Picture of a bad roller lifter.
 

It's sad to say that I left a set of rollers in to long. I drove it hard for nearly 20,000 miles. With .635/.644 and 195# closed pressure. I have the rev limiter at 7000.
The barings are gone in the roller and the Custom cam lobe looks pitted the same. It's motor pull time. Crane cams said they would get me another custom SR cam and lifters set for half price. That's still $400 something and i have to tear the whole motor a part. I think I need something more than that


What can I do when talking to Crane Cams?

https://temp.corvetteforum.net/c3/gkull/badroller.jpg

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (gkull)
 

that sucks...

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (gkull)
 

gkull, Sorry to see that. It's the price we pay to make big power. I just wiped out a lobe on my Crane Solid last week. :mad I didn't even get 2000 miles on mine. What's up with Crane? There a great company, but recently I've herd of more off the shelf failures. Perhaps it has to due with the quality of steel. Anyway, I went with a Cam Motion custom grind. I'm in the process of pulling my 427. Not fun, but making the best of it.
:flag

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (gkull)
 

George,
That sucks! While were in the subject of roller cams and lifters; isn't there a shortage of roller lifters due to one of the major roller cam manufactures going out of business? I was told the tolerance or so critical that they are a expensive to manufacture.
Dan

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (vettedan)
 

Dan. It's only H-rollers in short supply.

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (vettedan)
 

Oh, I would be pissed, and it sounds like you are too. :mad

I would go after Crane, to replace them at no cost. there stuff should have lasted longer than that.


Soooo! are you going to do more HP with the unfortunate tear down????? :D

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (vettedan)
 

I asked this when I ordered my solid roller cam and lifters from Crane. I think it was TRW and or Federal Mogal that went out of business because of all the asbestos related law suits. They are part of companies once connected to asbestos so they are now being held responsible for the judgments. This ambulance chasing racket regarding asbestos really has gotten out of hand.

Anyway, Crane said that these were mostly the hydraulic lifters. Crane said they make their own solid roller lifters in house. By the way, do any of you guys know what the difference is or would be between the part #13542-16 Pro Roller lifters I got and the apparently newer #13556-16 Pro Rollers made of 8620 steel other than the $200 higher price? The Crane catalog still lists the lifters I got as the best ones for the #138601 cam I got. Is the higher grade 8620 steel used in both the roller and the body? Does my cheaper lifter use the 8620 steel in the roller if not the body? I believe my new roller cam is made of the 8620 steel.

I can't see as much of an advantage of the higher grade steel in the body as I would in the roller itself.

Your thoughts and input are greatly appreciated!

Chuck

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (Chuck Harmon)
 

George,

By the way, I thought your were running Comp Cam roller lifters? If you were using the Crane lifters, were they the Pro series?

Chuck

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (gkull)
 

It looks like you have the same failure that I had on my lifter, but mine was BB Crane roller with .680/.708 lift, 160 closed pressure. The bearing was also gone in my case.

It was the damper spring that was broke and I think the roller must have bounce on the loob and then caused the bearing failure. Maybe the case for you also?

I have teared the engine now and will rebuild it with new cam, hydralic rollers, pushrods etc, as soon as the machine-shop has done the block, rods, heads and balanced the rotating assembly. Ready to run in April??

Good luck with your rebuild. :steering:


[Modified by Lasse, 1:02 PM 2/23/2003]

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (gkull)
 

You're fortunate to have caught it when you did. I ran an aggressive solid roller several years ago and didn't catch it until catastrophic failure. That is the price for solid rollers: they make great power, but don't last long on the street. I accept this and treat roller lifters as a consummable item. I pull the intake every year to inspect the lifters (replace as necessary) and keep a very close watch on lash.

This is what makes the Schubeck radius lifter so attractive: no moving parts to fail and cause havoc when they do fail. I'm very curious to see how Schubeck lifters perform on the street.

Good luck talking w/ Crane, although I don't think you'll get any additional remuneration. My only beef with cam companies and solid rollers is they don't make it well known the true limitations of a solid roller cam in a street application. None of them hide the fact when speaking with them, but they don't exacty broadcast this information on their catalogs, websites and brochures.

Good luck,

Mark

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (gkull)
 

George, that is a bummer but you were very lucky on catching it when you did! On the other hand I'm surprised you got that many miles with the roller cam. When I was racing big Fords my engine Guru would check each roller EVERY season and was of the opinion they were a replaceable item as in using aluminum rods. Roller lifters are heavy and the spring pressures are high...great for what they are designed for but longevity is appearantly lacking. We feel for you bud, no one likes having to do an unscheduled engine overhaul :cry
Deen

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (DeenHylton)
 

George,

I know we've discussed this before but I forget, were you running restrictors? If so, what size?

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (Chuck Harmon)
 

(QUOTE):
I asked this when I ordered my solid roller cam and lifters from Crane. I think it was TRW and or Federal Mogal that went out of business because of all the asbestos related law suits. They are part of companies once connected to asbestos so they are now being held responsible for the judgments. This ambulance chasing racket regarding asbestos really has gotten out of hand. (END QUOTE)


While it is true that Federal Mogul is going through re-organization because of asbestos liabilites it has absolutey nothing to do with the hydraulic lifter shortage.

The information below is copied from a post I made last Spring
(QUOTE)
This is what I know of the lifter shortage.
This situation is the result of several unprecedented events in the
North American manufacturing base for valve lifters (tappets).

1. In late 2001, Eaton Corp. ceased production of flat tappets.
Stanadyne Corp. acquired the Eaton business and has been
transitioning this manufacturing capacity into its existing
operations. This has led to a disruption of supply.

2. Hy-Lift Corp. ceased production of valve lifters as of April 11,
2002. Hy-Lift has been a major supplier to Federal-Mogul and the
Sealed Power product line.

3. Another major manufacturer, based in Mexico, announced that it would
discontinue valve lifter production effective June 1, 2002.

This extreme consolidation and contraction of production operations has
severely impacted the remaining valve lifter manufacturers' ability to meet market demand.

I also have learned that the supply is not estimated to stabilize until late June at the earlyest. I would not be suprised to see the shortage actually go longer.
(END QUOTE)

Sorry, but I am a little sensitive to incorrect information being mentioned about the company that I have made a career with, plus allows me to pay my bills and stay in my house.

In reading the info. about the shortage you can see that the industry had forcasted that the supply and demand of lifters would stabilize by early summer 2002. It looks like someone needed a better crystal ball.

John.

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (gkull)
 

George I have a new set of Crane mech roller lifters to go into my new engine. What is the expected lifespan of the bearings in these lifters, did Crane say anything about the 20K on them ? BTW, my cam lift will be in the same neighborhood as what you're running :D .

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (gkull)
 

I'd say you got your moneys worth out of those lifters. 20k miles is a lot for that kind of hardware. I had a Crane lifter die like that once. Now I know better. :yesnod: Did you say you were going to run on the salt? When? Sounds interesting.

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (Racer16k)
 

I still don't understand why the sollid rollers have to wear out so quickly. My crane Pro series lifters weigh within 1 gram of the standard mechanical lifter, 100 grams. The vertical connecting bar bar weighs a total of 10 grams, so at most this only adds 5 grams to each lifter. My 7/16th's push rods vs. the 3/8th's should account for a greater difference. For illustration, a typical business card weighs 1 gram.

Chuck

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (Metal_Wulf)
 

:withstupid:

George, I know you drive that bad boy pretty hard, but that just doesn't seem like much longetivity. Good grief!

Re: Picture of a bad roller lifter. (Chuck Harmon)
 

I’m not sure of what custom profile I ended up with. It’s fairly aggressive with very steep nose and max time at max lift with a more gentile down ramp to set the valve on the seat without a bounce.

Monty – I don’t remember the oil restrictor sizes that I used but they are all coming out. I have a real mix of parts Crane cam and Pro lifters. Comp cams .200 over 80 hardened pushrods. 1.65 Crower steel intakes rockers and 1.6 Comp cams exhaust


Ml67 - Quote:This is what makes the Schubeck radius lifter so attractive: no moving parts to fail and cause havoc when they do fail. I'm very curious to see how Schubeck lifters perform on the street.

I looked into those lifters and the only thing that held me back was the $1200 price tag. Maybe they are a good deal after all.:)

Smoked tires - The lifters might have lasted allot longer if I hadn't put in oil restrictors to the top end. I had enough spring pressure to ensure that I never had valve float. But aggressive cams just beat stuff up.

Racer16K - My simple goal is to run out at the Salt flats. I really need 3.90 gearing instead of my 4.11 for long trips. I can't picture a 700R4 with 4.56 like your's.

Merlin 522 - I spent some time on DD2000 figuring out my next cam. Part of me say's to bring the duration up a little because my max power and TQ is at to low of RPM. But I also am looking at just juggling the cam event number with what I have and ask for increased lift. It's a training exercise so I don't forget how to tear down the motor!