Will C7 have 1 to 4 skip shift?
#62
Team Owner
Tom
PS: I work on a USAF base and considering all the Jersey Barrier's I have to snake my way through I'm not about to blast off from the guard at the gate.
#63
Safety Car
I think I'm safe in saying that none of us likes CAGS or AFM. But what is your solution for GM compliance with the fast-escalating CAFE regulations? Maybe everyone buying a C7 must also buy three Volts? And the old "drop in the bucket" wishful thinking has been clearly refuted by GM management saying that Corvette doesn't get a CAFE pass.
This is a new era. My prediction: Don't like CAGS and AFM? Stand by; you ain't seen nothing yet.
This is a new era. My prediction: Don't like CAGS and AFM? Stand by; you ain't seen nothing yet.
#65
I had a 93 C4 with CAGS and I just unplugged it at the transmission. I hated it. My new Porsche Boxster does not have this feature but it does have start/stop of the engine at stop lights. You can turn that off with a switch right on the console. Mine is OFF for sure.
#66
Burning Brakes
I had a 93 C4 with CAGS and I just unplugged it at the transmission. I hated it. My new Porsche Boxster does not have this feature but it does have start/stop of the engine at stop lights. You can turn that off with a switch right on the console. Mine is OFF for sure.
#67
Melting Slicks
I had a 93 C4 with CAGS and I just unplugged it at the transmission. I hated it. My new Porsche Boxster does not have this feature but it does have start/stop of the engine at stop lights. You can turn that off with a switch right on the console. Mine is OFF for sure.
Last edited by v26278; 08-08-2013 at 02:49 AM.
#68
Burning Brakes
Sure, on the rare occasion that may happen when you are not thinking. However, on that rare occasion, you should probably let the car do what's best for the car and not over-ride the engineers' programming. Of course, that just my opinion, but I always ere on the side of the guys who design and build them over my own mechanical prowess!
Dave
Dave
#69
Safety Car
The engine mounts are probably softer too. That can mean they break easier, but almost surely the throttle response suffers. Think that one of the strengths of the small block v8 is that it's very well balanced, stiffer mounts can be used without increasing NVH significantly getting both a very classy ride feel and great throttle response. With a V4 you get one or the other and every drawback that exists for a V4 engine now exists for the small block V8. This is a huge step back. GM has chosen for you, NVH is the same driver feedback is worse. A tough choice has been made.
Fuel economy savings in general are even deeper in the design. The extra gear meant a transmission that's 2 inches longer. What if the C7 is larger just to fit the damn 7th gear?
You have a heavier car, a less direct throttle feel, less power, and a crappier powerband. You think you can get that back by not using Eco mode??? C7 is handicapped like that.
Last edited by SBC_and_a_stick; 08-08-2013 at 02:50 AM.
#70
Safety Car
Easy there.
As everyone knows, CAGS can be disabled easily.
As for the electronic parking brake, I presume you're objection has to do with hill-holding. Every EPB out there, including the one on the new Holden (GM Australia) Commodore, works as a hill-holder by design:
As everyone knows, CAGS can be disabled easily.
As for the electronic parking brake, I presume you're objection has to do with hill-holding. Every EPB out there, including the one on the new Holden (GM Australia) Commodore, works as a hill-holder by design:
1. For ergonomics think this, the same electronic brake but instead of a button it's an old fashioned lever. Great things happen with a lever. You can find it without looking, you can find it when the car is going sideways, you can find it while drive hard and need it for extra tricks. Lever will always beat button for ergonomics. The only thing worse than a button is a touchscreen.
2. In a city with lots of altitude change a manual e-brake is a great asset. I can pull up to a stop at a fairly radical angle and gradually sharpen the e-brake grab by increasing the pull on the leaver. That means I'll slow down smoother and not surprise whoever is behind me. It's perhaps best used to smoothen the take off. With a push button e-brake you have to manhandle the clutch to take off from a huge incline before letting go of the e-brake. With a manual e-brake you work simultaneously gradually phasing the clutch in and phasing the e-brake out.
Manual e-brakes are brilliant. Electronic e-brakes are for idiots. Here is an analogy. No one likes drag clutches for everyday driving. Think why they don't work very well and that's also the reason electronic e-brakes don't work very well. Except e-brakes that are electronic are purely on/off which makes them way worse than the drag clutch in my example.
#71
Safety Car
I think it's because some owners enjoy modding their new car with ebay parts. Think how awesome you are when you tell your buddies that your new C7 just came off the lot and you already tuned it, yourself, no help.
#73
v26278 I don't want CAGS on my Boxster. So now the C6.5 has CAGS on an outdated 6 speed automatic transmission and cylinder deactivation. Must get 90 MPG once it decides which gear it wants to be in.
#74
Missing the point. It's the compromises in design of the AFM that is a drawback. We know the torque tube is heavier because of it, we know the clutch is heavier because of it, odds are the cam is tame because of it, and the VVT...well I think that's probably the more interesting of the bunch. With simple VVT, like the one GM can implement on pushrods you often need to make sacrifices, you can either have low end torque gains or top end torque gains. If we were able to get the 40ft/lb up top then 500hp would be attainable. Now we have to make do with 460hp and a whooping 1mpg more on the freeway...wow...what a great choice.
The engine mounts are probably softer too. That can mean they break easier, but almost surely the throttle response suffers. Think that one of the strengths of the small block v8 is that it's very well balanced, stiffer mounts can be used without increasing NVH significantly getting both a very classy ride feel and great throttle response. With a V4 you get one or the other and every drawback that exists for a V4 engine now exists for the small block V8. This is a huge step back. GM has chosen for you, NVH is the same driver feedback is worse. A tough choice has been made.
Fuel economy savings in general are even deeper in the design. The extra gear meant a transmission that's 2 inches longer. What if the C7 is larger just to fit the damn 7th gear?
You have a heavier car, a less direct throttle feel, less power, and a crappier powerband. You think you can get that back by not using Eco mode??? C7 is handicapped like that.
The engine mounts are probably softer too. That can mean they break easier, but almost surely the throttle response suffers. Think that one of the strengths of the small block v8 is that it's very well balanced, stiffer mounts can be used without increasing NVH significantly getting both a very classy ride feel and great throttle response. With a V4 you get one or the other and every drawback that exists for a V4 engine now exists for the small block V8. This is a huge step back. GM has chosen for you, NVH is the same driver feedback is worse. A tough choice has been made.
Fuel economy savings in general are even deeper in the design. The extra gear meant a transmission that's 2 inches longer. What if the C7 is larger just to fit the damn 7th gear?
You have a heavier car, a less direct throttle feel, less power, and a crappier powerband. You think you can get that back by not using Eco mode??? C7 is handicapped like that.
I have a hard time being mad at GM though since they have to follow the governments lead on MPG regulations.
#75
CAGS is not used on auto transmissions.
#76
Team Owner
WTF are you talking about. CAGS is used on the 6 speed manual transmission, not the automatic.
#77
Team Owner
Missing the point. It's the compromises in design of the AFM that is a drawback. We know the torque tube is heavier because of it, we know the clutch is heavier because of it, odds are the cam is tame because of it, and the VVT...well I think that's probably the more interesting of the bunch. With simple VVT, like the one GM can implement on pushrods you often need to make sacrifices, you can either have low end torque gains or top end torque gains. If we were able to get the 40ft/lb up top then 500hp would be attainable. Now we have to make do with 460hp and a whooping 1mpg more on the freeway...wow...what a great choice.
The engine mounts are probably softer too. That can mean they break easier, but almost surely the throttle response suffers. Think that one of the strengths of the small block v8 is that it's very well balanced, stiffer mounts can be used without increasing NVH significantly getting both a very classy ride feel and great throttle response. With a V4 you get one or the other and every drawback that exists for a V4 engine now exists for the small block V8. This is a huge step back. GM has chosen for you, NVH is the same driver feedback is worse. A tough choice has been made.
Fuel economy savings in general are even deeper in the design. The extra gear meant a transmission that's 2 inches longer. What if the C7 is larger just to fit the damn 7th gear?
You have a heavier car, a less direct throttle feel, less power, and a crappier powerband. You think you can get that back by not using Eco mode??? C7 is handicapped like that.
The engine mounts are probably softer too. That can mean they break easier, but almost surely the throttle response suffers. Think that one of the strengths of the small block v8 is that it's very well balanced, stiffer mounts can be used without increasing NVH significantly getting both a very classy ride feel and great throttle response. With a V4 you get one or the other and every drawback that exists for a V4 engine now exists for the small block V8. This is a huge step back. GM has chosen for you, NVH is the same driver feedback is worse. A tough choice has been made.
Fuel economy savings in general are even deeper in the design. The extra gear meant a transmission that's 2 inches longer. What if the C7 is larger just to fit the damn 7th gear?
You have a heavier car, a less direct throttle feel, less power, and a crappier powerband. You think you can get that back by not using Eco mode??? C7 is handicapped like that.
VVT has nothing to do with the pushrods.
As for the weight of the C7, better gas mileage is obtained with the AFM then if the car didn't have it but was ~35 pounds lighter.
Last edited by JoesC5; 08-08-2013 at 12:31 PM.