ShadowB

I have 650 miles on my 17’ GS I want to get the alignment checked before I put too many more miles on it. Can anyone tell me what a good range is for the C-7? I understand the factory range is pretty wide so like to get it out of the track set up. I have read here on CF where Toe should be 0 to - .01 and Camber is slightly negative. My C-6 realignment the front & rear Toes are right at 0 and the Cambers are around -.04 and that seems good for that car, would that be close or optimal for the C-7? Any insight is appreciated.

MMD

Foosh

Start w/ the link below.

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...alignment.html

There are dozens of other similar threads, and a search on "C7 Alignment" will give you enough reading material for many hours. It's become a controversial topic here, and spirited drivers prefer a different spec than those who do primarily lazy highway cruising.

GM specs are for best handling performance. "Sunday cruisers" want an alignment setting that produces max tire wear and are less concerned with best handling performance.

ShadowB

Thanks Foosh, went to the link you provided and looked at the PDF you posted. It’s what I was looking for. I don’t plan on tracking it maybe an occasional Claw run so your pdf is helpful and in line with my thoughts.

Foosh

My car was set up w/ the street/occasional DSC specs, it handles like it's on rails, both straight-line and "twisties", and I had perfectly even tire wear across the tread block of my original OEM PSS after 15K miles.

ShadowB

Sounds good, I didn't mind wearing out the GY F1s on the C-6 but will try to get a few more miles on these. I know it’s relative to a lot of factors but I’ll try lol.

Foosh

Also BTW, I'd wait until 1-1.5K miles before having the alignment done, so everything has "settled." Also make sure the shop you go to has the tool to set rear caster properly (part # on DSC spec sheet). That is very important! What the rear end is doing has a huge effect on what's happening up front.

A performance alignment shop will probably be your best bet, but it has been reported here that some dealers have the tool, and know how to do it.

PatternDayTrader

I'm a big proponent of the zero camber set up for street cars. Tires last longer, less driver input is required at the steering wheel, and the overall driving experience is more pleasurable. But, none of that applies to a car that is being pushed hard in corners, especially on a track. In fact, there is zero doubt that an experienced driver will consistently cut faster lap times with a setup similar to that which is suggested by DSC.
So, in my opinion, that's really kind of how people should be looking at this issue. Set the car up like a normal car if your going to drive it like a normal car. Set it up like a track car if your going to drive it like a track car. Split the difference if your going to do both, and lean in the direction that is most important to you, because if you remove the tire wear issue, then this entire subject becomes a matter of personal preference.

Foosh

You have no basis for saying there is "less driver input required at the steering wheel, and the over all driving experience is more pleasurable" with 0º camber. It's way more complex than that.

However, I do find your above words to be true of my car set to DSC specs even when "Sunday cruising." I can drive essentially "hand's off" the wheel in a straight-line setting. You've never set your car up to the DSC specs, including rear caster setting, so you have no idea.

The problem with all of these threads is reports are coming from people who are using who knows what specs from the factory or from alignment shops that do very crude alignments having no idea how to check or set rear caster or other settings precisely.

I've published my exact specs, and it's not just about the front camber setting, it's multi-dimensional specs on all 4 corners working together. I've also religiously measured tire wear and had completely even wear in 15K miles. You haven't done that, and I don't recall many others having done so either.

I have no doubts that people w/ cars from the factory are having tire wear and handling issues. The crude factory alignments are all over the map. My car was WAY OFF from the factory before taking it to DSC. The blame lies not w/ GM specs, but the fact that many cars from the factory often aren't set to GM specs.

PatternDayTrader

I'm sure you don't have an issue on perfect or nearly perfect road surfaces, but whatever Foosh.
It seems you just want to argue about this as opposed to really have an intelligent discussion. I honestly don't know why either. You already admitted (in the other thread) you sometimes go around corners at 60mph, and your even sitting in a car wearing a helmet in your avatar. Obviously you are not the typical driver. Your preferences are not going to be typical. This is obvious. By the way, nothing mechanical that I do, is crude, and ive been very clear about the specs I use. It seems to me that you just don't like what I'm saying because it doesn't fit your driving style, or maybe you just want to promote DSC.

PS - I haven't commented on DSCs castor specs because I don't disagree with them.

Foosh

I'm happy to have an intelligent discussion, but when someone makes a broad sweeping generalization like "overall driving experience is better" (at 0º camber) which I know to be false, and without any back-up, it's not possible to do so.

Also BTW, the road conditions in the DC Metro area are among the worst in the US.

At any rate, I'm not going engage you in another debate. Informed folks will be able to make up their own minds based upon the content both here and on the other thread.

PatternDayTrader

Heres my backup. An entire career as a professional auto tech. You know, someone who has to do mechanical things to make people happy. You could also say I have arrived at my conclusions because I know what it takes to make people happy with their cars. Again, you might not like the way a car feels with zero camber, but your driving style is in the minority.

PatternDayTrader

Just for fun, if you have contacts over at DSC, ask them what they would do for a street only set up. The pdf you provided says "occasional track use". So what do they recommend for zero track use ? I'm sure they will say the same thing but maybe not. It would be interesting to find out.

Foosh

We're talking about C7s here, not Kias.

Read the DSC PDF, which clearly specifies "street/occasional track" specs. Just for the record, and I did ask, that is the recommended street-only spec for the C7.

PatternDayTrader

Lol ...

Tell me who to call over at DSC and give me their number.

CADbrian

Thanks Foosh. I checked out your PDF (printed it too) because I know some day I'll want this information. And I saw your post about waiting for 1k-1.5k miles before doing any alignment check. That's good info too.

PatternDayTrader

Ok so I see you were making an edit while I was responding.

So if that is their "street only" spec then I ask again, what is it about the c7 suspension that is so unique it needs to be set up with so much negative camber?
No one who is being intellectually honest is going to argue that a car driving down the road with its weight riding on the inside edges of its tires, is somehow better than if its weight is evenly distributed across the entire contact patch. No one.
Now that being said, its not impossible for there to be a reason, and if that's the case then someone should be able to state it clearly and in unambiguous terms.

MMD

:

Foosh

LOL . . . yeah, that -1.2º camber (.06%) weight shift really transfers a lot of weight to the inside when sitting still. Actually, coupled with slightly positive toe, and all the positive caster, it most likely produces a more even weight distribution on the contact patch.

PatternDayTrader

That's not an answer at all, its deflection combined with an admission.
Its an honest question, it deserves a legit answer.
BTW neither toe or castor have the effect you are implying.