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Moon: Massive Anomaly Underneath

 
Old 06-12-2019, 12:12 PM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by Derrick Reynolds View Post
I think you should read a little more about that. Over time, the rotation of the Earth is slowing due to the action of the Moon. In a few billion years, the Earth will always show the same side to the Moon. It really is a thing that you only need Newtonian physics to explain. No need to call Einstein on this one.
Here's the silver lining to your dark cloud. If the moon weren't there to slow the early Earth's rotation and steady the axis inclination, we wouldn't be here in the first place. I don't GAS what the Earth's rotation rate is in "a few billion years" (a large asteroid or the sun will destroy the Earth anyway), it's at an ideal rate at the right time for complex life to flourish today.
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Old 06-12-2019, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by 69427 View Post
Here's the silver lining to your dark cloud. If the moon weren't there to slow the early Earth's rotation and steady the axis inclination, we wouldn't be here in the first place. I don't GAS what the Earth's rotation rate is in "a few billion years" (a large asteroid or the sun will destroy the Earth anyway), it's at an ideal rate at the right time for complex life to flourish today.

Yep - not an accident.
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Old 06-12-2019, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Red99SS View Post
The moon is a space station. The odds of having a moon that orbits at the perfect rate to always show us the same side and at the perfect distance to eclipse our sun perfectly is.... just not a thing. It's not a natural satellite. Somebody put it there.
Originally Posted by pdiddy972 View Post
His name is God.
God has an awesome engineering department.
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Old 06-12-2019, 12:33 PM
  #44  
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It is common for meteors or asteroids to be made mostly of iron. There's nothing odd in finding that maybe a billion years ago when there was a crap storm of stuff flying around the young solar system, a large asteroid or meteor impacted the moon and buried itself under the surface.

Interesting, but in the big scheme of things in the universe, actually pretty mundane.
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Old 06-12-2019, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by VETTRLZ View Post
It is common for meteors or asteroids to be made mostly of iron. There's nothing odd in finding that maybe a billion years ago when there was a crap storm of stuff flying around the young solar system, a large asteroid or meteor impacted the moon and buried itself under the surface.

Interesting, but in the big scheme of things in the universe, actually pretty mundane.
Iron in that location may turn out to be beyond price!
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Old 06-12-2019, 12:45 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by ifitgoesfast View Post
Years ago, an experiment was conducted to impact the Moon. The ringing persisted a lot linger than it should have.
I watched something on that once. It was the lunar lander I believe. They crashed it into the lunar surface and had seismometers on the surface to detect seismic waves associated with the collision. The scientists were shocked that the moon literally rang like a bell, as if it was hollow. They are still baffled at the data from that.
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Old 06-12-2019, 12:50 PM
  #47  
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IMHO I think we should have been mining the moon by now. The lunar regolith has titanium ore and helium 3. If this turns out to be an ancient metallic meteor then who know what kinds of metal are in there. It could be another good reason to go to the moon.
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Old 06-12-2019, 01:15 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by 69427 View Post
You're looking at the moon in a very shallow way. There's nothing common about the size of the moon compared to the size of the Earth, its size/distance being perfect for solar eclipse/Relativity research, and its ability to keep a steady tilt/inclination of the Earth (helping the survival of life on Earth), and a host of other factors. The size/orbital details of the moon and Earth are damn spot-on for life to form/exist in this solar system.

You would have to lack any understanding of astrophysics to not be awestruck at how well everything works to keep us alive.
The answer is all in math.. There are billions, maybe trillions of stars in billions of galaxies with trillions of planets, and maybe even millions and millions of planets circling their planets in the habitable zone. With such a huge amount of planets, the chance that everything falls into the right place is there. It is like winning in the lottery if you can fill out a millions of lottery tickets..
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Old 06-12-2019, 01:34 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by Red99SS View Post
The moon is a space station. The odds of having a moon that orbits at the perfect rate to always show us the same side and at the perfect distance to eclipse our sun perfectly is.... just not a thing. It's not a natural satellite. Somebody put it there.
It's an interesting relationship that has to deal with the rotation of the Earth and tides. While Earth exerts gravity on the moon, the moon also exerts gravity on the Earth. The force keeping the moon in orbit is countered by an equal and opposite force against the Earth.

I can't remember where I read it, but I was fascinated when I read it. We use planets and moons to "slingshot" satellites and space exploration vehicles in order to conserve fuel (delta-v, v for velocity). They have to take into consideration that the satellite being sling-shotted actually has an impact on the planet or moon that is propelling it. It can change a planet's orbit around the sun and/or it's rotational velocity ever so slightly. Part of that whole for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. This works with force too. The force speeding up that satellite / spacecraft has to come from somewhere, and that comes from the planet's rotation or orbital path. It's a very small amount, but it is definitely happening (we know because it accelerates the satellite/spacecraft). If done repeatedly, it could theoretically have a significant impact on the planet and its satellites, and who knows what that could lead to.

It's all very mind-boggling to think about.

Last edited by Vitoc; 06-12-2019 at 01:35 PM.
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Old 06-12-2019, 02:15 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by Vitoc View Post
It's an interesting relationship that has to deal with the rotation of the Earth and tides. While Earth exerts gravity on the moon, the moon also exerts gravity on the Earth. The force keeping the moon in orbit is countered by an equal and opposite force against the Earth.

I can't remember where I read it, but I was fascinated when I read it. We use planets and moons to "slingshot" satellites and space exploration vehicles in order to conserve fuel (delta-v, v for velocity). They have to take into consideration that the satellite being sling-shotted actually has an impact on the planet or moon that is propelling it. It can change a planet's orbit around the sun and/or it's rotational velocity ever so slightly. Part of that whole for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. This works with force too. The force speeding up that satellite / spacecraft has to come from somewhere, and that comes from the planet's rotation or orbital path. It's a very small amount, but it is definitely happening (we know because it accelerates the satellite/spacecraft). If done repeatedly, it could theoretically have a significant impact on the planet and its satellites, and who knows what that could lead to.

It's all very mind-boggling to think about.
His question isnít controversial. The perplexing one is when will the Moonís orbit either collide with or leave the Earth.
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Old 06-12-2019, 02:18 PM
  #51  
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Originally Posted by RJ-92 View Post
I watched something on that once. It was the lunar lander I believe. They crashed it into the lunar surface and had seismometers on the surface to detect seismic waves associated with the collision. The scientists were shocked that the moon literally rang like a bell, as if it was hollow. They are still baffled at the data from that.
Given this news of a massive unknown material or metallic object, may that contribute to the ringing?
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Old 06-12-2019, 02:20 PM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by ifitgoesfast View Post
His question isnít controversial. The perplexing one is when will the Moonís orbit either collide with or leave the Earth.
Collision will happen in an estimated 65 Billion years.
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Old 06-12-2019, 02:23 PM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by Ruz View Post
Collision will happen in an estimated 65 Billion years.
Who wins, larger rocky ice mass, or slightly smaller metallic/unknown object/core?
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Old 06-12-2019, 02:26 PM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by GrandSportC3 View Post
Material from an Asteroid that hit the moon long long time ago.. Unlike on earth, asteroids don't burn up over the moon as it doesn't have an atmosphere, so if a comet hits, the material of the Asteroid will embed itself in the moon.. Would be interesting to see the composition of that material..
From the links, thatís only a suggestion.

If a body that massive and dense hit the Moon, we would not have a Moon. At best, a belt as most would be ejected outward.
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Old 06-12-2019, 02:29 PM
  #55  
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The asteroid belt between Mars and Jupiter is anomalous because the planets have a somewhat consistent arrangement but with a wide gap between Mars and Jupiter.


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Old 06-12-2019, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by ifitgoesfast View Post
From the links, thatís only a suggestion.

If a body that massive and dense hit the Moon, we would not have a Moon. At best, a belt as most would be ejected outward.
Not necessarily.. If you look at Dwarf Planet Ceres, the Occator Catar is about 90 miles across and Ceres is significantly smaller than our moon, so it survived such huge impact..
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Old 06-12-2019, 02:53 PM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by GrandSportC3 View Post
The answer is all in math.. There are billions, maybe trillions of stars in billions of galaxies with trillions of planets, and maybe even millions and millions of planets circling their planets in the habitable zone. With such a huge amount of planets, the chance that everything falls into the right place is there. It is like winning in the lottery if you can fill out a millions of lottery tickets..
Your lack of understanding the actual math regarding the probability that "everything" falls into place is evident. Depending on which source you use, the probability that everything falls into place correctly ranges from one chance in 10^220, or down to one chance in 10^500. Take your figure of billions of galaxies, and subtract about 94% of that due to those galaxies being too young or the wrong configuration (too much interstellar radiation in those galaxies).

But for amusement, assume every galaxy out there was the right type galaxy. Your trillions of stars in billions of galaxies times 10 planets per star gets you a total of 10^22 planets. 10^22 planets divided by 10^220 (the most optimistic chance of complex life), gets you a 1 in 10^198 chance of finding an acceptable planet for complex life. For comparison, I've read there's only about 10^80 nucleons in the observable universe.

When understood correctly, the answer is indeed all in the math.
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Old 06-12-2019, 02:56 PM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by ifitgoesfast View Post
Who wins, larger rocky ice mass, or slightly smaller metallic/unknown object/core?
Neither will win as they currently exist. As it will not be like an asteroid hurling at the planet, they will more than likely meld together. There will probably be an ejection of matter from both of them, but the gravity of the two (now one) object(s) will keep the pieces close and eventually pull them back in to form one object roughly double in mass.
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Old 06-12-2019, 02:58 PM
  #59  
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Originally Posted by ifitgoesfast View Post
His question isnít controversial. The perplexing one is when will the Moonís orbit either collide with or leave the Earth.
I wasn't answering a question. I was responding directly to Red's comment, which I quoted.

That said, why do you think the Moon has to collide or leave Earth's orbit? Most orbits outside of the atmosphere are pretty stable. The moon is well outside our atmosphere. The Earth's mass and the moon's mass are, for the most part, stable. Without some other major factor involved, there's no reason to assume the moon is going to leave Earth's orbit or crash into the Earth.
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Old 06-12-2019, 03:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Vitoc View Post
I wasn't answering a question. I was responding directly to Red's comment, which I quoted.

That said, why do you think the Moon has to collide or leave Earth's orbit? Most orbits outside of the atmosphere are pretty stable. The moon is well outside our atmosphere. The Earth's mass and the moon's mass are, for the most part, stable. Without some other major factor involved, there's no reason to assume the moon is going to leave Earth's orbit or crash into the Earth.
The moon is moving away from the Earth a little bit each year.
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