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you rarely hear about problems with BMW DCT or Porsche PDK.
So i think the A8 overall is less reliable vs other makes.
Well yeas and no.
My first E92 M3 (2010) DCT was terrible, it took several software updates before it was acceptable. Was posted about many times, along with bottom end engine problems. BIG difference is BMW actually fixed after people complained and you didnt get a runaround from the dealer.
Now if BMW could have just fixed the HPFP problems lol.
Many complaints about the new 6 speed ford auto, both cars and trucks. Downshift clunks, always hunting and seems like its in the wrong gear.
Lets not forget the 4L60 that died in many many GM cars and trucks.
Or the 4 speed auto (whatever it was called) that was replaced four times in three years in my '95 1500 Ram.
Or my Wife's 2015 9 speed Jeep Cherokee trans that was replaced twice in less than 10K miles (many many people have issues).
That doesnt make C7/GM truck A8 problems OK, but I remember everyone calling people 'stupid' for buying a 2014 c7 because of the crappy 6 speed auto and how great the A8 was going to be. But you got a brand new auto trans and it will take time before its perfect. Not to mention some people just look for problems and expect absolute perfection in an auto trans. I have yet to find one, and I've owned a couple PDK cars among many others.
Mine is an early '16 with 3K miles on it, except for the occasional bump when downshifting I dont have any other of the common complaints. Might last forever, might crap out at 4000 miles, i'll cross that bridge when I get to it..
I can understand the frustration. But allow me to ask this question. If it was a design problem, wouldn't all the transmissions have the problem issue? I would think that if you had a "parts" problem in manufacturing, that all transmissions would also be bad. But.....if some parts were manufactured out of spec or not cut properly you would see what we have here. Some transmissions are fine, while others are faulty because of a poorly manufactured part. What do you think about this?
You are thinking with the notion that a flaw always equals 100% failure rates. That's not how it works.
It's almost impossible for GM to replicate all conditions and variables involved in use of the product, that's why we have TSB's, recalls, etc. It doesn't mean that GM didn't mess up, it just means this happens all the time and is unavoidable to some extent.
My first E92 M3 (2010) DCT was terrible, it took several software updates before it was acceptable. Was posted about many times, along with bottom end engine problems. BIG difference is BMW actually fixed after people complained and you didnt get a runaround from the dealer.
Now if BMW could have just fixed the HPFP problems lol.
Many complaints about the new 6 speed ford auto, both cars and trucks. Downshift clunks, always hunting and seems like its in the wrong gear.
Lets not forget the 4L60 that died in many many GM cars and trucks.
Or the 4 speed auto (whatever it was called) that was replaced four times in three years in my '95 1500 Ram.
Or my Wife's 2015 9 speed Jeep Cherokee trans that was replaced twice in less than 10K miles (many many people have issues).
That doesnt make C7/GM truck A8 problems OK, but I remember everyone calling people 'stupid' for buying a 2014 c7 because of the crappy 6 speed auto and how great the A8 was going to be. But you got a brand new auto trans and it will take time before its perfect. Not to mention some people just look for problems and expect absolute perfection in an auto trans. I have yet to find one, and I've owned a couple PDK cars among many others.
Mine is an early '16 with 3K miles on it, except for the occasional bump when downshifting I dont have any other of the common complaints. Might last forever, might crap out at 4000 miles, i'll cross that bridge when I get to it..
Well I came from a 2013 M3 DCT, and was a very active forum member.
I can agree that people had software problems, in fact my DCT did some weird things. Sometimes when coming to a light, it would stay in 6th gear. Then stumble for gears.
BUT i just never really heard of people having real major problems, besides software updates. That was BMWs first ever DCT also!
The new generation M-DCT are even better than before.
Well I came from a 2013 M3 DCT, and was a very active forum member.
I can agree that people had software problems, in fact my DCT did some weird things. Sometimes when coming to a light, it would stay in 6th gear. Then stumble for gears.
BUT i just never really heard of people having real major problems, besides software updates. That was BMWs first ever DCT also!
The new generation M-DCT are even better than before.
I was on that forum the BMW boards as well (e92) and agree there were software problems very early on, but they were ironed out pretty quickly by BMW and it was indeed their first DCT. The problems weren't even close to what we are seeing on this forum, nor was the solutions as BMW didn't stumble around and release Band-Aid fixes to solve the issues like GM did.
Well I came from a 2013 M3 DCT, and was a very active forum member.
I can agree that people had software problems, in fact my DCT did some weird things. Sometimes when coming to a light, it would stay in 6th gear. Then stumble for gears.
BUT i just never really heard of people having real major problems, besides software updates. That was BMWs first ever DCT also!
The new generation M-DCT are even better than before.
Sure, but this is GM's first A8 also
I wasnt on a lot of BMW forums but after I bought the '10 new I couldnt believe a 70K car could shift like such crap lol, I seem to remember reading quite a few complaints. Yes it mostly software related but how many C7 A8s have actually failed where the car wouldnt move?
My kid's '13 VW takes about 2 seconds after sitting overnight to go into gear since new. I hate it. But according to VW they all do it, they wont touch it, three years and 40K miles later it still does the same thing..
I have no doubt there are some real issues out there, the converter clutch/sealing seems to be an issue. Lockup clutch is used a LOT on these and its PWM, just looking for problems. The stator thing is a band aid, if there was a drainback issue that TSB addressed they would ALL do it after sitting overight. Most likely if GM would just get their head out of their *** and only enable that stupid AFM in ECO with the A8s most people would not even notice the converter issues on the highway because most would not put it in ECO
Since the idea of the new A10 coming to a corvette near you has been kaboshed due to size issues, i read an article stating that the A10 co-developmed by GM and Ford is slated for the Camaro and the new Mustang. Go figure.
Last edited by CriticalmassGT; 06-28-2016 at 04:17 PM.
I had a 2015 Z51 built the last week of production last year. I just got a new 2016 Z51 built the last week of May. I notice the 16 car shifts better than the 15 car. My boss has a 2014 with the six speed automatic. I drove it and think it shifts better than both the 15/16 cars.
Last edited by Corvette ED; 06-28-2016 at 04:19 PM.
Many complaints about the new 6 speed ford auto, both cars and trucks. Downshift clunks, always hunting and seems like its in the wrong gear.
The 6 speed auto is rock solid. The "clunk" is driveline slop from the 2 piece drive shaft. I have never experienced it "hunting" for a gear. The driveline slop or "thunk" can also be avoided based on the way you drive, and I haven't experienced in a very long time. For a stock auto transmission, it's good for up to 600hp and staying reliable.
Last edited by CriticalmassGT; 06-28-2016 at 04:22 PM.
The 6 speed auto is rock solid. The "clunk" is driveline slop from the 2 piece drive shaft. I have never experienced it "hunting" for a gear. The driveline slop or "thunk" can also be avoided based on the way you drive, and I haven't experienced in a very long time. For a stock auto transmission, it's good for up to 600hp and staying reliable.
Go read the F150 forums lol. I didn't say they were a bad trans, just people complained about them on the internets.
I had an '11 and '13 Mustang GT that both ran mid-high 10s with nothing but a Roush 2.3 TVS, tune and drag radials - stock gears and torque converter as well. Rock solid trans stock for sure, not the best shift patterns. Especially the '11, but a few hours time in tuning and it was pretty good, the '13 stock was a lot better.
I can understand the frustration. But allow me to ask this question. If it was a design problem, wouldn't all the transmissions have the problem issue? I would think that if you had a "parts" problem in manufacturing, that all transmissions would also be bad. But.....if some parts were manufactured out of spec or not cut properly you would see what we have here. Some transmissions are fine, while others are faulty because of a poorly manufactured part. What do you think about this?
That was my thoughts for posting, which can happen, and I think Boost Monkey expands on that and answers that more thoroughly
Originally Posted by \Boost Monkey/
Totally understand, I am in the engineering/design field as well so I like good discussions on these matters.
But see, the tell-tale thing to note here is a revised design with new part numbers, signaling an inherent flaw in the original design.
The number of cars affected is irrelevant (for sake of our discussion) because the parts are as-designed and a flaw in the manufacturing or QA/QC process of the parts (if this was causing the issues) or just a fluke pre-mature natural failure would result in replacement of like-in-kind parts to solve the issues, not newly revised parts like we are seeing.
I disagree completely with all A8's seeing failures because of a design flaw. A design flaw that apparent would have been caught in the testing/vetting phase of the design process. The failure rate here is just low enough that GM was not able to find the issue prior to release of the design...This happens all the time and is why parts are constantly revised during the generations. The reason that this is only occurring in some cars is unknown to the public, but the fact remains that we know GM has identified a design flaw and has attempted to rectify the issue with a re-design.
This happens...Think ignition switches.
Excellent points, and you explained it better than I did .. Thanks for that
Originally Posted by \Boost Monkey/
You are thinking with the notion that a flaw always equals 100% failure rates. That's not how it works.
It's almost impossible for GM to replicate all conditions and variables involved in use of the product, that's why we have TSB's, recalls, etc. It doesn't mean that GM didn't mess up, it just means this happens all the time and is unavoidable to some extent.
I'm not sure the A8 is that problematic anyway in an overall context. Consumer Reports shows their highest repair rating ("much above average") for the 2015 C7 trannies, which is based on owner surveys. The M7 is included in that rating, but it represents only about 20% of sales, so one must surmise that so far they're quite reliable. The same goes for Chevy trucks and Cadillacs, although all Cadillac models except one showed insufficient data on 2015s. The Silverado shows a step down from the highest (above average) for the category Transmission, Minor.
That said, it appears that some (most?) A8 problems on the C7 start to occur after some mileage is accumulated, like perhaps 6-10k. Next year's survey will be telling in that regard as cars accumulate mileage.
My 2015, A8 had most of the symptoms of a bad torque converter. Dealer had already replaced several transmissions and torque converters. The dealer rep informed me that in the beginning the transmissions were replaced and after GM examined the returned transmissions it was determined that the cause of the shuddering etc was a bad o-ring in the torque converter. GM told the dealers who contacted them reference the A-8 shuddering etc to replace the torque converters because the transmissions were not the problem. My torque converter was replaced with a new revised torque converter and a new type of transmission fluid. No more problems with the transmission. Life is good. It appears in this case, while they were attempting to determine what was causing the transmission problems, the bad o-ring was being placed in the A8's.
IMHO, the A8, thus far, has been a weakness in a great generation of Vettes. To those of you with a perfect performing A8s . For those with chronic problems, you deserved better for your money.
My 2015 Z06 was produced the first week of production with the A8 in late January 2015.
I'm not sure the A8 is that problematic anyway in an overall context. Consumer Reports shows their highest repair rating ("much above average") for the 2015 C7 trannies, which is based on owner surveys. The M7 is included in that rating, but it represents only about 20% of sales, so one must surmise that so far they're quite reliable. The same goes for Chevy trucks and Cadillacs, although all Cadillac models except one showed insufficient data on 2015s. The Silverado shows a step down from the highest (above average) for the category Transmission, Minor.
That said, it appears that some (most?) A8 problems on the C7 start to occur after some mileage is accumulated, like perhaps 6-10k. Next year's survey will be telling in that regard as cars accumulate mileage.
For 2015, the M7 represented 32.1% of the entire years production.
A friends 1st C7 Z51 dumped the transmission at 4 miles( and he refused to take the car). His second C7 Z51 dumped the transmission at 1200 miles and the dealer replaced the transmission, and then it started acting up again a couple of hundred miles after the installation of the second transmission. GM put him into a new 2016, and so far, it's been good.
Another friend's transmission took a serious dump at 7,700 miles in his 100% pure stock 2015 Z06. GM put a new transmission in it. It previously had had the flex plate replaced under warranty.
Have 2015 Z06 ....A8
Sounds like I'm one of the lucky ones. I've had 0 problems with the A8.
I have enjoyed the option to shift or not to shift. That's why I ordered it that way.
Hope things stay this way. 5500 miles
No, what THEY (Tadge) said is that they couldn't find a DCT that would FIT in the given space on the C7 platform AND handle the Z06 torque.
The C7 was a ground up redesign, so we all know that was a blatant lie that insults the intelligence all Corvette owners.
We also know that they're suppliers that GM could have sourced a DCT from that fit their spec.
But, GM bet they could increase profit by relying on the blind faith of sheep that would swallow whatever BS they sold, and they were right.
Since the idea of the new A10 coming to a corvette near you has been kaboshed due to size issues, i read an article stating that the A10 co-developmed by GM and Ford is slated for the Camaro and the new Mustang. Go figure.
Probably more BS from GM
The A10 will "fit" in the Corvette once they get rid of all the A8s, or they've squeezed the most amount of profit they think they can from them.
Let's just hope the A10 offers a DCT experience and performance.
If so, I'm in.
Stentplacer:Have 2015 Z06 ....A8
Sounds like I'm one of the lucky ones. I've had 0 problems with the A8.
I have enjoyed the option to shift or not to shift. That's why I ordered it that way.
Hope things stay this way. 5500 miles
Good for you and you can join the vast majority of thousands out there that people haven't had any problems with theirs either. But as long as anyone has a problem there will be those "piling on" as usual. Doesn't matter what the issue, there's always some whine along with the cheese.
06-28-2016, 03:39 PM
I think your last sentence sums it up 
Doesn't matter what the issue, there's always some whine along with the cheese. 