Michelin Pilot Sport 4S
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08-01-2017, 03:30 PM
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Red,
I disagree, and I do have a lot of direct experience because I've now switched between PSS ZPs and PS AS3+ non-ZPs twice now in the last 6 months. Each time I've done back-to-back, spirited runs, on a 10 mile loop on the twisty country roads around my house. Some are a little rough, some are smooth. The first test was done at 50º last November, and the 2nd was done in 85º temps this past May.
In terms of ride-quality only, there is not a huge perceptible difference, but the non-ZPs are just slightly softer. However, one caveat here, is that my car has a DSC Sport MSRC Controller installed, which is far superior to the OEM controller in terms of both ride comfort and handling.
I much prefer ZPs for all kinds of reasons, and the only reason I ended up w/ a non-ZP set of AS3+ was that there was a long delay getting the ZP version when they first came out. I wish at had the ZPs, but I needed them right away because I drive my car summer and winter.
It is simply inaccurate to say that the softer sidewall allows the car to "handle" better. If anything that compromises handling when driving in a spirited fashion. The softer sidewall would only help w/ ride-quality, but the difference is not all that perceptible. Since the PS4S is also a max performance summer tire, I don't think the sidewall is as soft as you think it is
Only those who are uninformed or w/ out-dated biases call them "run craps" anymore, and I'll give you the benefit of doubt and place you in the latter category.
I disagree, and I do have a lot of direct experience because I've now switched between PSS ZPs and PS AS3+ non-ZPs twice now in the last 6 months. Each time I've done back-to-back, spirited runs, on a 10 mile loop on the twisty country roads around my house. Some are a little rough, some are smooth. The first test was done at 50º last November, and the 2nd was done in 85º temps this past May.
In terms of ride-quality only, there is not a huge perceptible difference, but the non-ZPs are just slightly softer. However, one caveat here, is that my car has a DSC Sport MSRC Controller installed, which is far superior to the OEM controller in terms of both ride comfort and handling.
I much prefer ZPs for all kinds of reasons, and the only reason I ended up w/ a non-ZP set of AS3+ was that there was a long delay getting the ZP version when they first came out. I wish at had the ZPs, but I needed them right away because I drive my car summer and winter.
It is simply inaccurate to say that the softer sidewall allows the car to "handle" better. If anything that compromises handling when driving in a spirited fashion. The softer sidewall would only help w/ ride-quality, but the difference is not all that perceptible. Since the PS4S is also a max performance summer tire, I don't think the sidewall is as soft as you think it is
Only those who are uninformed or w/ out-dated biases call them "run craps" anymore, and I'll give you the benefit of doubt and place you in the latter category.
I was amazed at how much better they performed than the GYs and run flat Vs non run flat didn't enter into the equation.
20 years later run flat technology has reached the point where there is no real performance difference as far as 99% of drivers can tell. The only difference to avoid run flats is if you can't afford the cost. I get a kick out of the people who think a flat is easily fixable alongside the road. If you get a flat in a left rear tire your only chance of plugging it is to have access from the front or rear of the tire which means you will be partially under the car, laying alongside the road with traffic going by 2 or 3 ft from your body. Add rain and night time and you would be a fool to attempt doing that. Much easier and less costly to have a run flat that you can drive about as far as you want at reasonable speed to get to a place where the tire can be replaced at a minimum.
Bill
#2
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What Choice?
We mounted 4s' a month ago. The PS/2 is no longer being made. Maybe a few sitting around still. But why buy the old news? Not a tire engineer, but Michelin is. So I'll be impressed that they kissed these babies.
#3
Drifting
As I mentioned in another thread, they didn't stand up under track use. I just replaced fronts (back ones didn't have a problem so far), bad ones sent to Michelin. If these replacements also have problems, then I'd avoid them.
#4
Every new car coming out of Bowling Green has PSS ZPs on it, and they are still in stock at all suppliers. They have to come from somewhere.
#5
Race Director
Thread Starter
PSS runs flats are still available. Discount Tire can't get the rear non run flats in my size and Big O has to special order them, driving the price up.
That is why I'm considering the PS 4S
That is why I'm considering the PS 4S
#6
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Thread Starter
I don't track the car. Was that your review on the Michelin site?
#7
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Wowee Zowee Batman
Thanks for getting me on the right track.
#8
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Number 1
Discount just called. The PSS's are ordered and in next week. They will mount them with full credit for the 4s set. Reasons to use Discount. Customer service is number one.
#9
Drifting
No, I was going to see if the replacements also did it to confirm if there's some intrinsic issue with PS4S or this was a one time thing. But I just looked at the review you mentioned and obviously its not a one time thing, so I just added my own review confirming what that other person was saying.
Last edited by Jay_Davis; 07-22-2017 at 03:50 PM.
#10
I called our Discount, the guy told me PSS were no longer available. He told me the 4s was the exact replacement. Truth, I assumed he knew what he was talking about and ordered the 4s. I pulled our Discount Tire invoice and kaboom, the tires they swore were the correct replacements are not ZP. Seems everyone knows that except my Discount Store and me. Me until now. Just talked with the mgr and he is working on it. Told him if BG is building cars with Michelin ZPs even as we speak, they have to be available from some source. Maybe he could find them from Tire Rack. Ouch was the silence on the other end of the line.
Thanks for getting me on the right track.
Thanks for getting me on the right track.
EDIT: I see your Discount Tire guy finally got straightened out. Good on them for running it down.
Last edited by Foosh; 07-22-2017 at 04:50 PM. Reason: New info
#11
Racer
Yes, I just replaced all four with the new PS/4's. Went with a 295 in the rear (Z51). I opted for the NON runflats. Much better ride...smoother, more comfortable.
Handling is difficult to tell...they seem like the old tires, but a more comfortable ride. I like the way the 295's fill out the rear well area. They are about 0.5" wider.
I submitted a post regarding the new PS/4's and Carbotech's brake pads...please read and see pics.
Here's the post New Michelin PS/4's and update on Carbotech's Brake Pads with pics
Semper Fi
Last edited by Former USMC; 07-22-2017 at 07:27 PM.
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ZorenZ51 (07-22-2017)
#12
If you are looking to replace your MPSS, I suggest you consider the Bridgestone S-04. I found them a great improvement in ride quality. Handling equal. Understand the S-04 is not a run-flat which is why they ride better. IMHO a a big improvement.
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Former USMC (07-22-2017)
#13
Replaced my ZPtires with 4S with size 255 front and 305 rears.
Ride quality, comfort and road noise far much better than the ZPs.
Ride quality, comfort and road noise far much better than the ZPs.
#14
Race Director
Thread Starter
I pulled trigger on the PS 4S's. Non run-flats, at Discount Tire.
Discount Tire (price paid)
Fronts 245-40-18 $195/tire
Rears 285-35-19 $312/tire
We compared TireRack (tires + delivery), to Discount Tire (tires + sales tax). TireRack was $70 less, so Discount Tire beat them by $10, and did an $80 discount.
OTD $1,200.65
Discount Tire (price paid)
Fronts 245-40-18 $195/tire
Rears 285-35-19 $312/tire
We compared TireRack (tires + delivery), to Discount Tire (tires + sales tax). TireRack was $70 less, so Discount Tire beat them by $10, and did an $80 discount.
OTD $1,200.65
Last edited by RedC7AZ; 07-24-2017 at 03:12 PM.
#16
Ditto
#17
Race Director
Thread Starter
Enjoying the new Pilot Sport 4S non run-flats.
Smooth and the car handles great. I highly recommend them. Nice step up from any of the run craps.
Smooth and the car handles great. I highly recommend them. Nice step up from any of the run craps.
Last edited by RedC7AZ; 08-01-2017 at 08:34 AM.
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ZorenZ51 (08-01-2017)
#18
Melting Slicks
Replaced my MPSS ZP's with 4S's earlier in the year. Car gets ragged regularly on the street and at AutoX. Ride quality has improved on the street and lateral grip hasn't fallen off. AutoX there has been a good improvement over the runflats, I don't have solid data yet but they certainly make me feel more confident in the car on course and are pulling higher peak G numbers on my datalogs.
Last edited by SK360; 08-01-2017 at 10:53 AM.
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911Hunter (04-05-2018)
#19
When someone uses the term "run craps" to refer to today's ZP technology, that's an indication they're stuck in the past.
Has anyone ever said, the new tires they just switched to are not a "huge improvement?" Placebo effect . . .
Has anyone ever said, the new tires they just switched to are not a "huge improvement?" Placebo effect . . .
Last edited by Foosh; 08-01-2017 at 10:25 AM.
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blue max (08-06-2017)
#20
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Since there is no spare, I will always have ZP tires on my car. My wife drives the car.
End of discussion.
Elmer
End of discussion.
Elmer