Need torque number
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 850
Likes: 15
From: Vero Beach Florida
Need torque number
Recently purchased '64 coupe and while going over discovered slight freeplay in drivers side rear hub between hub spindle and spindle flange. This connection has a nut with a cotter pin keeping it in place. I have ordered manuals for car but they are not in yet, therefore I'd really appreciate it if anyone could tell me the torque amount that this nut should be tightened to. One other question is, if I do retorque this nut will I be changing any pressures on the wheel bearings? Thanks in advance in any info you can give me. Mike
Race Director
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The correct torque is 100 ft/lb plus whatever is required to align the cotter pin holes, but if you find that the existing torque is below this value it would infer incorrect assembly or excessive deterioration.
If the nut is already at the correct torque value, it's time for a rebuild.
The assemblies where originally said to be sealed for life, but experience shows that they should be disassembled and inspected every 30-40K miles or so.
If the nut is already at the correct torque value, it's time for a rebuild.
The assemblies where originally said to be sealed for life, but experience shows that they should be disassembled and inspected every 30-40K miles or so.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 850
Likes: 15
From: Vero Beach Florida
The correct torque is 100 ft/lb plus whatever is required to align the cotter pin holes, but if you find that the existing torque is below this value it would infer incorrect assembly or excessive deterioration.
If the nut is already at the correct torque value, it's time for a rebuild.
The assemblies where originally said to be sealed for life, but experience shows that they should be disassembled and inspected every 30-40K miles or so.
If the nut is already at the correct torque value, it's time for a rebuild.
The assemblies where originally said to be sealed for life, but experience shows that they should be disassembled and inspected every 30-40K miles or so.
If I torque this nut to 100ft/lbs will I be placing excessive pressure on the bearings/races, or the nut to spindle has nothing to do with that?
Last edited by VeroWing; Jul 4, 2012 at 11:50 AM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 9,016
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From: Southeast Missouri
If the nut came loose that easily, I'd suspect that the bevel washer used under the nut (assuming there was one there) gave out on you. I wouldn't retorque the nut without installing a new washer. I think I've also mentioned that aspect of your problem in your other thread regarding your loose spindle. But, it could also result from a problem with the bearings and/or spacers as well I'd think. And, if the car has been run for any appreciable length of time with play in the splined connection, it's also possible that it has wallowed out the splines to an extent.
I'd send it in to be rebuilt. My $0.02
I'd send it in to be rebuilt. My $0.02
Last edited by Ron Miller; Jul 4, 2012 at 11:55 AM.
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The nut has everything to do with keeping the outer bearing, spacers, inner bearing, washer and flange very tightly assembled eliminating any possible relative movement. This is in addition to the tight fit of the bearing races themselves. Being that someone has recently been 'restored' there's no telling what's going on without disassembly.
Here's a cross section to help visualize:
Here's a cross section to help visualize:
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 850
Likes: 15
From: Vero Beach Florida
If the nut came loose that easily, I'd suspect that the bevel washer used under the nut (assuming there was one there) gave out on you. I wouldn't retorque the nut without installing a new washer. I think I've also mentioned that aspect of your problem in your other thread regarding your loose spindle. But, it could also result from a problem with the bearings and/or spacers as well I'd think. And, if the car has been run for any appreciable length of time with play in the splined connection, it's also possible that it has wallowed out the splines to an extent.
I'd send it in to be rebuilt. My $0.02
I'd send it in to be rebuilt. My $0.02
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 999
Likes: 97
From: Captain Cook Hawaii
IMHO; after you retorque the spindle nut check the in and out play of the spindle. spec should be .001 to .008 or .002 to .007. A drum brake can tolerate the high side of the spec. This end float/in and out play is important.
Brgds,
Rene
Brgds,
Rene
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Jun 2004
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From: Southeast Missouri
I should have mentioned it earlier, but you can pull the drive flange from the assembly once the nut and washer are removed. The flange should slide right off, give you a chance to inspect the splines on the flange at least. Not sure, but you may be able to see the splines on the spindle/axle as well with the flange removed.
The remainder of the assembly is a press fit, however. It has to be pressed apart for disassembly.
I'm outta here, let us know what you eventually find . . . .
The remainder of the assembly is a press fit, however. It has to be pressed apart for disassembly.
I'm outta here, let us know what you eventually find . . . .
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 850
Likes: 15
From: Vero Beach Florida
I should have mentioned it earlier, but you can pull the drive flange from the assembly once the nut and washer are removed. The flange should slide right off, give you a chance to inspect the splines on the flange at least. Not sure, but you may be able to see the splines on the spindle/axle as well with the flange removed.
The remainder of the assembly is a press fit, however. It has to be pressed apart for disassembly.
I'm outta here, let us know what you eventually find . . . .
The remainder of the assembly is a press fit, however. It has to be pressed apart for disassembly.
I'm outta here, let us know what you eventually find . . . .
I walked away at that point, and will wait for my manuals to arrive before going further. Perhaps it was assembled using disc brake specs or just not assembled correctly. I'm in the dark until I have manuals to refer to, so I'll just see if I can find other possible problem areas that may need attention. Sure appreciate the help, Mike.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 9,016
Likes: 331
From: Southeast Missouri
That's sure what it sounds like. And that would explain why the assembler didn't tighten the castellated nut per specifications. Sounds like he may have left it loose so as not to bind the spindle. In any event, it sounds like it's gonna have to come apart to see exactly what the problem is, be set up again properly, and perhaps need new bearings as well.That's gonna require pressing apart. Again, I'd send the assembly off to be rebuilt.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2005
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From: Captain Cook Hawaii
IF you do not have the proper end play and the spindle will not turn, stop. Now you must decide if you want to set up the spindle yourself or farm it out. Special tools are required.
Keep us informed and consider checking the other side.
On another note: see if the spindle will pullout of the spindle support by hand or a SMALL amout of force. Sometimes the spindles are turned for a slip fit of the bearings.
Brgds;
Rene
Keep us informed and consider checking the other side.
On another note: see if the spindle will pullout of the spindle support by hand or a SMALL amout of force. Sometimes the spindles are turned for a slip fit of the bearings.
Brgds;
Rene
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 850
Likes: 15
From: Vero Beach Florida
IF you do not have the proper end play and the spindle will not turn, stop. Now you must decide if you want to set up the spindle yourself or farm it out. Special tools are required.
Keep us informed and consider checking the other side.
On another note: see if the spindle will pullout of the spindle support by hand or a SMALL amout of force. Sometimes the spindles are turned for a slip fit of the bearings.
Brgds;
Rene
Keep us informed and consider checking the other side.
On another note: see if the spindle will pullout of the spindle support by hand or a SMALL amout of force. Sometimes the spindles are turned for a slip fit of the bearings.
Brgds;
Rene
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 999
Likes: 97
From: Captain Cook Hawaii
If you have access to a slide hammer you could attach it to the wheel studs and gently tap it out, or tap it out from the flange side with a thread protector on the spindle. If it moved an inch by hand it should come out. Once it is out remove the seals from the spindle support and then remove the inner races of the bearings, the spacer and any shims. Inspect everything. You now have a good visual of how the bearings inner races are spaced with the spacer and shims. Let us know the condidtion of the bearings [inner and outer races] and the condition of the spindle and the condition of the grease. I.E, old/caked/burnt.
Brgds,
Rene
Brgds,
Rene
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 850
Likes: 15
From: Vero Beach Florida
If you have access to a slide hammer you could attach it to the wheel studs and gently tap it out, or tap it out from the flange side with a thread protector on the spindle. If it moved an inch by hand it should come out. Once it is out remove the seals from the spindle support and then remove the inner races of the bearings, the spacer and any shims. Inspect everything. You now have a good visual of how the bearings inner races are spaced with the spacer and shims. Let us know the condidtion of the bearings [inner and outer races] and the condition of the spindle and the condition of the grease. I.E, old/caked/burnt.
Brgds,
Rene
Brgds,
Rene
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