winter storage outside problem
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 6,209
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From: Texas-out west
winter storage outside problem
unfortunately, I have to store a car outside in winter. temps could get down in teens but usually only low 20s thru february. Motor is 350, no radiator in car, car is covered with car cover but that is it.
Problem: car will not run so can not circulate anti-freeze thru motor to protect, radiator not in car, unknown if any water remains in motor(was before became unrunable (is that a word) without radiator in it for short time.
Question: if I pour anti-freeze thru top rad hose connection and do so until it runs out bottom hose connection will it be entire block or????? I don't want to have block crack. Any other suggestions-remember car can not be moved. thanks.
Problem: car will not run so can not circulate anti-freeze thru motor to protect, radiator not in car, unknown if any water remains in motor(was before became unrunable (is that a word) without radiator in it for short time.
Question: if I pour anti-freeze thru top rad hose connection and do so until it runs out bottom hose connection will it be entire block or????? I don't want to have block crack. Any other suggestions-remember car can not be moved. thanks.
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I'd probably remove the drain plugs at the sides of the block and drain it along with the rad, then replace them and fill both with an antifreeze mixed 50/50 with distilled water. You could rig something to blow out the block with air before filling to try and get all the water out. Fill through the thermostat port on the manifold, but you might want to block off the hose outlets while you do.
If there was just water in it, make sure you drain the heater core as well.
If there was just water in it, make sure you drain the heater core as well.
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If the lower rad hose is off, there is very little water/coolant left in block, maybe 1 gallon out of 4 originally in the system.
it won't crack, as there is plenty of expansion room if ice forms.
Doug
it won't crack, as there is plenty of expansion room if ice forms.
Doug
Team Owner
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From: Greenville, Indiana
I'd pull the block plugs and drain it. If you can't get to the block plugs, raise the back of the car with a jack and let drain what will out the water pump. Let the back end of the car down and then refill the cooling system with straight anti freeze with the lower hose blocked off.
You can also go buy a cheap pump from a place like harbor freight and circulate the coolant via the heater hoses.
I don't know where you live but it's been in the teens/close to single digits at night here and not above freezing the last few days. You may be too late.
Last edited by MikeM; Dec 8, 2010 at 08:28 AM.
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Army
I believe they have sold dipstick heaters for years. You plug it in, place it in your motor and it should keep things warm enough...quite popular in cold environments.
http://www.amazon.com/Kats-15200-Dipstick-Style-Heater/dp/B000BO74DG
You don't necessarily have to have oil in the car for it to work well enough..
I have known some folks to throw a cheap electric blanket over their motors in the winter...
http://www.amazon.com/Kats-24150-Watt-Universal-Heater/dp/B000I8TQD6/ref=pd_sim_auto_4
It doesn't take too much to raise the temp if you are out of the wind...these items are
very cheap to operate and you could do both for under $50. Some folks do both in case one or the other item should malfunction.
I've even used a plain old droplight
strung beside a block to keep things warm overnight.
Finally, back when I was poor (I mean REALLY poor) and had to choose between buying gas to get to work and anti-freeze. I used to drain the block on my 283 1960 Impala in the driveway each night and refill it from the water hose each morning. Did that for a month in low 30* high 20* temps with no problem. Never even blew a freeze plug.
Its funny to think back on it now...
http://www.amazon.com/Kats-15200-Dipstick-Style-Heater/dp/B000BO74DG
You don't necessarily have to have oil in the car for it to work well enough..
I have known some folks to throw a cheap electric blanket over their motors in the winter...
http://www.amazon.com/Kats-24150-Watt-Universal-Heater/dp/B000I8TQD6/ref=pd_sim_auto_4
It doesn't take too much to raise the temp if you are out of the wind...these items are
very cheap to operate and you could do both for under $50. Some folks do both in case one or the other item should malfunction.
I've even used a plain old droplight
strung beside a block to keep things warm overnight.
Finally, back when I was poor (I mean REALLY poor) and had to choose between buying gas to get to work and anti-freeze. I used to drain the block on my 283 1960 Impala in the driveway each night and refill it from the water hose each morning. Did that for a month in low 30* high 20* temps with no problem. Never even blew a freeze plug.
Its funny to think back on it now...
Last edited by Frankie the Fink; Dec 8, 2010 at 08:40 AM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jun 2006
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From: DFW
Surprised no one has mentioned removing the thermostat before trying to circulate any coolant... it will certainly be closed. Using the heater hoses for circulating coolant may bypass the thermostat, making removal unnecessary.
You'll never get all of the old coolant out, however if it had antifreeze in the system to start with, you should be OK doing nothing. Antifreeze doesn't go bad, just the corrosion inhibitors in it...
Harry
You'll never get all of the old coolant out, however if it had antifreeze in the system to start with, you should be OK doing nothing. Antifreeze doesn't go bad, just the corrosion inhibitors in it...
Harry
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2008
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From: Philadelphia Pa
I believe they have sold dipstick heaters for years. You plug it in, place it in your motor and it should keep things warm enough...quite popular in cold environments.
http://www.amazon.com/Kats-15200-Dipstick-Style-Heater/dp/B000BO74DG
You don't necessarily have to have oil in the car for it to work well enough..
I have known some folks to throw a cheap electric blanket over their motors in the winter...
http://www.amazon.com/Kats-24150-Watt-Universal-Heater/dp/B000I8TQD6/ref=pd_sim_auto_4
It doesn't take too much to raise the temp if you are out of the wind...these items are
very cheap to operate and you could do both for under $50. Some folks do both in case one or the other item should malfunction.
I've even used a plain old droplight
strung beside a block to keep things warm overnight.
Finally, back when I was poor (I mean REALLY poor) and had to choose between buying gas to get to work and anti-freeze. I used to drain the block on my 283 1960 Impala in the driveway each night and refill it from the water hose each morning. Did that for a month in low 30* high 20* temps with no problem. Never even blew a freeze plug.
Its funny to think back on it now...
http://www.amazon.com/Kats-15200-Dipstick-Style-Heater/dp/B000BO74DG
You don't necessarily have to have oil in the car for it to work well enough..
I have known some folks to throw a cheap electric blanket over their motors in the winter...
http://www.amazon.com/Kats-24150-Watt-Universal-Heater/dp/B000I8TQD6/ref=pd_sim_auto_4
It doesn't take too much to raise the temp if you are out of the wind...these items are
very cheap to operate and you could do both for under $50. Some folks do both in case one or the other item should malfunction.
I've even used a plain old droplight
strung beside a block to keep things warm overnight.
Finally, back when I was poor (I mean REALLY poor) and had to choose between buying gas to get to work and anti-freeze. I used to drain the block on my 283 1960 Impala in the driveway each night and refill it from the water hose each morning. Did that for a month in low 30* high 20* temps with no problem. Never even blew a freeze plug.
Its funny to think back on it now...
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 821
Likes: 42
From: Spring, Texas
All you really need to do is avoid a "hard" freeze event, such as sitting at below freezing temps for days and days. A cheap electric blanket with a thermostat to cover the engine, or similar "heater" connected to a timer set to come on when it will be the coldest and go off a few hours later. I've been in a similar spot a few times with projects, and would use anything that safely generated enough heat to keep things from freezing. In the engine compartment, hood down, covered, doesn't take a lot of heat. A small heat lamp, electric blanket, etc. I had a BB car once i was afraid of freezing, and had visited an aircraft engine shop where they had a box of old electric pad style heaters they had stripped off air cooled aircraft ngines and they gave me a cople of old ones so I used a little glue, attached one on each side of the block, wired them up on a timer and presto, instant heat when I needed it and where I needed it. When spring came, pulled them off and that was that. Whatever you decide to try, not too hot so as to start a fire or melt stuff...
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Army
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Frankie those electric things are great unless the power goes out, which it has a tendency to do with ice storms and the like, remember...
, just sayin z'all...
, just sayin z'all...
Burning Brakes
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From: Ontario
Bill Purdy
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Le Mans Master
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From: Texas-out west
I will have to try and get the drain plugs out and put straight anti-freeze in as I have no way to get electrical power to it, in a storage lot, not at house unfortunately. Note: car is in west texas on the plains.
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2000
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From: Texas-out west
Frankie, never heard of anyone draining water overnight and refill next day, that is worst than changing a head on big block in winter in apartment parking lot while it was sleeting and snowing in Arkansas as I did once.
ah, but I was young, stupid and only 20 years old and it was my only car needed for work/school.
ah, but I was young, stupid and only 20 years old and it was my only car needed for work/school.
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If the lower hose is off, the water level is about at deck height at the rear outside of the motor, the heads and block water jacket at the inside top of the cylinders are empty.
Pulling the heads with the lower hose off,a nd water pump on car, yields a spill of about 1 pint per side.
If the OP is uncomfortable, add some antifreeze as others have suggested.
I have stored motors in car in MT for the winter with no radiator,a nd fluid in the block with no problems. Though the fluid was probably not straight water.
Yes, come to think of it, the couple times I did this, the fluid was an antifreeze mix left in the block and wouldn't have frozen.
Doug
Last edited by AZDoug; Dec 8, 2010 at 03:30 PM.
Racer
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In the original posters situation, he probably should pull the drain plugs to prevent damage from freezing! Especially if he is not sure if it is water or anti-freeze is remaining.
For those just changing the anti-freeze. If you just flush the block without pulling the drain plugs, you will have almost 2 gallons of un-distilled water left in the system. Probably not a good idea!
Jon
Last edited by jfr's 63swc; Dec 8, 2010 at 03:32 PM.
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There are a couple of quarts of coolant trapped in the cylinder water jackets on each side, and they're not cross-connected. Remove the drain plug on each side, just above the pan rail, drain (after poking in the hole to make sure it'll drain), and leave it for the winter. With no water in it, it won't freeze.
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Le Mans Master
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From: Texas-out west
checked today and there is some anti-freeze in it, must be above +20 or so because that is best I can determine with my tester....I did pour a gallon in through the thermostat hole and will go out tomorrow and drain if possible from block plugs...radiator in car and could hear new anti-freeze gurgle into it. I still have some days before we get into hard freeze nights time. thanks for help......car is completely covered with cover and tarps from harbor freight over that.