b_pappy

I'm looking at '66 coupe with a 1970 "CE" 427. The car was originally a 427/425 HP car, but that engine appears long gone. I had a very knowledgable friend go over the car with a fine tooth comb. (checking numbers, date codes, bonding strips, history & retoration photos, etc) Most everything else is correct. Anyhow, what would be the horsepower of the "CE" engine? Someone told me all CE engines were 390 horse. After the car is safely home in my garage I'll ask the next obvious question; "how do I get my 35 HP back?"
Bruce (getting closer to being a C2 owner)

63Corvette

Disclaimer: I AM NOT AN EXPERT!

However, the 390 and 425/435 are completely different animals. BLOCK

427/390= 2 bolt mains, "hiperf pass" on the bellhousing end, and the oil pressure takeoff in the center over the oil filter.

427/435= 4 bolt mains, "hiperf" (NO pass) on the bell housing end, and a 3/4" pipe plug in the middle of the oil filter housing. The oil pressure take off is about an inch in front of the oil filter housing.

HEADS: 390=oval, 435=rectangular

Hope this helps.

b_pappy

Thanks Garrett, I didn't realize there were so many differences between the motors. Can someone confirm a "CE" is just a 390 HP engine? Also, does anyone have a reference book or photos showing these two areas?
Bruce

AZDoug

CE generally means Crate Engine, as in a engine or shortblock block purchased/supplied from the factory, you could have about anything in there, including a 396 or 454.

Most of the 1970 and later motors has three letter designations, like CQV or such, not sure about earlier ones.

Doug

DansYellow66

If the motor looks to be stock GM, then the intake manifold would be a first clue. A 427/425 would have an aluminum manifold - a 390 cast iron. A 427/425 should have a mechanical cam which makes some valve train noise - but cams get changed out over the years. I'm no expert on CE motors either but the 427/425 motor was around for many years as a performance mainstay and could be bought over the counter as witnessed by many of the 396 to 427 conversions done by various Chevrolet dealers. Some bought 396/375 cars and just swapped the block for a 427 short block, but others yanked the whole motor and put in a complete 427 motor. Probably the easiest way to check is to pull a valve cover and check the head number for a rectangular port or oval port.

Dan

achapman

"CE" is most recognized as "Chevrolet Exchange" for warrenty purposes.

Birdball

my 66 390 horse came with a CE 427 (1968) and it was a 425 horse motor. It had 4 bolt mains 11:1, square port heads, etc...

One easier way to see what you have is to check your head casting numbers and look at www.mortec.com and see if you have closed chamber square port heads-then you will most likely you will have 11:1 pistons; or if you have oval port open chamber heads you probably have 10.25:1 390 horse pistons. Also while you have the valve cover off, check and see if your rockers are preloaded onto the lifter (hydro cam) or if you have lash in there (solid cam). Of course, you still won't know for sure because someone put a 390 horse hydro cam in my solid cam square port motor .....

ctjackster

Based on what I have read here and "over there" CE stands for Chevrolet Engine, as far as the folks at GM were concerned. Such blocks were installed in C2s as part of the 5/50 warranty program (not to mention the fact that all over the counter "short" blocks beginning in 69 or 70 may also have been stamped CE), and the CE stamp means absolutely nothing as far as the hp goes - mostly it would depend on the engine that was being replaced under warranty. All bolt-on parts from the damaged engine were moved over tot he CE block (unless damaged in the incident giving rise to the warranty replacement engine).

And then, you have the real possibility (as we all do) that the engine was rebuilt and/or "upgraded" since it was first installed by GM or the dealer, so nothing is definite.

JohnZ

"CE"s weren't "engines" - they were short blocks (block, crank, rods, pistons, rings, bearings), and some were "fitted blocks" (block and pistons and rings, no crank or rods). They were ordered by part number (which doesn't appear anywhere on the engine) so the few innards they came with were the same as those in the block they were replacing, and everything else was transferred from the failed engine (cam, heads, valvetrain, intake, oil pump, pan, water pump, timing set and cover, etc.).

The horsepower of a "CE" 5/50 warranty replacement engine is a function of the pistons that came in the replacement short block and of all the bolt-on parts transferred from the failed engine.

b_pappy

Wow, lots of things to check. Listening to the engine, I'm pretty sure it is a hydraulic cam, haven't pulled a valve cover, but I think it had an aluminum intake manifold too, with GM P/N. Thanks for telling me the differences. I'll get back to the car, and report back.
Bruce