95jersey

That is definately a quick section of the course and the track is not very wide.

#1) Glad to hear it sounds you are OK (most important)

#2) For all our benefit, can you tell us how fast you hit, and from what angle, and if you had any safety gear on (harness, hans, whatever). If you had safety gear, I'd be curious to hear your input on how effective it was in the crash.

Again, sorry to hear.

TedDBere

Earlier this year I experienced a snap spin on oil at only 51 mph. Once you hit the slippery surface and the rear lets loose, you're just along for the ride.

Sorry about the loss of your virginity. Now get back out there!

Glad you're ok.

John Shiels

lots of banged up cars lately I guess the rain all year didn't help much.

John Shiels

that just happen? I guess totaled? How fast into the wall? Not familiar with the new Jersey tracks

cgh1

Dang Steve... Sorry to hear about your mishap.
Also very glad you are OK and are taking away learning from the experience instead of blame. Beating one's self up does no good for anyone/anything and what happened to you could've happened to anyone, regardless of experience level.

Hope you get your baby back soon even better than before!

kentz06

Sorry to hear this Steve. I think wet grass has a negative cooefficient of friction. More sand/gravel traps at most tracks would be nice.

I did it to my 911 996 C2 nine years ago, $15K. If you drive hard it is not a matter of IF, but WHEN it will happen to you. Prepare accordingly.

Dean

SLandstra_Z06

I really appreciate all of the messages guys. What a great community we have. I've been pretty down about the whole thing, but I have been thinking a lot about the lessons I've taken away from the experience. I'll be a better, smarter driver for it.

One big lesson is - Don't rush. If you're scrambling around trying to get the car out of the trailer, rushing to the driver's meeting, looking for your gear, etc... just slow down and get your head together. If you miss half of the session, or the whole session, don't sweat it. There'll be another session in an hour or so... or tomorrow or next week.

In conducting my forensic analysis of the event, I realized I had been rushing all morning and by the time I made it on track, I was not focused on the task at hand. If I had made it through that first corner with a little slide, I would have realized how slippery the track really was, and probably would have brought it in to think about my tire choice, active handling setting choice or whether it even made sense to be on track during a Noreaster weekend. Instead, I just continued rushing down a path toward a bad outcome.

Hopefully, my words will resonate with all of you and you will take a deep breath at the right time and slow everything down. You'll be safer for it and when your mind is focused, go ahead and ramp it up to your comfort zone.

At least those are some of the things I learned. Oh, and that I have a great group of friends, made through this sport.

Thanks,

Steve

Poor-sha

Can anyone else say UPGRADE TIME!

Seriously - glad you're ok Steve.

cjlaw73

August 2008 - I believe our group was the 2nd group to run the Thunderbolt track after opening. We have ventured a guess that the tires broke loose around 90 mph, but I slid a good 50 yrds sideways before connecting with the wall.

cjlaw73

Steve,

After totalling my car I was absolutely miserable. That car was in excellent shape. But as everyone else has said, cars can be repaired, people can't. My friend's at the track ran up to my car after I had been carted away in the ambulance fearing the worst.

I talked at length with friends that race and my instructor to put the pieces together - since eveything happended so fast. We identified what the events that we think lead to my accident, and I'm a better driver now for it.

I'll be back on the track with the replacement Vette once my wife recovers from her heart attack.

Good luck to you,

Charlie

the blur

And I must ask, do you guys who have an incident run with the AH off or disabled in any way ?

ghoffman

That is the way I felt at Monticello a couple of months ago. I had old R6's and it had standing water in alot of places and was misting and cold. I was very cautious, especially since the place is all Armco, with zero hay bales, tires, nothing. I decided to park it when it started to rain like hell.

Olitho

I run with everything off.

I think many people have a misguided belief that AH will save them in situations like this. Don't count on it. In fact, if you are an inexperienced driver having AH on means that if something does happen it will just happen at a higher speed.

At a low level AH is a bit like a safety net for the inexperienced, but you can easily drive past the limits of AH to save you, especially if conditions are not good.

I should point out that SLandstra is an excellent driver so I don't mean to infer anything about his driving in this situation. My main point si that if you are a new driver, don't put an over-reliance on AH and TC.

SLandstra_Z06

I normally run with everything off. I think on a wet track that might not be the right thing to do. I won't be running on wet tracks in the future, anyway. In dry conditions, all AH and TC off.

Everett Ogilvie

This is very well put Steve - personally, I am the type who can easily get in a rush, and as you point out bad things can happen when one loses focus. I am very sorry to hear about your car, and the Phoenix boys will have it better than new in no time, and we are all especially glad that you are OK.

Everett

shakedown067

You know, I never really thought about that. Great info. Sorry to hear about the car, but at least you've learned from it. Signs of a good driver.

the blur

I have to tell you guys..
about 5 years ago, I went off in the rain, hit nothing, came inches from the armco. 2" !!! scared the **** out of me. rear just came out from under me. whole car snapped around to the inside, in a mili-second.

Track was wet, with street tires, I thought I was the hot shot.
rocks and grass got lodged in my tire bead, and 2 tires were out of balance from the gravel. otherwise nothing happened. I was so lucky. no one was watching over me, I was just LUCKY. nothing more.
Cost me $50 to have 2 tires dismounted, and rebalanced.

I made a pack, with my 4 track pals.
#1, we will not drive over our heads.
#2, it's ok to drive 80%
#3, Leave the AH on, what do you have to prove ???
#4, we will ALWAYS bring the car home in one piece.
#5, We are not racing. we are having fun, not competing
#6, we have families to come home too.

We have all never went off track since.
period ended.

you can flame me all you want, but until it happens to you, you don't know the feeling of just how fast it happens.

95jersey

I had a similiar situation in heavy downpours at Summit point in the spring. It was a steady heavy constant rain (to the point where R compound tires were out). So I was running on street tires at a very slow and easy pace and if you are familiar with Summit, just before coming under the bridge you go throug a fast right hander and run out of space quickly. I was only going maybe 60mph, (normaly tapping heavy into 3rd gear) and the car just went completely sideways like it was on ice. I tried to make a quick correction that didn't do anything, BUT I did leave traction control on and BEFORE the slide got really bad, the traction control jumped in, applied braking to specific wheel, totaly cut power to the engine and put the car in a perfect strait line within MILI-SECONDS of it engaging.

I was running with BMW and had one of their instructors in the car and we were AMAZED at how the AH took us from absolute sure impending disaster to back on track in a straight line. We talked about it in the paddock on how well it worked. Now I wasn't going 100mph+, but in heavy rain, I personally would never drive over 100mph in a downpour even on full wets.

But for this reason in wet, I run full traction control on, and in dry 99% of the time I run in competitive mode. I have been doing this for many years with over 100+ track days and know I would be faster with everything off and save more brake pads, but for me losing my $65k C6Z would mean the very end of my hobbie, so like my motorcross riding, I ride like I have everything to loose.

I found this doesn't mean you need to be slow or be overly cautious, but rather pick and choose the portions of the track where you are comfortable pushing, but slow down in areas that have poor safety issues. Like the Glen for instance, I will tear through certian sections, but give tons of points bye's going through the esses.

Again, glad to hear you came out OK.

mikahb

Steve, very glad that you're okay, sorry about the car. Learning a lot from it is the best you can do, and sounds like you've hit on a HUGE lesson that many of us tend to lose sight of at one time or another. At races, I could often spot guys who were fated to have mechanical failures or other problems throughout the weekend because they were the ones always one step behind - late to the drivers meeting, scrambling to make grid, working on the car in their driving suits, etc. Do your work ahead of time, and never go out there with your focus on anything other than what you're doing.

One note to many HPDE guys about rain - invest in an extra set of wheels and some Hoosier rain tires. Running in the rain can be very fun and rewarding if you have the right equipment. Figure you'll only use them once or twice throughout a season so that one set will probably last you several years. There's nothing magic about driving in the rain - you just go slower and find all the ways you're not smooth!

Datawiz

Same thing happened to me at Lincoln. I was one of six drivers who had a "dry" run and I still got bit by the "red mist". Car went around on the first turn. Had I run in competition mode along with some more discipline, I likely would have finished 5th instead of 39th.