Zoxxo

F1 is certainly the abode of rumor weirdness but this one is interesting...

http://blogs.espnf1.com/The_Inside_L...r_dtm_name.php

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jcsperson

That looks like more than just a rumor.

drivinhard

C91's = Red sidewall supersofts

John Shiels

I doubt that.

AU N EGL

Well that says it right there

Zoxxo

Didja read the entire thing? That's why they [Hankook] went into supplying DTM so that they WOULD have the know-how. It's not like *any* tire company comes automatically equipped with the know-how for F1 tires. However:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/107137


And from today's ESPNF1.COM:
F1 has a history of treating their tire suppliers like sh*t. Goodyear bailed because of it. Michelin was basically shown the door after years of yeoman service to the sport, and now the way they are treating Pirelli keeps their bridge-burning record intact. Given how important a supply of racing tires is to F1, you'd think the arrogant jerks would be keen to stay on good terms with every tire maker.

I doubt very much that Michelin would want to come back to that environment but they're French so who knows?

I wouldn't be too quick to write off the Hankook possibility (and it's certainly quite possible that Bernie would get some serious $$$ under the table to make it happen...)

It will be interesting to see how the FIA deals with this testing "scandal" as neither the Pirelli nor the Mercedes boards of directors would have a big problem with simply saying, "f**k this crap" and pulling the plug. And then F1 would be out a quality race team and manufacturer, an engine supplier, and their sole tire supplier. Not to mention looking like fools. Again. It's what they do.

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John Shiels

Bernie would have them running on square stone wheels till they wore round for a buck!

Tire companies should shove it to Bernie and charge him a fortune. Then again he could just buy a tire company.

AU N EGL

Linky ?

these?

http://inagist.com/all/3386059565837...utm_medium=rss

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2013/05/2...ver-tyre-test/

Zoxxo

The second one is on target but somewhat dated.

Here are a couple of good, reasonably up-to-date sources:

Adam Cooper's blog (start with page two then 'back up' to page one as he "top posts." You'll need to pick out the relevant stories.)
http://adamcooperf1.com/page/2/ (read first)
http://adamcooperf1.com/

Espnf1.com
http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/109124.html

(this one is chock full of Red Bull's "cry-baby" spin and bluster )
http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/109185.html

Planetf1.com
http://planetf1.com/driver/18227/873...s-Pirelli-test

It's not always easy to separate out the facts from the gross political bluster in F1, so in these annual F1 "crises" reading several sources and getting both/all sides of things is important (assuming you care at all )

The fundamental problem is this: how do you develop and test racing tires for the top formula in the world without a current spec race car to test with? The rules forbid them from testing with anything newer than two years old. If that seems insane then you're starting to grok Pirelli's problem. Now, according to the FIA, in order to do what they needed to do, they would have had to allow *all* the teams to participate (at Pirelli's expense.) Yeah, exactly. Bernie and the FIA are amazingly free with other peoples' money.

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Zoxxo

http://formula-one.speedtv.com/artic...ing-advantage/

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drivinhard

I think it was in '93, and the Penske Indycar team figured out that the rear rain tires worked better backwards.

You see that and the story above and just wonder how those things transpired "Hey we're going to flop the tires for the next run, don't worry, we stayed in a Holiday Inn Express last night"

Zoxxo

I was reading an interview with Alain Prost the other day where he was talking about how, in his day, there were NO rules regarding which tires you ran or how. He ran one race with a qualifying tire on the right front.

So, I would say that there is a long history of experimenting with pretty much everything "taken for granted."

An exception that mystifies me to this day is that the F1 folks compleetly missed the concept of adjustable front wing elements until Jacques Villeneuve arrived from Indy racing and said, "you know guys..." This is despite the fact that the F1 guys had been watching Indy racing on the tube for years. Makes ya wonder...

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1991Z07

Pirelli builds a substandard F1 tire per FOM's specs...WELL below their standard road tires and it turns into a PR nightmare.

Bernie and FOM/FIA required the degradation. Pirelli could EASILY build a super soft that went an entire race, but where would the "spectacle" be then? The blazing sub-3 second pit stops and position changes brought by the requirement would mean processional races once more.

I agree 100% about the bridges F1 have burned with tire manufacturers over the last 30+ years. In some (most) things, Bernie is an arrogant idiot. If I were in a position like Hembry at another manufacturer I would RUN for the door if F1 asked me to build tires for them!

racebum

i wondered about this watching all the cars at the 24hrs of lemans running circuit de la sarth. they were getting a lot more time out of their tires than what i was seeing in F1

racing at this league is way over my head but it seemed odd that the lighter F1 car was wasting tires faster than something like this

John Shiels

I am sure that they all the bad press. Like asking someone to make firewalls out of balsa for their building debut.

John Shiels

Now they are going from steel to kevlar in F-1.

Zoxxo

Going back to kevlar. That's if the FIA allows them to do so. Last year's tires used kevlar.

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Zoxxo

Here's a pic of the Mercedes car at Monaco with the rear tires swapped side-to-side. Note the directional arrow. Ya gotta love F1 for stuff like this.

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From Adam Cooper's blog this morning:

"Pirelli has moved to defuse the fuss about the Mercedes Barcelona test by postponing the planned switch to the revised rear tyres until Silverstone.

"The company had intended to make the switch from steel to Kevlar belts – as used last year – for the Montreal weekend.

"However, the news that Mercedes potentially gained an advantage by trying them during the test after the GP in Barcelona made the early introduction less tenable. Instead Pirelli will provide the teams with sets of the new tyres for evaluation on Friday, thus allowing everyone to sample them before the earliest introduction at Silverstone.

"Nevertheless the change remains contentious because as outlined on this blog yesterday some teams have been able to gain performance by running the rear tyres on the wrong side, and have adjusted their car set-up to make it effective.

"This technique will no longer be relevant because the left and right Kevlar tyres are identical, and this swapping will make no difference.

"It remains to be seen whether the teams most affected will continue to argue their case with Pirelli and the FIA before Silverstone on the basis that it is a change of specification, which requires unanimous agreement. However that condition is trumped by a change on safety grounds."

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Zoxxo

June 2 - PlanetF1.com


Hankook Not Interested in 2014 Tire Bid

Hankook will not be bidding to replace Pirelli should the Italian tyre manufacturer not renew its Formula One contract.

Pirelli are out of contract at the end of this season and although the company has spoken of a desire to continue, recent events could change the picture.

Should that happen, Hankook won't be vying to replace them.

"For 2014, it's completely impossible not only because of the lack of tyre development time," competition engineer Michael Eckert told Autosport.

"Even if Hankook wants to take three, four, five years to jump into Formula 1 as a supplier, the lack of testing opportunities would make it impossible.

"With the current cars and drivers, it's impossible [to test] so you need to find a suitable number of vehicles and drivers that would allow you to get some reliable feedback."

He added that uncertain regulations in the long-term would also put the company off of entering Formula One.

"Even if we started this year with the first tyre test, it would take easily three years until you can finish a safe and performing F1 tyre.

"Now the regulations are changing; engine formula, chassis, and aerodynamics... nobody even knows about the dimensions of the tyres for 2014 - they are still not fixed.

"It's not 100 per cent certain they'll continue with 13-inch tyres. It might be 15 or even 17.

"It could happen in the next five years that F1 cars are on 18-inch tyres."

Eckert insisted that a presence in Formula One is not the goal, although that doesn't mean Hankook won't consider it in the future.

"It's not obligatory that F1 has to be the final destination series," he said.

"From an engineering point of view, F1 is the greatest challenge, but from a financial point of view it is a huge investment.

"You have to be ready with all aspects of your company, not only with the tyre itself but the infrastructure regarding the logistics.

"Currently, all the Hankook tyre production is in Korea and it would be a big help to have a European base like Pirelli does with Turkey.

"We are not ready to jump into Formula 1 for 2014, it's not our goal short-term.

"Certainly we will follow up on it and we are interested in new opportunities from a business point of view and also, from a branding point of view, to go into new markets."

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John Shiels

P-tire should stick it to Bernie now he will run out of suppliers.