Chandra telescope or CERN as just 2 examples of the progress made in scientific advancement.

Maybe you know why Einstein said "Imagination is more important than knowledge". Do you?
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Old 05-13-2019, 03:06 PM
  #285  
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Originally Posted by Zrxmax View Post
Frankly Doug... you are ignoring or rejecting the discoveries that have been brought out for the world to see through the study of Quantum physics.

You can only accept it if you dig through the data that has already been revealed on your own. Its unlikely some guy like me will ever convince you of anything.

My favorite story is the one being told right now... the evolution of science and the new discoveries that are coming are now in high gear.

The tools of science are now become other worldly in their capacity to reveal what can't be seen. Think Chandra telescope or CERN as just 2 examples of the progress made in scientific advancement.

Maybe you know why Einstein said "Imagination is more important than knowledge". Do you?
I think I hear your underlying message, I'm not as studied and enlightened as you. I'll try better next time so I have as much certainty as you.
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Old 05-13-2019, 03:18 PM
  #286  
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Originally Posted by Zrxmax View Post
Frankly Doug... you are ignoring or rejecting the discoveries that have been brought out for the world to see through the study of Quantum physics.

You can only accept it if you dig through the data that has already been revealed on your own. Its unlikely some guy like me will ever convince you of anything.

My favorite story is the one being told right now... the evolution of science and the new discoveries that are coming are now in high gear.

The tools of science are now become other worldly in their capacity to reveal what can't be seen. Think Chandra telescope or CERN as just 2 examples of the progress made in scientific advancement.

Maybe you know why Einstein said "Imagination is more important than knowledge". Do you?
No he isnít.

And Einstein wasnít talking about using your imagination to skirt around the laws regarding how science and the scientific method works.
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Old 05-13-2019, 08:11 PM
  #287  
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Originally Posted by FourPennyDoug View Post
I think I hear your underlying message, I'm not as studied and enlightened as you. I'll try better next time so I have as much certainty as you.
Flattery and or compliments are not recommended inside PR & C... Since comparing oneself with others isn't a worthwhile thing to do... I leave that to the bigger egos around here.

It also upsets the deniers of new scientific information. As for me... I am always looking for and fine tuning anything I find that

gives me an "edge" in pursuit of useful information that I can apply to my goals in life.

I am here to have fun and share whatever got me curious in the first place about many of the subjects we banter about here.

You can probably lap me a time or two on other subjects for I am learning new stuff everyday.
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Old 05-13-2019, 08:16 PM
  #288  
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Originally Posted by Sifu-TZ View Post
No he isnít.

And Einstein wasnít talking about using your imagination to skirt around the laws regarding how science and the scientific method works.
How do you know what Einstien implied when he said that?

Quantum physics has been with us since 1925... and... I also like the reliability of Newtonian laws.
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Old 05-13-2019, 09:36 PM
  #289  
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Originally Posted by Zrxmax View Post
How do you know what Einstien implied when he said that?

Quantum physics has been with us since 1925... and... I also like the reliability of Newtonian laws.
Einstein understood the principals of science, he wasnít implying any farcical X factors into equations.
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Old 05-15-2019, 01:48 PM
  #290  
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Originally Posted by Sifu-TZ View Post
Einstein understood the principals of science, he wasn’t implying any farcical X factors into equations.
Nobody said he was. You might consider the fact that the world of science and physics continues to evolve to higher levels of understanding.

Add to that the abilities of Edgar Cayce to diagnose people with health issues.

Last edited by Zrxmax; 05-15-2019 at 01:52 PM.
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:36 PM
  #291  
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Originally Posted by Zrxmax View Post
Nobody said he was. You might consider the fact that the world of science and physics continues to evolve to higher levels of understanding.

Add to that the abilities of Edgar Cayce to diagnose people with health issues.


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Old 05-15-2019, 02:47 PM
  #292  
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Just going to leave this right here...
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Old 05-15-2019, 05:31 PM
  #293  
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Prayer does work.. at least for me
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:31 PM
  #294  
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Originally Posted by shane p View Post
I love it when you spew that laugh... it tells me about the depth of your understanding.

When those investors from New York funded a new hospital for Cayce... what do you think they were thinking? That he was a fraud?
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Old 05-16-2019, 09:07 AM
  #295  
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Originally Posted by pauldana View Post
Prayer does work.. at least for me
That is good for you!

This is the crux of the subject matter we are discussing here...
What works for you works for YOU and we all have the luxury of choice in this country thanks to the vision of its founders.

Freedom OF religion includes freedom FROM religion. I don't get to impose my secular humanism on you and you don't get to impose whatever religion you subscribe to on me.

Nothing wrong with believing or not believing in the "power of prayer". If prayer works for you, that is awesome! However, we don't have as much control over our destinies as we would like to think. Prayers offer comfort. That is powerful. So I suppose the OP question should be "yes", prayers do work, as long as we understand the context of what prayer is truly about.
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Old 05-16-2019, 10:37 AM
  #296  
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Originally Posted by Zrxmax View Post
I love it when you spew that laugh... it tells me about the depth of your understanding.

When those investors from New York funded a new hospital for Cayce... what do you think they were thinking? That he was a fraud?

yes, he was a giant fraud. science doesn't take clairvoyant, holistic idiots seriously and no adult should either. how can you act like you're into science and yet drop this obvious chicanery on people?
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Old 05-16-2019, 11:47 AM
  #297  
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Originally Posted by Zrxmax View Post
I love it when you spew that laugh... it tells me about the depth of your understanding.

When those investors from New York funded a new hospital for Cayce... what do you think they were thinking? That he was a fraud?

Funny you should mention that.................................. Yes
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Old 05-16-2019, 12:52 PM
  #298  
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I'm sure this has probably already been said somewhere in this thread, but: studies have shown that prayer works at the same rate as random chance. So in other words, no, prayer does not work.
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Old 05-17-2019, 01:15 AM
  #299  
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Originally Posted by Sifu-TZ View Post
yes, he was a giant fraud. science doesn't take clairvoyant, holistic idiots seriously and no adult should either. how can you act like you're into science and yet drop this obvious chicanery on people?
I see the top deniers have chimed in with their opinions... hmmm... Interesting... I would think with all the new information that has come forward in the last 94 years you might have sampled a bit of it.

I would like to think you would have some curiosity about consciousness and consider how certain segments of humanity have transformed and uplifted their communities by burying the hatchet.

Its ok... you can stay right where you are at with the rest of the deniers and stay uninformed... its your choice.

Keep those calculators handy and try not to wear out the "divide" key... ok?
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Old 05-17-2019, 08:16 AM
  #300  
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Originally Posted by Zrxmax View Post
I see the top deniers have chimed in with their opinions... hmmm... Interesting... I would think with all the new information that has come forward in the last 94 years you might have sampled a bit of it.

I would like to think you would have some curiosity about consciousness and consider how certain segments of humanity have transformed and uplifted their communities by burying the hatchet.

Its ok... you can stay right where you are at with the rest of the deniers and stay uninformed... its your choice.

Keep those calculators handy and try not to wear out the "divide" key... ok?
Are you aware of the dichotomous nature of your replies? We watch you begin with making statements referencing scientific discovery, and then you run the opposite direction with pseudoscience and known charlatans.

You're covering a broad spectrum with some obvious holes in logic.
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