Basil2000

anyone have any experience attending any of these events? i have a c7z that i have been tracking for a few years. i have 2 teenage boys that race mountain bikes every weekend and its hard for me to break away for a weekend HPDE. in a few years they will be away to college and my weekends will be free to go from track to track. these events appeal to me because they are during the week and inexpensive. allowing me to still get my track fix. are these events safe and would you recommend?

duk007

I think it depends on who is running the event. The SCCA people that run my home track Pitt Race, are great. The event is well run and we rarely have issues of any kind. Sometimes there are guys that are running in the wrong class, or think that since they have a fast car that they should be in the advanced group, but it’s pretty rare . It’s a laid back and fun $150 track time. I’ve got some friends out on the track because of these events that would not have otherwise gone to a PDE. It’s a great intro to track days as well as a cheap track time for veterans.

BEZ06

I haven't been to an SCCA TNIA (Track Night In America), but do a search and you'll find a few threads that discuss these events.

The one thing to keep in mind if you attend is that these events definitely ARE NOT HPDE type track events!!

Apparently people who may have never been on a track before just show up, sign up for any run group their ego says they should run in, there's no tech inspection, no classroom instruction, and no in-car instructors.

So....it might not be too bad, but if you attend just keep in mind that you may be running with people who really may not know WTH they're doing out there on the track!!

I'm really surprised that the SCCA puts on events like these with absolutely no "teaching" involved.

Let us know how it was after you attend one.

.

Sox-Fan

I've done several of them.

My experience has been that they do not just let anyone show up with no experience and run n any group they want to run in. If you sign up for intermediate or advanced they very carefully ask you for your experience and I have seen them move people down contingent upon the answer.

It is true that there is no tech, no in car instructors. There are parade laps for the beginner group and there are meetings for all groups before and between sessions. The beginners are instructed on flags, hand signals and point by locations before the start.

The gentleman that runs the entire program was an SCCA instructor who was very badly injured in a wreck. He's trying to make a program in which people can be exposed to track days in a stuctured non competitive environment where there isn't a need for one on one instructors and the inherent risk in that. You're right, it isn't HDPE nor is it meant to be. From what I have seen in the number of events I have driven with them, they do a pretty darned good job of hitting their goal.

duk007

I agree with Sox-Fan, it’s a great program that gets more people exposed to the sport as well as gets people who are already “in the know” some additional track time. There are yahoo’s that show up at any event, I’ve been out with several well respected groups and there is always “that guy”, and the TNia program is no different. It just gives another opportunity for the general public to get involved. You would be surprised how many people show up just to watch and have no idea that there are HPDE’s available . Sure an in car instructor program is better (I’m an instructor in one) , but those programs don’t do any good if the general public doesn’t know they exist. And the TNiA program lets advanced drivers ride with beginners to get them on the right track. The beginners do a follow the leader for the first 2 sessions followed by classroom downloads. They are barely going faster that highway speeds , but everyone I’ve seen come out of each session with a big smile on their face.


It’s not an HPDE, it’s a different program.

Go and see for yourself, I think it is exactly what you are looking for. I bet you’ll enjoy yourself, I know I have a hard time finding a better way to spend my Wednesday afternoon.

BrunoTheMellow

Yes safe. They've never had a vehicle to vehicle incident. I've gone to every event since their start 3 years back for my local track. Just don't drive like a jackass and if you see someone driving like a jackass just give them their space. There is a lot of people who have never driven on track but as long as you're in the intermediate or advanced groups, you'll be fine. From doing other track day companies, it seems track night intermediate is really novice in the other groups.

BrunoTheMellow

That's where different locations must differ because my North Texas local events do not AT ALL try to class people correctly. If the classes are too full, they will watch the first sessions and move people up as needed (never seen a higher class be more full than a lower one). When I used to run in the intermediate group, there was a guy with a gtr that put himself in that group and had never driven on track. He ignored all flags and had a huge line behind him. This isn't an isolated event.

There is indeed a short safety briefing and a parade lap. But other than that, guys are free to mess up. They do keep an eye on you on the track though. If you pass without being pointed by, for example, or go off track, they will pull you off and talk to you.

Other than the woes from the freedom to self class , for $125 (almost always a $25 off coupon), it is a good deal for 1.5 hours of track time. Pm and I can get you the one for this coming months event. Yeah instructors would be better but that would severely decrease the number of people per event and increase price and time. The best thing is, no need to take a vacation day or tie up a full day on the weekend.

apex26

It obviously must vary from local group to local group. The one I attended allowed signing up in any group which led to numerous beginners in the advanced group and chaos on the track. People pointing the wrong way (including straight up), long frustrating trains, (egos refusing to let faster cars by) and some cars that were highly questionable. I vowed to never go back. But, other areas people report very fine results. Try one. I intend to give them another try now that they have some experience.

Sox-Fan

Sounds like a mess. Try as they might Jon and Shea cannot be at every event. The program has just grown too large for them to attend every event personally. They cannot fix what they don't know about. If ever you run into that you need to be sure to let them know. The way to fix issues is to make sure that the people that fix them know about them.
https://www.tracknightinamerica.com/pages/ask-jack or email jack@tracknightinamerica.com

Dan H.

I've had mixed results, I've seen the full range of "I can't believe what I'm seeing" all the way to "That event went pretty well". I've only been to Pocono with this group. I don't really like Pocono, that said its close to home and a decent way to spend a half a vacation day mid week. The lack of governance on registration/run groups is the biggest challenge for TNIA.

Like others have said its one layer removed from an organized DE event (intermediate is novice for example). I've had all kinds of conversations with people and heard things like
"I have a C7, I'm not letting that car pass me"
"I ran one of these last year so I'm Intermediate now"
"This is my first time doing this" (Guy in M4 signed up for Advanced)

One of the things that surprised me most was that people who liked doing these didn't know anything about the DE world, they thought TNIA was the only way on track. I spent a lot of time telling people about MSR and Chin and if they like this, they should try that. You'd think SCCA would want drivers to progress to PDX.

I wouldn't travel for one of these, I would play hooky for an afternoon for some cheap go fast. I think the responsibility is on us as the driver and we have to manage our SA when running a with this group. I adjust my SA to be more sensitive keeping in mind lower skill level and less predictability of others on track.

KnightDriveTV

Sounds like my kind of event

In honesty, few people jump on track and have never been on a track prior. Plus, if you are a person with a presence, you can take control of an event pretty easily and lay out some ground rules.

I put on car events that were very inexperienced level people....you just have to communicate and lay out what is expected. You're dealing with enthusiasts who are starting out...they tend to be pretty reserved.

NOW, that said...I did do a flashlight drags event on a straightaway of a road course. Once the finish line was crossed, the "drag racers" were tasked with driving around the course back to the start line. Well, let me just say, they suddenly decided to become road racers with their hand on the gear shift and other hand at the 12 oclock position. We had to shut the event down because of accidents and cars in the grass....on the way back around...

I think events like that, are what's missing. You need 150 track days to get people out there, and road courses struggle to book anything on the weekdays. It's a match made in heaven if you ask me.

Justin Barbry

The TNiA program is working hard this year to offer more events at more popular tracks. We are hoping to see more consistency with regards to everyone event experience across the country, but this is obviously difficult from a staffing position. To keep the program budget in the green the SCCA has to enlist local help to manage and coach the events. Different regions have different needs and different tracks present different challenges (some tracks have plenty of passing zones, some don't causing more traffic issues). I'll be managing or coaching at most of the events in the Ga, SC, NC areas. We've got everything from Nascar rovals to long and short road courses and it takes different approaches to make the package consistent across all the possibilities. We now have a couple of year's worth of experience putting these on and I can honestly say the package has become much better. If you haven't returned because of a bad experience before...send a message about it and maybe come try again. It is different than traditional HPDE, but it offers a perfect opportunity for experienced track rats to unwind from a rough day at work or an excellent chance to bring that friend or family member out for their first track experience.

dfettero

I did TNIA last fall at the Charlotte Roval. Well organized and run. Signed up for 4/19 at my local track - Dominion Raceway in VA

Basil2000

Justin Barbry

That Charlotte event and the Dominion event have the same event manager. He has more experience putting on track events than anyone else I know. I think you will have good time.

JDub64

I attended the fall event in Charlotte as well and have signed up for June. I agree that it was well-run and "felt" safe.

To give you an idea of their philosophy -
I asked the TNIA lead (sorry - I don't remember his name) for advice getting through one particular corner and he politely declined. He said they couldn't give any instruction at all, and that the purpose of the event wasn't to try to achieve the best time, but rather to experience driving on a track safely.

Remember, though - it's still a track, so I'd follow the track prep instructions in the owner's manual. GM won't care that it wasn't an HPDE if they receive a warranty claim.

John

KnightDriveTV

No track nights in Las Vegas at either track...wtf....

Justin Barbry

Sometimes it is just scheduling conflicts and sometimes it's just not financially possible. They are trying to keep the participation numbers for each track to a reasonable amount to avoid overcrowding the track which takes away from the fun. That sets a pretty firm budget based on entries and sometimes the bottom line just doesn't work. VIR is my home track and we haven't been able to work that one out yet either, but I can assure you that they are working very hard on expanding where they can.

KnightDriveTV

^ Yeah, I organized a couple events at Beaverun back in the day (Pittrace now). It's definitely all about the track management working with what you can bring to the table. Frankly though, I'm surprised there aren't more of these events, as tracks struggle to book anything on weekdays, much less evenings.

The challenges I had were simply the cost of staffing, track workers, etc. Initially the track wanted 17,500.00 for the day. I was able to work some costs, involve another car club and ended up well in the profit zone. I brought over 160 cars as well so....but it was MEGA cheap.

davidfarmer

I cannot tell you how strongly I HATE these events. I've seen the poor driving quality as a spectator since there are events at Charlotte Motors Speedway (very close to me), and they actively prevent instruction.

A neighbor is going, and we talked about me riding along and giving him some pointers. I emailed the promotor, and was told specifically that they don't want instructors helping the drivers. They claim instructors "push you outside of your comfort level" and they would rather you figure it out on your own.

I've been racing, driving, instructing for 25+ years, and this is total BS! Not sure if they just don't want to give free track time to instructors, or what, but sending novices out on Charlotte Motor Speedway with nothing more than a lead/follow to get familiar with the track is reckless.