VroomAB

So I learnt something this morning which I am not happy about. Would like opinions / advice from members here on what I should do.

I recently purchased a new 2017 torch red Z51 from a large dealership in the NorCal Bay Area (let's call them the "Selling Dealership"). Odometer had 8 miles on the car when new. At approximately 250 miles, car developed a rattle at idle - see the following post. Took it in to another very reputable dealer this morning to have the rattle checked out - let's call them the "Service Dealership".

When the Service Dealership pulled up my car VIN, they tell me that my car had a new engine installed at 7 miles by the Selling Dealership. The Selling Dealership did not disclose this information to me. I am worried about the long-term implications of a new engine installed when the car is essentially brand new.

Would appreciate some advice on what I should do at this stage. Thanks.

DWS44

Wow...that's crazy.

This should be interesting!

Snowwolfe

Go back to the selling dealership and demand they either replace it with a new car or they give you a free GM warranty good for 10 years and 100,000 miles.

muncie21

in for the ride and hopefully a good explanation

c54u

Just curious why you did not take your car to the selling dealership for service in the first place.

Black 03 Z06

Deception runs deep. I would be pissed.

VroomAB

Because the "Service Dealership" is considered to be the best dealership for service in the NorCal Bay Area.

VroomAB

Exactly.

ElGreco53

That sounds quite odd and I agree with snowwolfe, a trip back to the selling dealer is in order, regardless of the rattle problem. Perhaps a look into CA laws regarding this sort of transaction would be helpful. I would give the dealer a chance to make it right, and a replacement car seems reasonable, before a lawyer is contacted but that's just my POV. OTOH, Seems not disclosing it indicates something's not on the up-and-up, who knew what when and why didn't they make it known. Good luck and keep us in the loop!

Bill Dearborn

First, the selling dealership probably found a problem with the engine when the car was being delivered from the factory or when they did dealer prep. Anything that they find wrong at that time is fixed and the car is still considered new. Would you be all upset if you found out they replaced the power steering motor, the alternator, the AC compressor or the water pump? Replacing the engine is just replacing another component/module only larger. It is highly likely the sales people may not have known the engine was replaced. A replacement engine isn't any big deal on new or 10 to 20 year old cars. It might be a big deal on a 35+ year old collector car. If you don't plan on keeping the car long enough to find out whether or not it is a collectible vehicle I don't see why you should be bothered.

Bill

Foosh

I would also add to the above excellent post, that the same thing could have happened at the factory. After a car is produced, a defective engine can be found and replaced during the QC process at the factory. There is no obligation to disclose that type of situation, and no customer would ever know.

It sounds as if it was missed during the factory QC process, but the dealer found it.

I do understand your upset at such a record being in GMVIS, which might concern a future buyer. Such a record would not be there if the engine swap was done at the factory. Since it is a new car, it seems only fair that record be expunged from GMVIS, and I would press for that. At minimum, a new car should come w/ a clean maintenance record other than normal dealer prep.

RicK T

Bill Dearborn and all others present valid points on both sides of the issue.

Personally, I would like to know a new car I was buying had already had the engine replaced. Probably wouldn't make a difference to me but, you know, full disclosure.

Just to expand on Bill's points, engines do get replaced in new cars. Back when the '09 C6's were new they discovered 63 cars had to have the engines replaced due to the piston rings being installed incorrectly. A few cars were already in owners' hands, most were still in inventory. I don't recall anyone discussing that a dealer had disclosed the new engines in those cars prior to delivery. It isn't that big a deal and they probably stamped the correct VIN in your replacement engine like they did on those '09's.

I have to ask, did the Servicing Dealer diagnose and fix the rattle noise you took it in for?

Please keep us informed and we all hope you're happy no matter what happens.

VroomAB

Thanks. I do plan on keeping the car for 10+ years and hence am worried about long-term implications. California law - see here - requires the dealer to disclose material information to the buyer, which clearly they did not.

Vetteman Jack

This makes sense. If it bothers you, go speak with the selling dealer and see what is said. You can take it from there.

VroomAB

They think the rattling is coming from a check valve in the oil tank; they have ordered a new tank and should get installed next week

Carlos Thomas

I think you have a strong case here. This is not them replacing the steering wheel because of a defect. Replacing an engine is a major task.

With that being said, who is the service dealer you recommend? I am trying to find out who the best is, so they can work on my car when needed. Feel free to PM me if you don't want to disclose on the main forum.

Foosh

Appears to me that the CA statute you cited does apply and was violated. It certainly is material information, which was not disclosed to you, and it appears in the GMVIS record.

I would not be worried about the long-term implications if you plan to keep the car past the warranty period. They replaced a new, defective engine, hopefully with a new perfectly functioning engine. You've got 5 years or 60K miles (whichever comes first), to assess the health of the new engine, and any material defects will more than likely show up long before then.

One other note is that you run this kind of risk with every new car and new engine. They don't have a history, haven't been operated much, and a certain very small percentage of new parts is always defective no matter what the industry. The same thing could have happened at 50 miles, and it would have been handled under warranty as every other new car is.

VroomAB

PM sent

NSC5

The question with the engine replacement is why it was replaced AND what was replaced along with it. If there was a major failure was the external portion of the dry sump system either PROPERLY cleaned or preferably replaced with new? Did the dealership properly manage the all important torque tube re-installation?

Most customers would want to know if a major component was replaced at the dealership in a new car prior to sale. I think pretty much every customer given the choice between two identical new cars except one had the engine replaced at the dealership would choose the one with the factory installed engine.

Avanti

Talk with your attorney... ASAP!!! Let him or her deal with the seller.