Somewhere and somehow my driver side front alignment shims (the back ones) have fallen out so before I can start driving I need to do the obvious.

However rather than pay someone else for a one time like it or not alignment I prefer to learn about this and then I can play with it some. ( I have never worked with wheel alignment but it is high time I learned)

I have ordered a tool for DIY from Summit along with the optional toe adjustment but I figure just like other procedures there are some better than others.... does anybody have a suggested website for info on settings or procedures? Do you take the spinners off when doing KO wheels?

Here is the tool and optional toe adjustment I ordered.

http://store.summitracing.com/egnsea...DS=1&N=700+115

http://store.summitracing.com/egnsea...DS=1&N=700+115.

Thanks in advance

Doug

 

The tools you've ordered from Summit will do a good job, but there is one more device you need to successfully use the caster/camber guage. The gadget is call a "turn plate" and you need a pair, one under each front wheel.

The reason you need these is that the use of the caster/camber guage requires that you turn the front wheels +/- 20 degrees as part of the caster measuring process. Without some way to accurately measure this 20 degree angle, you simply can't get an accurate measure of caster.

Unfortunately, turn plates aren't cheap:

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

You can sometimes find these on EPay for significantly less or, if you are clever, you could rig up something yourself.

I'm cheap, so the "turn plates" I use are pieces of plastic, two under each front wheel. the bottom plate has +/- 20 degrees marked and the top plate rotates with the front wheels due to the sticktion of the tires. I rotate the steering wheel until the top plate aligns exactly with the 20 degree marks on the bottom plate. You could do something similar.

Bottom line, you also need "turn plates".

Jim

 

Years ago when I did that stuff at home, I made turn plates from two pieces of vinyl floor tile (per side) with grease inbetween them, degrees marked with a magic-marker.

 

Well this bit of news is an unpleasant surprise

But I thank both of you for the heads up

I am going to have to give some ideas some thought and experiment with them because the commercial approach is much more than I can afford

Offhand I suppose my wheel dollies are to high and the casters would not turn as needed....... maybe some cookie sheets and a nylon bushing along with a little grease might work.

Thanks again

Doug

 

I will try and explain the three basic items that are set during a standard alignment.
It was explained to me by an old timer back when I wasn't an old timer.

Camber is the tilt of the tire in a vertical plane toward or away from the engine measured in degrees.
If the top of the tire is tilted outward it is called positive camber and if tilted inward it is negative camber.
Camber will cause the tires to wear on one edge only.
If you ever seen a car who has a raised front end, the tire normally goes negative camber.

Toe is the tires either pointed in toward one another or pointed away from one another in a horizontal plane measured in fraction of inches. If someone’s toes are pointed toward each other then that is toe-in, if they are pointed away from each other then it is toe-out. So if you tires are pointed inward you have toe-in and if pointed outward then you have toe-out.
Normally you want 1/16” to 1/8” toe-in.
Misadjusted toe will cause rapid tire wear and will sometimes cause tire squeal.

Caster is the most misunderstood.
If you draw an imaginary line through the upper and lower ball joint and measure it in degrees you have caster.
Picture a shopping cart front wheel. Notice the axle is behind the pivot and when you push the cart the tire always follows, this is negative caster.
Now picture a bicycle fork. Its axle is in front of the pivot point and when you ride your bike and take you hands off the handle bars the wheel tracks by it self. It wants to stay forward, this is positive caster.
Now draw an imaginary line through the pivot point and the axle and imagine the axle is the lower ball joint and the pivot is the upper ball joint. In the case of the shopping cart the line slops front to back, /, negative caster and on the bicycle it goes back to front, \ , positive caster.
If the upper ball joint is directly above the lower you have zero caster. If the upper ball is more toward the rear of the car than the lower you have positive caster.
Keep in mind that negative caster wants to follow and positive caster wants to track.
So the car will “pull” toward the side that has the lesser amount of positive caster.
This is why my mentor always told me to put ½ degree more positive caster on the right side then left to help counteract the crown in the road which wants to pull the car towards the curb.
Caster causes the car to pull to one side if all else is OK.
Also I had cars with too much negative caster which caused the steering wheel not to center itself after making a turn.
Joe

 

Thanks Joe....... that was very informative

In reading up on the subject it seems that since my car has been on jack stands for an extended amount of time I need to put some miles on it and then let it sit for a night before taking on this venture. I am thinking of guesstimating the missing shims for putting some miles on while the suspension settles as long as I don't feel anything overtly adverse with the handling.

Regarding the turn plates that Jim posted a link to I did find them for lower prices...... a few for $600 and one for $550..... then there is Harbor Freight who sells their model for $200. (I see where I also need plates for the rear to match the height of whatever I use up front). Just the same they are all along ways in cost from the creativity spoken of by both him and JohnZ.

It is getting deeper than I had originally thought it would be but that seems to be the standard for doing things right. I want to play with some different setups and my next project that is hoped for in February is putting some offset trailing arms on...... so the time used learning and money spent purchasing should both be good investments.

Thanks again

Doug

 

plaidside's explaination is excellent and is exactly right on the money.

that tool you pictured is for steel wheels, notice that the 3 pins index on the lip of the steel wheels, it may not work on mags, you also have to check for wheel runout. when i used to do alignments we used what were called "snap gauges" (not snap on--), these mounted magnetically to the hub itself and worked with any wheels and eleminated the effect of any wheel runout. i think summit (and other places) sell them also. if you have knock off wheels the knockoffs need to be removed so the gauges can mount to the steel hub.

the plates to measure 20 degrees in or out as mentioned above are needed, but there are many homemade solutions.

you must have a perfectly level spot to do your alignment.

set the camber on both sides first by adding or subtracting equal amounts of shims from both front and rear.

once camber is set on both sides adjust caster by keeping the same number of shims but shuffleing them as needed between front and rear.

set the toe last after camber and caster are set. when finished drive the car and if the steering wheel is slightly off you can lengthen one tie rod and shorten the other the same exact amount.

can this way of doing alignment be as accurate as the fancy computer alignments of today? absolutely, if you are careful and accurate with your readings and adjustments. this is the way it was done for many years-decades and still works today. it can be more accurate if if the computer guy is some ham-fisted goof trying to beat flat rate and doing a "that's close enough" alignment.

 

Doug,
Did you do a front end rebuild? If so make sure you do not tighten then shaft bolts near the upper and lower bushings until the weight of the car is on the wheels.
I have the turn tables and when I do an alignment I use wood under the rear wheels to level the car. If I am doing a mid-year, I cannot say C-2 anymore, I just put the tables under the rear wheels and wood under the front.
Mechron is correct on his methods. About the snap gauges, This is what I use but since it snaps onto the hub, you have to remove the dust cap, if you have mag wheels it will not work.

 

John's old school plan with vinyl floor tiles is slightly more sophisticated than the squares of linoleum I cut and greased between. The thinner the better but most anything like this will work. I've even just done it on just plain, sealed, concrete, although you have to muscle the tire through it's arc. Mechron has a good point in that you need to find the flattest piece of garage or driveway flooring you can find.

You can do the rear too, although it takes a little brainstorming on how to set the toe-in on each side. After alighning the front and setting the rear camber, I set the front tires straight ahead and stretched a fishing line between the front and rear tires by wrapping it around the spinners. Then I measured the front track and rear track dimensions for the difference and figured how much inward deflection I needed from the fishing line at a 5 ft. distance forward of the center of the wheel for the correct R and L toe setting. Then by laying my straightedge across the sidewall of the tire at the hub center and measuring the deviation from the fishing line at 5 ft. I shimmed the trailing arms to wiggle in the correct toe-in. Afterwards, check the total toe-in with the gage as a check. Others have probably come up with other ideas to accomplish the same - seems I remember someone posted a really well thought out method of doing this a couple years ago. It may not be perfect or suitable for the track but my car tracks fine and handles well.

If something has happened to cause your rear suspension to fail to track square with the front suspension - scratch the above. You will probably need the help of an alignment rack.

Dan

 

One more point on frictionless plates: They also allow the tires to slide sideways. Without the frictionless plates, if you jack the car up and set it down without rolling it, it won't settle to the proper ride height.

 

Lots of good info here and I am going to print it all out so I can go over it while I am in the garage

Overall my suspension is in good shape and I had a frame off restoration done three years and 3000 miles ago. However there was a lot of things left loose including all of the alignment shims front and rear (maybe a result of different guys hired for the assembly by the "last shop" that had the car.... long story on the restoration ordeal as the first shop had all of their cars impounded and I was lucky to not loose my car)

However the car did track straight up until right before I blew the motor and when the one set of shims fell out. My only real handling complaint was the excessive wheelspin trying to accelerate out of a corner.

First thing is going to see if the garage floor is level enough while letting the suspension get used to sitting on the ground again

Bottom line is that there is no rust, everything is straight and all the bolts come out easy enough. While I have been posting this Fed X dropped off the tools I ordered and I am anxious to play with them some while I get some other stuff done on the car today

Thanks again to all for the tremendous amount of help

Doug