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I'm changing the lifters on my 96 LT1 and on the side with the noise I found a lifter whose roller is kinda beat up. I've attached a few pictures. Is this a major problem?
I don't think I have the ability to pull the cam shaft and I'm wondering if this will be ok with just a lifter change.
that engine needs to come apart. it's hard to diagnose just from looking at that lifter. I want to see the cam too. pushrod rocker arm and inside of the oil filter also
The cam doesn't look as bad from what I can see both with a flashlight and borescope. I finished pulling all of the other lifters and they're all smooth with no marks. Pushrod looked ok but I will pull it again and also examine the rocker. Not sure what to do at this point. If the camshaft needs to come out then I'll need to send it out to be done.
I pulled it apart again. The rocker looks ok as well as the pushrod. Both do not appear to be damaged. I looked again at the cam it definitely has some marks but it's no where as bad as the lifter. Not sure what to do from here or what caused this. Any further advice would be greatly appreciated..
Just replacing the lifter is a bandaid. It will just destroy the new lifter in a short time. A worse case would be the cam breaks and who knows what else. Sorry but you, at the least, need a camshaft and lifters.
Just replacing the lifter is a bandaid. It will just destroy the new lifter in a short time. A worse case would be the cam breaks and who knows what else. Sorry but you, at the least, need a camshaft and lifters.
Not one of the people above that are advocating changing the camshaft have SEEN the affected cam lobes. Neither have I. But you say "not as bad as the lifter roller" and there are only two affected lifters and lobes. Roller lifter cam lobes are very tough. I can't tell you why two rollers fretted like that, but there are several possibilities that wouldn't necessarily affect the cam lobes. You say you don't feel confident that you can change the cam yourself. You are looking at a lot of money to have a shop or specialist do it for you. Personally, I think its worth the gamble to put lifters in it and run it. What ever prompted you to look at the lifters this time (noisy rockers?) would probably happen again to alert you to the repair didn't last. If you don't intend to keep it too much longer, I'd fix it and drive it. If it gets noisy again, you cold consider selling it at a reduced price reflective of what the repairs would have cost you.
I had a very noisy lifter in my DD S-10. They were Chinese white-box roller lifters that I put in it when I reconditioned the engine 125K miles earlier. When I pulled the bad lifter, the roller's axle pin had come loose and had broached the side of the bore to a depth of about 100 thou. Two other lifters also had loose pins, but hadn't gouged the bores. I replaced all of them, and I'm still driving it 10,000 miles later with no further lifter noises or issues. My point is that I know there is some damage, but I chose to ignore it. So far, I made the correct choice. The alternative whas to replace the engine. Not going to happen on a 29 year old truck with 345,000 miles on it.
There's more to deciding what you need to do other than the damage. You could be facing $3,000+++ to replace the cam. You could also replace the lifters yourself and drive it for years with no further lifter problems. I know what I'd do.
I'm not disagreeing with you. But after having two cams go flat on me with seemingly less damage, I trust nothing anymore. The one cam I almost reused the lifters because they were fine but the amount of metal in the oil made me chuck them.
Chances are the roller itself had a metal defect and it pitted and broke down like that for whatever reason. Is the cam fine? Probably. But I've had it go the other way twice now. If you can pull the oil pan, see if there is metal shavings in the bottom. If not, I'd probably run it without too much worry.
With cratering and pitting like that, it is a certainty that metal fragments have hit the oil. Has it got to the main and rod bearings ? Who can say. Did it get to the cam bearings ? Once again, who knows.
Take a sharp pencil and stick it down the lifter bore and feel the camshaft lobe. Don't break it off of course, just use it to feel the surface. Graphite won't hurt and you would be surprised at how a pencil will transmit roughness back to your fingers. I used this method years ago when feeling surface finishes when I did precision machine work. After a while, you get a "feel". In this case you will be able to feel if there are raised deposits on the cam lobe, cratering, etc.
Have you looked a the other lobes? (the ones NOT making noise)
I've seen lifters go south like that from excessive spring seat pressure, AND I've seen it from loose components (collapsed lifter, loose rocker, bent pushrod)
With cratering and pitting like that, it is a certainty that metal fragments have hit the oil. Has it got to the main and rod bearings ? Who can say. Did it get to the cam bearings ? Once again, who knows.
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I would think that the oil filter would have trapped most if not all of the small particles before they did any damage.
I have seen many cam lobe failures and most of the time the engine is fine.
I would think that the oil filter would have trapped most if not all of the small particles before they did any damage.
I have seen many cam lobe failures and most of the time the engine is fine.
Hence the who knows. The only way to know is to run it or take it apart. If it is just a locally driven car and not a daily driver, then drive it. Hopefully the particles are trapped in the oil filter, or sitting at the bottom of the pan.
After getting it fixed, I would change the oil twice. Once with el cheapo oil and a filter to just start it up, run a bit and then change it out again with good oil.
Thanks for the many replies. It’s only one lifter/lobe that’s damaged. The car has 60k miles and I commute in it in the summer about 150 miles per day.. It’s a convertible and in nice shape. I talked to a friend of mine who owns a shop and it looks like he’ll do it. They do a lot of engines and are known to be good. I’ve done a few engine rebuilds years ago but I don’t really have the time or patience to remove all the stuff up front and lift the engine to get the cam out. I’ll post an update once he looks at it.
One more thing. Assuming he says the cam needs to be changed does it make sense to just replace it with a stock cam. I don’t want to need to change the tune but a little more power would be nice.
GM claimed that on their pkg yrs ago. You can...but its better with one.
Really they did a good job with the LT4 pkg offering that cam with. Nice pkg that passes smog. Too bad some idiot designed an igition system next to water and a major heat source.
had they stuck a regualr distributor on them I bet their demand would be higher.
01-21-2019, 03:25 PM
Need Help. Lifter issue I this Bad?
as well. Better to be safe than sorry.
