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Too keep hijacking Ted's thread......have any info on my 69 from John's Corvette's ownership by chance? Here is the registry page for my car to maybe jog someone's memory?
Over the years I have had a number of times where the link to Greenwood has been brought up.
First always have to figure out at what level of Greenwood pedigree we are discussing??
It has been awhile since I did anything further with C3 Greenwood related cars, so my notes are rusty in my head.
For everyone:
There were his Racers
His Teams Racers
Cars that he shared rides in
Customer Cars
His racers that were sold later as customer cars
Commission Cars built with his stuff
Racers cars that had stuff added
Racers bringing cars to his shop to have work done
Etc.
And then we have all of the street related vehicles!!!
PS it looks like you got some good Log Books that came with that car to have the detailed racing history you wrote up!!! Cool!
Also I never look at cool subjects as a hi jack! Almost each one of us participating here in these treads have a number of Corvettes, so a pretty serious group is on here talking to these topics! I myself am the definition of a forum member that often strays wherever the mind takes me!!!!!! I am pretty positive that the Moderators have me on permanent ignore!!!!!
Last edited by TCracingCA; 04-13-2016 at 05:07 PM.
Also because I was on the iphone thing with the small print!
Originally Posted by LTWALTHER2
TCracingCA;
Do you have a copy of the March 1970 Car Life article that details the OC team? in the specs section, it says the car has a 42 gal. rubber bladder, foam filled fuel cell, with the previously mentioned dual Stewart Warner electric fuel pumps. ATL does not list anything like this as per Speedway online catalog. I think this just adds to my confusion...
Take care,
TED
One other comment that I didn't fit in, was the possibility of one little magazine typo error changing 32 to 42. It wouldn't be the first time that has happened!!!! Thus creating the unique fitted 42 gallon tank mystery here in the great world of Corvette discussions 46 years later!
Oh maybe one more comment, I have never had cause to explore the minute rules modifications of the famous racers. Looking into Gas tank regulations won't necessarily be my thing. A period correct 32 ATL or Fuel Safe unit would be perfectly acceptable to me in any level of famous car racer, but I also have the FIA historic Rules somewhere in my house as to what they feel is acceptable. I wouldn't doubt that that article was found and in conjunction with that picture, someone got creative in a past restoration! But then knowing the Scrutineers, they could have accepted some modification and heck maybe even seeing that the filling equipment (ability per pit stop to fuel capacity was within the fuel cap limit) or the total race allotment of fuel was restricted. Because of the Gas shortage and the negative perception toward racing during the long gas lines, a lot of things were happening during this era. Race participation was down, Organizations were in a war with each other to attract and field participants. Fuel formulas were born during this era. I know the progression of Porsche fuel tanks starting with 85 liter to 100 liter and up to keep pace. A pesky 911S or 911 ST or a 914-6 GT kicking the crap out of a powerful big block L88 beast was irritating. They did that on brakes, they did that on endurance (gas consumption), etc..
Last edited by TCracingCA; 04-13-2016 at 05:30 PM.
Forget NCRS or Bloomington Gold, that should be the way they should look!
PS Rex, I bet the hardest part of recreating the mood of this great era was finding the vintage Botany 500 outfit!
Second PS- I have in my vast collection of junk, my DX- Sunray 5 gallon Racing Gas can which I will see if I can throw a picture up! You would think that would be easy to find, but I don't know where I put it at the moment!
PS Rex, you are one of the few guys that can upstage me on cool junk!!!!
Thanks Derek, but I beg to differ about upstaging you..........
And to Ted, I certainly apologize if it seems I was trying to hijack your thread,,,,,,,,,,,,,,definitely was not my intention.
And back to you Derek.......................I was gonna post a pic of me in that Botany 500 suit, REAL polyester, standing beside the car, but I was afraid too many memories of everyone's disco days would come flooding back for many of the forum members.
So, I'll leave that for each individual's imagination.
Anyway.....................THIS is the REAL #3 Sunray DX Corvette, the GT class winner at Sebring in 1968. Neat car, and beautiful.
I was pleased with how my car turned out...............I just couldn't bring myself to cover up those stainless headers......... at least not right now.
TCracingCA;
By the way, with all my research into this car and the team info you posted, you are correct in ALL of your research, between books and photos I have at least two photos of the races you mentioned. The registry is incorrect at least SUNRAY cars. the car listed as 1968 #2 was the #29(at Daytona 68) and was originally RED 435 car, off the showroom floor at Yenko Chevy, built by Don Yenko, not WHITE. The White car was actually the #3. If you read the registry for 1968 cars, they have 4 C3 cars listed as being part of the Sunray DX Team. there was only 3 C3's: #2(VIN 042351), #3(VIN 411493) #4 the 1968 Parts car. Only the parts car became a OC car, for the rest of 1968 Jerry Thompson drove Tony's 1967(Black with blue stinger as restored today) L88 Convertible painted in new OC paint scheme of Gray, White, and Red.
Take care,
TED
We could ask Tony and Doug Bergan who owned a race team with a 66 and then 68 and 69 L-88 racers. He also was the crew chief for Greenwood in 71 at LeMans. PM me for contact info.
I will look your car up, to see if it a Greenwood serial number
Originally Posted by C2Racer
Yes, Rippie gave it to me with the car. Pretty amazing all the drivers used it for nearly 10 years. But the car ran mostly on 3 tracks.
Steve
I think I have like 150 or more articles on Greenwood Corvettes! Sometimes those were shot in his shop! I wonder if it shows up in the background! I will make a mental note to keep an Eye out for it! Don't get your hopes up, but even Recently I did see a racer that had similar styling mods raced earlier! But I don't remember what I was looking thru or at! I guess you are wondering if there is any earlier record of competition by your car? But I can tell you that Greenwood usually would take even the race cars around the block to test them! The Greenwood operations were pretty driven on getting cars done or sold! Not any procrastination from him, but sometimes they had a build project going on in the back!
Last edited by TCracingCA; 04-14-2016 at 11:24 AM.
Too keep hijacking Ted's thread......have any info on my 69 from John's Corvette's ownership by chance? Here is the registry page for my car to maybe jog someone's memory?
Sorry Steve, I can't really help you much , but it seems that you have just about all the history you could possibly have, on that car!
From what I know, Steve Kline, and Doug Rippie for that matter, raced mainly in the mid-west. Most of my knowledge, pictures, programs, results, etc...are related to racing on the east coast, and the northeast in particular.
I do remember Tuck Thomas, but that was from him racing his yellow Kar Kraft (or Race Craft?) built Monza, not a Corvette.
When I get a chance, I'll look through some of the stuff I have, and if I come up with anything, I'll let you know.
I think I have like 150 or more articles on Greenwood Corvettes! Sometimes those were shot in his shop! I wonder if it shows up in the background! I will make a mental note to keep an Eye out for it! Don't get your hopes up, but even Recently I did see a racer that had similar styling mods raced earlier! But I don't remember what I was looking thru or at! I guess you are wondering if there is any earlier record of competition by your car? But I can tell you that Greenwood usually would take even the race cars around the block to test them! The Greenwood operations were pretty driven on getting cars done or sold! Not any procrastination from him, but sometimes they had a build project going on in the back!
your aware John is John Biza not John Greenwood right??
I sometimes read these threads too fast for comprehension!!!!!!
Originally Posted by redvetracr
your aware John is John Biza not John Greenwood right??
I could have worn, that Steve mentioned above or on a previous post in this thread that he thought Greenwood association!!! I will now go back and look, to see if I need to check myself into the VA center, and build puzzles all day, for the rest of the days that I have left!
I always dread pulling out all of the Greenwood related stuff, because of too much material!!! It usually when that happens, stays on the living room floor for weeks, causing a complete disruption of my home life and well being! Stepping over the research articles etc. is super dangerous in socks, and it sticks to your bare feet, and wearing shoes and stepping on it, ruins the paper (with big shoe prints, folds and creases)!!!! Researching is very dangerous!!!!
Last edited by TCracingCA; 04-14-2016 at 02:01 PM.
Tuck Thomas had other rides! He raced in a Corvette, I think T/A!
Originally Posted by gbvette62
Sorry Steve, I can't really help you much , but it seems that you have just about all the history you could possibly have, on that car!
From what I know, Steve Kline, and Doug Rippie for that matter, raced mainly in the mid-west. Most of my knowledge, pictures, programs, results, etc...are related to racing on the east coast, and the northeast in particular.
I do remember Tuck Thomas, but that was from him racing his yellow Kar Kraft (or Race Craft?) built Monza, not a Corvette.
When I get a chance, I'll look through some of the stuff I have, and if I come up with anything, I'll let you know.
Steve, you guys have one of those cars with a "make the rest of us jealous acquired log books and therefore history". Some of us have to fill the gaps with pure speculation or deduction! But it would be cool to top it all, with a cherry on the top and have it all, "the whole story!" I have to taper off of my desire to do research on everything that comes up, that I never can get too, but I will keep an eye out for anything in my normal travels. I am even not doing good on getting to the literature with FIA and Daytona/Sebring stuff to conclude the Fuel Cell project here! I got sidetracked on Porsche 120 Liter Gas Tanks, basically those came in for the Turbo cars like the 934 and were the go to for the 962s!
Last edited by TCracingCA; 04-14-2016 at 02:00 PM.
your aware John is John Biza not John Greenwood right??
Yes, what I said was that Rippie said Kline put in a Greenwood 5 link that is still in the car. I have not confirmed any markings on it since hospital time got all my spring. May have been from some other place but Andrusky(whose name is on my dash as crew chief, may have spelled his name wrong) did install it for Kline around 77.
Steve, you guys have one of those cars with a "make the rest of us jealous acquired log books and therefore history". Some of us have to fill the gaps with pure speculation or deduction! But it would be cool to top it all, with a cherry on the top and have it all, "the whole story!" I have to taper off of my desire to do research on everything that comes up, that I never can get too, but I will keep an eye out for anything in my normal travels. I am even not doing good on getting to the literature with FIA and Daytona/Sebring stuff to conclude the Fuel Cell project here! I got sidetracked on Porsche 120 Liter Gas Tanks, basically those came in for the Turbo cars like the 934 and were the go to for the 962s!
Thanks Derek, but that was certainly not the goal. I have built replicas and racers quite a few times over the years and just grew into wanting documented cars to race with mostly because I like going to Monterey.
Thanks Derek, but that was certainly not the goal. I have built replicas and racers quite a few times over the years and just grew into wanting documented cars to race with mostly because I like going to Monterey.
And since you like Pcars and to further hijack Ted's thread here is a pic of my best 911...since you mentioned turbo's
Sorry Ted.......again.
Steve
I even like the DOD stickers like I had on mine! In regards to Porsches, I have to now live vicariously thru my brothers collection for my PCAR addiction! For his newest, he sourced everything he needs for his 1973 car RSR build on a 1973 car (big Brembos, Von Shocks, 935 suspension from Elephant and others, etc.), except he doesn't have the rims yet! Found some former Communist parts, got a real duck from Poland, got real steel flares from Germany (old eastern bloc side actually is where those shipped from- never would have happened during the Cold War era) and customs made him pay import tax at his front door at deliver! That sucked!
And to everyone, if my memory holds up and I happen to be reading on the toilet and come across related articles on anything you guys have ever been interested in, I try to see if some of that can get put up!
The problem is my mind wanders vastly! I am all into Pennsylvania Flintlocks and Percussion rifles at the moment with Curley Maple stocks, specifically of the Bedford County makes. And I am bushing up on Ford knowledge, so I can blend in this weekend. The Cobra and GT-350s will never know what hit them.
But to stay on topic, the OP is at the wedding! So we are free to run Off Topic within reason, while waiting to get back on Tank!!!! Tank!
Last edited by TCracingCA; 04-14-2016 at 04:47 PM.
Too keep hijacking Ted's thread......have any info on my 69 from John's Corvette's ownership by chance? Here is the registry page for my car to maybe jog someone's memory?
After reading the history of your car on the registry, I started to post something, and then deleted it until digging around a little more.
It appears that the car you have, is the brother of the John's Corvette Shop/Jay Kline Chevrolet car I know in NY. What threw me when reading the history on the Registry, and looking at your pictures, was your car was once painted like a Pace Car. I was pretty sure that the car in NY, was also once painted black and silver.
I know the car in NY fairly well, since it was restored at Jim Glass' shop, and I've helped Mark (the owner) with the car a couple times (though I think I originally said it was a 69, when it's actually a 70).
Mark's car was built and raced by John Biza of John's Corvette Shop, in 1971. Biza sold the car in the mid 70's, and in 78 it too was rebodied as a coupe and painted like a Pace Car. At first I thought it sounded like one of those situations where the history of two cars, had gotten tangled up together, but apparently Mark's car has to be the second "Pace Car", that's mentioned in the history of yours. Your car is SCCA # 18-410 and Mark's is 18-335.
Mark has been wanting to sell the car, and Jim (Glass) had made a deal with Mark to buy it. Jim was supposed to pick the car up a week ago, but when he called to arrange to get it, Mark told him he needed $5000 more than they originally agreed on. Jim told him no thanks!
Below are pictures of Mark's car. The first (#12) is from when Biza first raced it, the second is how it looks now, and the third is from when it was painted like a Pace Car. The link is to the ad for the car, when Mark bought 10 years ago.
Who with Biza raced my car is what I'm looking for. Would have been maybe 69 to 74? According to Rippie my car was solid silver when he bought it from John. Thanks Glenn
Who with Biza raced my car is what I'm looking for. Would have been maybe 69 to 74? According to Rippie my car was solid silver when he bought it from John. Thanks Glenn
Steve
There is an old thread in the C3 General section, full of old Corvette racing pictures. Back in 2010, someone said their father raced the blue number 12 above, and posted a half dozen pictures of the car. I assume he was John Biza's son, but he hadn't filled out his profile, and though I sent him a PM, he never responded.
Have you ever visted the Facebook page for Jay Kline Chevrolet? If you scroll down to April 9, 2014, there's a picture of the door off of either your car, or Mark's, hanging on the wall at Norm's Wayside in Buffalo MN. You may want to post a question there, looking for anyone that has contact info for John or one of the Klines. There are pictures of the dealership and even someone selling Jay Kline Chevrolet t-shirts. It'd be pretty neat to have some of those shirts, to wear at the races!
If you Google Jay Kline Chevrolet, quite a bit of stuff comes up, and you may be able to track down some info using contacts from the Google links.
After reading the history of your car on the registry, I started to post something, and then deleted it until digging around a little more.
It appears that the car you have, is the brother of the John's Corvette Shop/Jay Kline Chevrolet car I know in NY. What threw me when reading the history on the Registry, and looking at your pictures, was your car was once painted like a Pace Car. I was pretty sure that the car in NY, was also once painted black and silver.
I know the car in NY fairly well, since it was restored at Jim Glass' shop, and I've helped Mark (the owner) with the car a couple times (though I think I originally said it was a 69, when it's actually a 70).
Mark's car was built and raced by John Biza of John's Corvette Shop, in 1971. Biza sold the car in the mid 70's, and in 78 it too was rebodied as a coupe and painted like a Pace Car. At first I thought it sounded like one of those situations where the history of two cars, had gotten tangled up together, but apparently Mark's car has to be the second "Pace Car", that's mentioned in the history of yours. Your car is SCCA # 18-410 and Mark's is 18-335.
Mark has been wanting to sell the car, and Jim (Glass) had made a deal with Mark to buy it. Jim was supposed to pick the car up a week ago, but when he called to arrange to get it, Mark told him he needed $5000 more than they originally agreed on. Jim told him no thanks!
Below are pictures of Mark's car. The first (#12) is from when Biza first raced it, the second is how it looks now, and the third is from when it was painted like a Pace Car. The link is to the ad for the car, when Mark bought 10 years ago.
What's funny is that I have researched and documented the employees of Traco, Dana Chevrolet, Yenko, McLaren, Scarab Team, Chaparral, Shelby Baldwin Motion, Bill Thomas and on and on,
, and I am surprised I have never done so for the Grrenwood operation! This Biza guy I know I have see his name, but never checked into this racer/builder guy ever! I would have to go back up to the races, but to help with a quick look, was he running SCCA Nationals or just Regionals or Trans Am or IMSA? If he was sharing rides, then it was either an IMSA racer of FIA! If SCCA the National records are easier to find than the impossible regional level stuff!
Ps you have some good records and seem like a good researcher/historian guy and try to help! And you are helping Steve! I see you in these fun type history topics and always good to have others like yourself around!
Steve, in looking through the links for Jay Kline Chevrolet on Google, contact info for Steve Kline popped up at Linkedin. Steve Kline's now in Wyoming, working in property management/real state.
04-13-2016, 04:59 PM
Greenwood cars!
