rithsleeper

Its getting a bit annoying because racing is about interaction and most bigger races you need multiple drivers. I can see that there shouldnt be a passenger in a person in HPDE 2 since that driver is still relitively new but once you are in 3, or have a competition license there sholdnt be a problem. The passenger knows the risk and signs the wavier just like me.

Two reasons i want a passenger. One is my buddy and i own our race car together and we want to critique each other while driving and help each other out, correcting lines when the driver misses something cause his concentration is on a million things. The other reason is its just plain fun for the driver and passenger. My dad loves coming to events and there is one group that does allow passengers with permission but NASA and just about every other group has a strict policy against it.

The only way i could have a passenger would be becoming an instuctor which takes years of experience in different cars at different tracks. I dont think i need to have all if im on a familiar track in a familiar car. My dad will be dead by the time i can qualify as an instructor.

Passenger knows the risk, signs the wavier, and ive proven i can handle my car through license exams and instructor pass offs. Especially my partner who has the same experience and driving ability. I think the sport would grow if they encouraged it, instead of it being a spectator sport.

lbk16

Probably due to insurance restrictions. We (www.3ballsracing.com) allow passengers at our events.

Jason

Liability. Thank your fellow competitors and their families for suing tracks and sanctioning bodies any time something goes wrong.

drivinhard

You sure don't want to kill him before that though

AU N EGL

Sorry HPDE 3 is still not enough experience.

PLUS Students ***** tend to grow when they carry passengers.

You buddy / father can ride with your instructor.

Aardwolf

I attend NASA events and have passengers. I haven't attended a club event that didn't allow them. Maybe it's a regional thing? I always under drive with a passenger.

RedLS1GTO

Almost every HPDE I have ever been at has allowed passengers at the advanced levels...

And the instructors don't? In HPDE, I've been off track more times taking a ride as a passenger with an instructor than I have as a driver.

95jersey

Try a different organization, many allow passengers. you have no choice but to follow club rules.

Kubs

Same here, but unfortunately not everybody does.

sothpaw2

We have a winner! Like the reason for so many other rules in life, there have been plenty of drivers before you that have shown bad behavior so the behavior has been outlawed.

Last year at a TrackDaze, there was a car in Black/Red (I forget which one...it was not intermediate) with a female passenger. This guy was supposed to be a great driver and never had issues/offs. Suspect he was showing off. Car went off and was heavily damaged. Female passenger was hurt because her head hit the roll cage. Track was shut down for a while due to the injury. Still got 1 last session in though.

moespeeds

Some clubs will allow passengers. Track Time for Cars does, and when I go I usually take my girlfriend in the car with me all day. She signs the same waiver the drivers do.

rithsleeper

I can sort of understand a person who is not in the racing scene but my parter, i think he should be allowed. I overdrive with passengers at autox but never at a track day. First off the weight does make a difference and secondly i know i have someones life in my hands and the consequences are greater to my car.

Anyone have any organizations that run at road atl or carolina motorsports park that allow passengers?

Bill Dearborn

Where did you get the idea that it takes years of experience in different cars at different tracks? Instructing is about knowing how to control the student/car while sitting in the right seat, knowing how to communicate with the student in a fast moving environment where the instructor needs to anticipate what direction to provide the student and then provide it in sufficient time for the student to react (this takes a lot of practice but can be done by going for rides with instructors that are willing to help and coaching them around the track), knowing how to assess a student and their car before you go out on track and being able to remain calm when things are on the edge of getting scary. Attending a BMW Club Instructor Training School or similar organization Instructor School would get you where you want to be if you pass. The BMW Schools last two days and alternate time in the class room talking about knowledge an instructor needs to know and then role playing in a car with a mentor acting as the stupidest novice student you will ever meet and doing some of the craziest on track things you might ever see. Once you do that you get a driving test to see how well you drive followed by a check out ride to find out how well you instruct. Pass the checkouts and you are an instructor.

Bill

bb69

The K&K application says nothing about passengers. They are the main supplier of insurance across the country.

Most people don't allow passengers because they think it makes people show off. My experience shows that when having a passenger is normal the showing off stops.

sgsvette

Go to a Hooked on Driving track day and you will be allowed to have a passenger. Insurance regulations do not dictate the passenger rule, it is up to the organizer.

Timz06

Because you suck and want to show off!

Seriously, I am an instructor and my friends won't ride with me, only people who don't know me

In any case first line of my post is the reason.

Tim

930man

agreed....
all fine if everything is fine... but the unexpected emergency ,,, there is no substitute for seat time... period..

rithsleeper

Well I've tried gathering all the info I can on instruction certification and this is why it seems a bit discouraging: "Advanced" drivers are those who have participated at 20 track days om more than one track and have been "signed off" by an instructor for each track driven.

I also read like I said about having experience in different cars and different tracks. I know me and if I only get 4-5 track days a year I'm still a few years off from hitting that "20".

What really has bothered me about the whole thing is the complete and total differences in opinion from instructors I have been with. My first instructor drove a C5 and was extremely knowledgeable but I still think he was missing the whole point of why I was there (to go fast) and I think he had been doing it for so long he was jaded to the need for speed. I wasn't doing anything dangerous, never even close to off track, never spun and he kept making me brake early and anytime I overshot the turn he would get frustrated. Well thats how you learn! how do I know where the edge is if I never hit it.

However the second instructor was the exact opposite he didn't push but kept saying, you can take that turn tighter, or throttle through, or even "lets brake just a bit later and see what happens" I still felt safe and he was extremely impressed by my driving and put me in the solo group by the end of the day. The first guy said I won't be in a solo group till at least 5 track days.

as for sucking and just want to show off, to an extent that is true and I agree I'm not the best yet but its not just showing off. I enjoy myself more when others are enjoying themselves with me. I wouldn't go to an amusement park by myself... I love having passengers because they get just as much enjoyment as I do, and really I love riding just as much as driving. My sister rode with me at an AutoX and still asks me about when the next one will be so she can drive down. I'd love to take her to a real track day so she can have an amazing experience that no one else I have met outside of track days has ever experienced.

Timz06

Getting promoted through DE org's takes time and you will need to make some friends in the right places and demonstrate your ability to them-it's not straightforward, and many people of ability take longer than others with less skill due to their connections-it's a good ol boys club-especially with traditional de clubs like BMW and Porsche-the instructors have worked their way up the ladder, whether they are slow or not and you will have to attend many events over time to move up.

I agree that as a noob, carrying passengers is a blast and I have done it pretty much from the start. I would suggest finding organizations that will work with you, but the key is to prove yourself with one organization that you like and use it as a reference.

Tim

drivinhard

I did, you're the idiot that got me into one of these cars