As some may know ed is coming out with a new sub, the 13av.2
http://www.edesignaudio.com/edv2/pro...roducts_id=554

The prototype has gotten into a certain fews hands. Here is a review about it. Can't wait to get my hands on one of these. I will personally be hearing one Fri night, so I'll be able to say a few words about it after that.

Here is the review
http://www.icixsound.com/vb/showthre...647#post426647

 

The reviewer calls it a "comprehensive review" of the driver. Hardly. He didn't offer a single scientific measurement. A guy having that much claimed experience should know better.

As if C&D would compare the C6 with a Viper and provide no measurements.

 

good point

 

Calculated as always. I clicked the link via my email a few days ago. As if they would post a review that states "the mechanical measurements of the driver are so far off from advertised that using the specs are pointless" or something similar.

I am sure the "reviewer" received something for his "efforts".

Marketing is marketing.

Fej

 

all he got was the driver for free to play around with

Penta received one as well. He didn't get "anything" to review the sub other than the sub itself

 

But he's a 'dealer' kinda like you and penta, so it's in his own interests to speak favorably. Should he not, maybe he doesn't get a free 'next-big-thing.'

 

Ive never receifed a free big anything. I was sent the prototype to play with and demo it and when the final version is released im under obligation to send my prototype back and if I like I can purchase the production model, no one is getting anything for free. With that said the attitude of some of the forum members here is starting to really **** me off, fej this is in no way aimed at you either I see where you are coming from.

 

I have never received anything for free from eD and I'm sure Greg hasn't either.

 

He's a JL dealer not a eD dealer and yes Greg and I are a dealer for eD and believe me, we don't get any percs to make us go around and rant and rave about eD like they are going to give us more free stuff. They are not that kind of company and we don't get anything extra for selling a certain amount(quotas) of their stuff. We will tell you honestly whether we like something or not and we'll steer you in another direction if eD isn't right. We've done it countless times to our customers and even on here.

 

Not knocking you guys at all, I understand what you guys have going on, you are using what works, and ED is advertising it where they see fit (or more accurately where it benefits them)

As for the reviewer, my point was only that none of us would have heard one word about this "review" had it not been favorable, and said reviewer would never see another product to test from ED had it not been favorable.

Again, calculated, which is not necessarily wrong, just does not always tell the whole story.

I have to assume that audio, like most industries, sends out "ringers" to the "reviewers". Like in the automobile industry, where "factory freaks" are hand selected to be sent to car and driver magazines for performance tests. I have to think that ED has gone to every level of testing to assure that the prototypes are built to the advertised specs and perform as advertised. It just makes good business sense to do so, just like having positive only reviews and positive only forums for your product. This stance just tends to make informed consumers wary of your products, which is where ED sits now, either you are a fanboi, or a hater (easiset way for me to term it)

Fej

 

I assumed that when you said...

it meant he was keeping the sub. I'll pull that much back. However, it's clear to most of us that you three guys have a vested interest in seeing that eD sells well, regardless of actual performance. It's also quite common in this industry to have steeply discounted or free stock provided to 'dealers.' I'd be amazed if that changed. That much can't be avoided. I don't hate eD. On the contrary, I was highly disappointed. I'm very clear in my position that they have done nothing to this point but make me suspicious.

If I somehow come across another eD driver, I'll test it, and if it performs well, I'll say so. I have no emotional or financial interest in this one way or the other. I simply won't keep quiet when a product fails to live up to its billing regardless who's feelings I hurt or sensitivities I disrupt. I'm trained as a scientist. You'll get as black/white an assessment from me as I can possibly provide, usually with a healthy dose of skepticism toward unusual or outrageous claims.

As I've said in other threads, if someone wants me to test something, I'll be happy to do it. Then we'll have the truth.

There is no agenda except to inform those who'd be otherwise uninformed, and it's clear to me that Scott P has his own agenda.

 

Very well said, Spkrboy!

I worked for Pioneer years ago when I lived in Japan. I was able to buy equipment factory direct... much cheaper than we sold it to a reseller. I got some nice equipment out of the deal... which is the way it should be if you ask me. You WANT to develop brand loyalty... but a person needs to know where to draw the line.

I got into some trouble when I was auditioning a surround sound system with another manufacturers speakers. I used a Pioneer TV, Pioneer Receiver, and other Pioneer equipment, but the speakers...

My boss got a little upset when I told him that the speakers we sold were crap compared to the ones I was using to demo the system.

I basically told him that if you want me to show everyone just how good this system can sound, then send me some speakers that don't sound like ***!

(It seems weird that I have a set of Pioneer PRS speakers in my C5 now, based on my experience with Pioneer speakers in the past... but man do they sound great! )

Anyway... it's great that a company is trying to bust into the car audio scene. Just don't fall prey to the marketing crap and keep it straight. (Not saying eD or you guys have done anything one way or another. )

If you want to impress me, send that demo sub to somebody like SpkrBoy and have him post some graphs on the speaker performance. (Or to NPDang on the other forum.)

Just my Buck O' Five.

Mark

 

While Greg and I do have an interest in eD that they sell well, we do not do it regardless of performance. I'll be one of the first to say when something isn't right or just plain sucks. What Greg and I do for eD is give them as much feed back about something as we can so they can improve on a product or area. The owner of eD will be one of the first people to tell you "Tell us what's wrong so we can fix it".

As far as discounted product, yes we do get a discount. Heavy discount, I wouldn't go that far and sure as hell aren't getting free anything. Would we mind getting free stuff of course not, but we're also not complaining that we don't get anything for free. Their prices are pretty good directly online.

I don't have nearly the background that you do and I don't claim to do. It seems that you know your stuff and that you are a great source of knowledge for us here. I've been in the hobby for some time, but nothing beyond that. I've just recently started getting into installs and am learning as I go along like everyone else. I have yet to build a collection of test equipment and all that fun stuff that I would love to get into and I would gladly do tests for you guys. I will also be the first to say that something doesn't sound right to my ear if I hear it. Right now, that is my only way of knowing. I don't have the equipment to do so.

In the original post I mentioned that I will be hearing one for the first time Fri night. So I can't say anything about this sub. All I did was post what a review that I saw and had been waiting for to come out. Was I a little disappointed that there much if any numbers there? Sure, I would have loved to see a comparison of that nature, especially coming from that scott guy. Spkrboy you'll have a pm coming shortly.




Almost the same thing here. We don't get a bunch of free stuff or heavily discounted product, but we do get some kind of discount.

As far as getting in trouble for using other brands, hardly the case here. Not sure how it is with other manufacturers and what not. But eD would love to get honest feedback about their product.

We are all guilty of falling for marketing hype at one point or another, thats what makes us cautious and leary about products, like spkrboy has brought up with a driver he tested. Its totally valid, i can't disprove him or agree with him unless i run the same tests. Which I don;t have the capability of doing.

 

Thanks, FHR.

DPG: PM received.

No one has accused either of you guys of anything underhanded. All that's been said is that there's an easily identifiable conflict of interest. It doesn't matter whether you act on that interest or not, the interest remains. There's no way around that except to become independent. Sorry, that's the way it is.

ED has established their track record themselves. No one but they can change it, and let me assure you, a step backward is not overcome by a simple step forward.

Scott P's review is questionable in its objectivity for several reasons:

1. He must have SOME connection to eD or else why does he receive a demo model? Something's wrong there.

2. He posts zero measurements. Why? Someone with his claimed experience should have some testing equipment. If he doesn't, I have to question his knowledge of audio in general. 95% of a sub's performance will be predicted by its impedance data. In essence, he knows 5% of the story.

3. He expects us to accept his review based on what he hears. This is out of the question. His ears are not my ears and not your ears or anyone else's. We have no idea what he knows about how music should sound. We have no frame of reference as to his experience hearing live classical instruments (the ONLY way to judge) in a quality venue.

4. He doesn't describe how he arrived at the box the driver was in when installed. Did he verify the numbers and build to suit or for taste? Did he simply build the eD recommended box and run with it? Who knows?

*****

If you have decent pull with eD, I'd LOVE to have at a few more tests. The catch is I won't sugar-coat anything. If my previous tests were a bad batch of drivers or something, I'll happily admit it. If other drivers are more accurately spec'd, I'll post that too. Until then, they remain a dubious company to me.

 

If I had my hands on that driver, I'd be more than happy to send one out your way. But I don't just yet. When they come out, I am thinking about getting one.