Very Strange "Car won't start sometimes" problem
#81
Safety Car
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Actually it sounds like the pickup sensors in the ignition switch. Trying the other key probably won't fix it but bypassing the VATS sensor will fix that particular problem. I just went to radio shack and bought the correct resisters, soldered them to a circuit board and put in a hidden kill switch under the dash my wife doesn't know about...
#82
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CI 6,7,8,9,11 Vet
St. Jude Donor '08
Take the KEY SENSOR off the ignition switch,, take it apart and bend the tabs in side so it reads the resistor chip better!
BC
BC
#83
Safety Car
No clicking
Try this: When you have the NO START issue, turn and hold the key to START and while your holding it in start, pump the CLUTCH Peddle on and off the clutch safety switch. When you do that you will hear the Theft Deterrent Relay in the passengers foot well click. That proves all the components up to and including the relay coil is good.
Heres a picture of the relay:
Its the relay with FOUR wires. Yellow, Yellow/Black, Red and PURPLE
Heres a picture of the relay:
Its the relay with FOUR wires. Yellow, Yellow/Black, Red and PURPLE
#84
Safety Car
I swaped relay with the one next to it and relay is good i'm not getting 12v to theft relay where to look now????????
#85
Safety Car
got it
Found the problem it was a mini fuse to ingition sw. Thanks for helping
#86
Intermediate
It could very well be something else, Poor connection at the solenoid could be one possibility, Bad TDR, could be another. Thats why,,, it is very important to do a bit of troubleshooting with a meter.
The schematic provided is the key...
To provide an answer to your question "Doesn't the fact that my car will eventually start mean that the solenoid is good, and its probably something else???
ABSOLUTELY NOT! The solenoid coil will read fine but the spool (inside the solenoid) will not retract when power is applied. Trust me... I have one on the work bench just like I explained.. I just changed the $50 solenoid and solved all of my no start issues.
BC
What you can do is BUMP the starter/solenoid with a long wooden rod while someone holds the key to start (when it fails to start). If the solenoid is failing mechanically, agitating it mechanically will make it start the engine
The schematic provided is the key...
To provide an answer to your question "Doesn't the fact that my car will eventually start mean that the solenoid is good, and its probably something else???
ABSOLUTELY NOT! The solenoid coil will read fine but the spool (inside the solenoid) will not retract when power is applied. Trust me... I have one on the work bench just like I explained.. I just changed the $50 solenoid and solved all of my no start issues.
BC
What you can do is BUMP the starter/solenoid with a long wooden rod while someone holds the key to start (when it fails to start). If the solenoid is failing mechanically, agitating it mechanically will make it start the engine
Bill was spot on with this diag I started chasing vats but found start switch engaged no voltage to the thick purple wire..jumped to red no solonoid click but jumped heated right up. bad relay caused by bad Sol. I'm afraid to bump it for fear of it not disengaging and rushing to disconnect the bat.
#88
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St. Jude Donor '08
There are only TWO fuse boxes in the car.... Under the hood and passengers foot well:
Heres the schematic that you need and it tells you where ALL the fuses are for the starter circuit:
Heres the schematic that you need and it tells you where ALL the fuses are for the starter circuit:
#89
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BTW: When I am experiencing the no-start issue, typically, after a few attempts, the car starts by "bumping" the manual shifter, while in neutral, to one side or the other. ie: move it back-n-forth. Car will typically fire right up when doing that. Very consistent with the shifter bump trick, but still have not figured out exactly what the real issue is. Saturday I'm having it looked at.
(I just purchased the car used about 5 months ago.)
Last edited by slimflem; 11-20-2014 at 10:15 AM.
#90
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No start - your fix
Related thread to OP's last post #79
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show....php?t=3183336
Died and would not start
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show....php?t=3670906
Fix was post 21, not post 12
For Chassis Ground Problems check your Chassis Ground Connectors
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/showthread.php?t=896875
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show....php?t=3183336
Died and would not start
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show....php?t=3670906
Fix was post 21, not post 12
For Chassis Ground Problems check your Chassis Ground Connectors
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/showthread.php?t=896875
Last edited by cor28vettes; 11-17-2015 at 10:30 PM.
#91
Pro
Thanks for this thread, just went through this on mine and it was just a bad theft deterent relay. Volt meter & a little testing, new relay & Im back in action.
#92
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good to keep this thread going...no pun intended
Actually it sounds like the pickup sensors in the ignition switch. Trying the other key probably won't fix it but bypassing the VATS sensor will fix that particular problem. I just went to radio shack and bought the correct resisters, soldered them to a circuit board and put in a hidden kill switch under the dash my wife doesn't know about...
These C5's are aging. Stuff wears out/happens.
#93
I have the same problem
[QUOTE=BIGTACO;1576587186]Sometimes when I go to start my 2003 C5 Z06 the car will not start. I turn the key and everything comes on as it should but nothing. I wait a bit, turn the key 5 or 6 more times, wait a bit more, turn it 2 or 3 more times, and BAM it starts right up. This happens very sporadically. Sometimes it happens once a month. Sometimes it happens once a week.
Anyone have any ideas what it could
is this where I reply?
I’ve had the same issue. I think I had a couple of years ago took it to a garage and they thought it was something else fixed it, but as you know it fixed itself, for A period of time
so on interesting video on YouTube where the guy had the same problem he replaced the starter and he seems happy with that. But maybe he’s having the same remission we’ve all had For 100 bucks I’ll try fixing the starter
I went through the codes there’s no codes there to help you
Anyone have any ideas what it could
is this where I reply?
I’ve had the same issue. I think I had a couple of years ago took it to a garage and they thought it was something else fixed it, but as you know it fixed itself, for A period of time
so on interesting video on YouTube where the guy had the same problem he replaced the starter and he seems happy with that. But maybe he’s having the same remission we’ve all had For 100 bucks I’ll try fixing the starter
I went through the codes there’s no codes there to help you
Last edited by lloydainey; 10-10-2019 at 11:02 AM.
#94
My corvette did the same
Sometimes when I go to start my 2003 C5 Z06 the car will not start. I turn the key and everything comes on as it should but nothing. I wait a bit, turn the key 5 or 6 more times, wait a bit more, turn it 2 or 3 more times, and BAM it starts right up. This happens very sporadically. Sometimes it happens once a month. Sometimes it happens once a week.
Anyone have any ideas what it could be???
Anyone have any ideas what it could be???
#95
C5 wont start unless ignition is momentarily set to "on," first
Lately, my 2000 C5 sometimes won't start, even though I've had it hooked up to a trickle charger all week.
If I stick the key in the ignition and immediately turn it to the start position, the engine won't start. After I switched to a spare key, the same thing happened. However, if I leave the key in the ON position for a brief moment, the car will start without a problem. Does anyone know what could cause this? I saw the following codes in diagnostics mode.
B2282 HB2283 HB2284 HB2285 HU1064 HU1016 H
I don't see any visible corrosion on the battery or the grounds in the engine bay. The voltage meter shows a consistent reading of 13-14 volts once the car starts.
If I stick the key in the ignition and immediately turn it to the start position, the engine won't start. After I switched to a spare key, the same thing happened. However, if I leave the key in the ON position for a brief moment, the car will start without a problem. Does anyone know what could cause this? I saw the following codes in diagnostics mode.
B2282 HB2283 HB2284 HB2285 HU1064 HU1016 H
I don't see any visible corrosion on the battery or the grounds in the engine bay. The voltage meter shows a consistent reading of 13-14 volts once the car starts.
#96
Melting Slicks
This is a very old thread you have posted on, you should turn the key to the on position and let the gauges sweep and the various indicators turn off before turning the key to the start position.
#97
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Lately, my 2000 C5 sometimes won't start, even though I've had it hooked up to a trickle charger all week.
If I stick the key in the ignition and immediately turn it to the start position, the engine won't start. After I switched to a spare key, the same thing happened. However, if I leave the key in the ON position for a brief moment, the car will start without a problem. Does anyone know what could cause this? I saw the following codes in diagnostics mode.
B2282 HB2283 HB2284 HB2285 HU1064 HU1016 H
I don't see any visible corrosion on the battery or the grounds in the engine bay. The voltage meter shows a consistent reading of 13-14 volts once the car starts.
If I stick the key in the ignition and immediately turn it to the start position, the engine won't start. After I switched to a spare key, the same thing happened. However, if I leave the key in the ON position for a brief moment, the car will start without a problem. Does anyone know what could cause this? I saw the following codes in diagnostics mode.
B2282 HB2283 HB2284 HB2285 HU1064 HU1016 H
I don't see any visible corrosion on the battery or the grounds in the engine bay. The voltage meter shows a consistent reading of 13-14 volts once the car starts.
#98
Sometimes when I go to start my 2003 C5 Z06 the car will not start. I turn the key and everything comes on as it should but nothing. I wait a bit, turn the key 5 or 6 more times, wait a bit more, turn it 2 or 3 more times, and BAM it starts right up. This happens very sporadically. Sometimes it happens once a month. Sometimes it happens once a week.
Anyone have any ideas what it could be???
Anyone have any ideas what it could be???
#99
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CI 6,7,8,9,11 Vet
St. Jude Donor '08
In my honest opinion, You need to start troubleshooting at the Theft Deterrent Relay (TDR). That is the HEART of the cars starter circuit. The TDR is located in the passengers footwell behind the Toe Board. Open the toe board and locate the Fuse Box and Body Control Module (Big Silver Box to the left of the fuse box) Above the BCM and Fuse Box on the fire wall are some relays. One of them is the TDR. The TDR relay has FOUR WIRES ( RED, PURPLE, Yellow & Yellow/ black stripe wire ) The RED Wire is the HOT wire that is hot at all times. The PURPLE wire goes to the starter Solenoid and is only HOT when the relay is energized. The yellow wire is energized when the the ignition key is in the CRANK / START position and the clutch safety switch is energized (clutch fully depressed) The yellow black stripe wire is the relay ground wire. Its only grounded when the BCM sees ALL of the requirements to properly start the engine. ( Proper Ignition Key VATS pellet inserted into the ignition switch and BCM and PCM are properly hand shaked.)
You can use a JUMPER WIRE and jump between the RED and PURPLE wire. When jumped, the starter solenoid should energize and the starter should crank the engine. NOTE AND WARNING!!!!! The Transmission MUST be in NEUTRAL and the wheels chalked to prevent vehicle movement!!! If the vehicle is in gear, it will MOVE when the relay is jumped!!!
If the ignition switch is in the RUN POSITION and the relay is jumped, the engine should crank and RUN. NOTE AND WARNING!!!!! The Transmission MUST be in NEUTRAL and the wheels chalked to prevent vehicle movement!!! If the vehicle is in gear, it will MOVE when the relay is jumped!!!
You can short the yellow black stripe wire to chassis ground temporarily to by-pass the BCMs security requirements. That will allow you to see if the BCM is grounding that wire to allow the low current side of the relay to function and pull in the relay contacts to energize the coil and close the high current relay contacts to energize the Starter Solenoid on the starter.
NOTE! If you turn the Key to the CRANK POSITION and Depress the clutch and release it, each time you fully depress and release the clutch, you SHOULD hear that TDR click Energize and turn off. The Clutch Safety Switch is located on the fire wall and is closed when the clutch peddle contacts it. Those switches fail quite a bit because the contacts inside the switch get corroded. I took mine apart and cleaned it. Good as new! :-)
Hope this helps.
Bill Curlee
You can use a JUMPER WIRE and jump between the RED and PURPLE wire. When jumped, the starter solenoid should energize and the starter should crank the engine. NOTE AND WARNING!!!!! The Transmission MUST be in NEUTRAL and the wheels chalked to prevent vehicle movement!!! If the vehicle is in gear, it will MOVE when the relay is jumped!!!
If the ignition switch is in the RUN POSITION and the relay is jumped, the engine should crank and RUN. NOTE AND WARNING!!!!! The Transmission MUST be in NEUTRAL and the wheels chalked to prevent vehicle movement!!! If the vehicle is in gear, it will MOVE when the relay is jumped!!!
You can short the yellow black stripe wire to chassis ground temporarily to by-pass the BCMs security requirements. That will allow you to see if the BCM is grounding that wire to allow the low current side of the relay to function and pull in the relay contacts to energize the coil and close the high current relay contacts to energize the Starter Solenoid on the starter.
NOTE! If you turn the Key to the CRANK POSITION and Depress the clutch and release it, each time you fully depress and release the clutch, you SHOULD hear that TDR click Energize and turn off. The Clutch Safety Switch is located on the fire wall and is closed when the clutch peddle contacts it. Those switches fail quite a bit because the contacts inside the switch get corroded. I took mine apart and cleaned it. Good as new! :-)
Hope this helps.
Bill Curlee
Last edited by Bill Curlee; 10-16-2021 at 01:16 AM.
#100
Melting Slicks
Great to see a post from you Bill, I didn't know that the PCM to BCM handshake had to be present in order for the BCM to ground the TDR coil, I keep learning something new everyday.