GREGGPENN

I am finally going to install my Bulldog keyless system. After reviewing archived posts, FSM schmatics, and the KE100/1702 instruction booklet, I think I have most everything figured out.

1) I have a reverse polarity power lock system that will require use of both internal (Bulldog) relays to actuate the lock/unlock function

2) FSM schematics indicate wiresize (guage) but I don't know how to correlate. I assume .5 is half the size of 1, which is 1/4 size 2?

3) I have to use an external relay to add the hatch open funtion.

4) I have two relays on hand. One has a resistor built-in parallel to the 86 & 87 terminals. What does the resistor accomplish?

5) I have a dopplar radar add-on. This is a Bulldog component that, with a +12/neg lead, will provide two negative triggers. Because the KE100/1702 doesn't appear to have aux trigger inputs, can I add this to the factory alarm? (Lt Blue wires appear to be the trigger off each of the door jam switches. Could I splice the dopplar triggers into either of those two factory trigger leads? If so, would diodes be required to isolate each trigger?

6) Is there any way to get at the horn (black) wire w/o cutting it on the bottom of the steering column? (Tracing mine back looks like it enters a 4-way junction at the "base" of the steering column. But, I don't see this junction in the FSM schematic.)

7) My horn works fine, but when I trigger my alarm, the horn(s) sound like dying ducks. Would that indicate a failing horn relay? (Does pressing of the horn bypass that relay -- since it works fine that way?)

8) When I hook up the internal relays of the Bulldog keyless does it make any difference what "polarity" the lock circuit and the unlock circuit are wired? (My thought is no...that the relays simply act as alternative closing points for the lock/unlock circuits.)

(On one type of alarm, the instructions say to measure for 12V after cutting the (lt blue/black) lock/unlock wires. Then, based on which "half" contains 12V, it specifies which leg of the internal relay should be connected. On my bulldog, it doesn't specify.)

9) Does the Bulldog circuitry act independantly of the cars physical lock/unlock state? IOW, if the car is locked by the Bulldog then unlock with the door switch, is the Bulldog still in the "locked" state? This is important for consideration of a starter-kill relay. If the answer is yes (it's still locked), a starter relay could continue to (independantly) prevent start-up. (I'd have to figure out if disrupting the battery supply could override (reset) that relay. IOW, I'd have to install a starter relay so it was in the normally open position....I think.)

10) The KE100/1702 lists (-) this symbol for trunk pop, starter kill, parking light, and FASD outputs. Do these provide a 12V output when the corresponding circuit is activated? Or, do these close the circuit to ground? If the later, isn't 12V still going thru the wire when the circuit is completed? Is the amperage lower (after passing thru the automotive component -- so the keyless "brain" won't overload?)

Thanks
gp

GREGGPENN

No one knows the answer to any of my questions above?

Agent86?

Chuck Tribolet

There's a table in the front of the electrical section of
the FSM that correlates the metric wire sizes to gauge.

You can pickup what you need at the theft deterant module.

See also:
http://www.batee.com/corvette/keylessentry/index.htm
http://www.garlic.com/~triblet/RemoteKeylessEntry/

AGENT 86

Just finishing lunch and then it's back to work. I'll answer what I can, after work.

GREGGPENN

Thanks Maxwell Smart! I did talk to Bulldog tech support today. They aren't totally clued in but provided a couple of answers.

As I guessed, the answer to #10 is ground outputs are provided. The tech expanded the reply to say they are 200-250mv transisterized ground triggers, but couldn't confirm/deny if one could be used to directly ground (activate) the hatch release.

He also provided the correct polarity for hook-up to the door lock circuit. He also suggested that I swap over to the passenger side to perform my splicing. Said, DS testing of polarity could be inaccurate? WTF?

Either way works for me since both kick and hush panels are out. From one post (and the FSM schematic), there looks to be more confusion/risk of cutting the wrong (lt green) wire for FSAD. That color is also used for RH power mirror.

GREGGPENN

To my OP, I should also ask for recommendation for constant and keyed 12V sources -- if I move to the PS for hookup. Maybe I'll "T" connections into the radio. Not sure if there's a constant 12V supply to the radio yet. I'll look at the FSM.

Here's a record btw....

I'm just now installing the Alpine stereo I bought in the mid 1990's. It's probably > 15yrs old and brand-new in-the-box. That's also when I bought a "Directed 500" 4-channel amplifier. I took the amp apart, removed the chrome lettering, and replaced it with a chrome Corvette logo. My plan is to mount in on the back wall (in front of the gas tank). But, I still haven't decided if I want to cut a square out of brand-new carpet for a clean installation. Or, if I should mount it elsewhere due to my inability to put screws into the rear hatch "wall" w/o risking hitting the gas tank.

I'm pretty sure it would look great with brushed alum heat sink (ribs) showing thru a cutout in new black carpet.

Chuck Tribolet

DO NOT directly ground the hatch release. Put the
contacts of your hatch release relay in parallel with the
hatch release switch in the console. If you don't do it
that way, and your kid/SO/buddy starts messing around
with the spare keys on the freeway, the hatch will open
on the freeway. DUH.

You sure that wasn't "200-250mA" not "200-250mV"?
250 mV isn't going to trigger much of anything on a
car. 250mA will handle most any small relay. I'd be
doubtful of solenoids.

Again, the easiest place to pickup the signals you need
is the theft deterrent module.

The chart that maps metric wire sizes to SAE gauge is
on page 8A-5-3 of my '87 Electrical FSM.

I did the hookup for the door locks inside the
passenger's door.

Chuck

AGENT 86

It's been a few years, so it's all pretty foggy.
I also tapped into the lock/unlock wires in passenger door. I think they suggested kick panel, that just looked like a pain in the ***.
I originally tapped into the horn at theft controller, but soon realized I didn't want to hear that every time, so I switched to parking lights at light switch.
I'm using a relay for the lights and the hatch, they are both mounted beside my Bulldog controller and the VATS module. I have a crash pad delete panel, so it's a good location and easy access for me.
Bulldog use to have a wire info for each year Corvette, but when I look like, it starts around 91.
I can't comment on your doppler, don't have it.

GREGGPENN

My plan was to splice into the leg (button) that sits in the center console. It's wired to the transmission to prevent activation of that (leg of the) circuit while the car is in gear/motion. IOW, If I directly (tried to) link the trunk trigger to the hatch release, it would be at that location.

The rating was probably in mA vs mV. Sounds like it won't work (though I could try it fairly easily). My concern was whether the current draw (from the hatch solonoid) would overload -- and damage -- the add-on electronics.

Unless someone else has tried adding a trigger to the factory theft control unit, I'll just have to try seeing if a 200mA neg trigger is enough to set it off. I assume, I'll have to isolate the additional trigger with a diode.

It also looks like I can get power and keyed power wires via the pink/yellow supply to the theft deterrent controller.

GREGGPENN

Thanks. What about the open/close state of your keyless? Is it's position operate independantly of the car's system? Specifically, if a starter interupt were added to the system, would it still be "interupted" after pressing the door unlock switch on the door? (IOW, the Bulldog still thinks the car is locked right?)

Of course, I COULD wonder if you'd need to simulaneously press the unlock key fob button while turning the key -- to negate the interupt and complete the starter circuit?

GREGGPENN

Thanks. I looked at that page but missed the conversion chart. Now I see it.

FWIW, you made this comment in your personal (very good/detailed) write-up of your install:

•He [Batee] picked up power for the lock/unlock solenoids from the power lead to the Theft Deterrent Module (TDM) while I picked it up in the passenger's door from the wire that powers the factory door locks. I did this for a couple of reasons:

◦The power lead to the TDM is only 22 gauge, which is really wimpy to fire those solenoids.
◦If firing the solenoids blows a fuse, I want it to be the one for the door locks, not the theft fuse which is likely to leave the 'vette disabled.

After looking at the FSM schematic, I see the main power supply (pink) is 14g. The keyed (yellow) wire is the one that's 22g. Unless that's an upgrade for '89 vs '87, I'd have to think the pink line would provide adequate guaging to provide the necessary to trigger for door/hatch solonoids. (And, it turns out that I don't need a keyed power source for my keyless Bulldog unit.)

Chuck Tribolet

You are right about the always hot wire to the FSM being
14 ga. But my comment about fusing still applies. If
you are going to fish several wires into the door, it's
no problem to fish one more at the same time.

The '87 FSM shows that the hatch switches fire a
hatch relay which fires the hatch solenoid. If that's the
case with your '89, you shouldn't need an additional
hatch release relay unless you need it to keep the
hatch from opening on the freeway. My Valet has a
single lead for hatch release (I forget whether it grounds
it or supplies 12V) so I need a relay to be safe (bear in
mind that 90% of my annual 'vette miles have the
back full to the brim with Christmas presents that I
don't want to lose. HO HO HO. ;-)