Reversed Steering!?
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 264
Likes: 15
From: San Jose CA
Reversed Steering!?
Folks,
I have a '58 that had been (poorly) modified to install a power steering box. It was using rag joints as a u-joint, and would occasionally and with no warning shred the rag joint leaving me with no steering control. Hardly acceptable. On top, they had butchered the column, cut a notch out of the frame and welded the pump bracket onto the motor mount obstructing one of the mount bolts.
So, I acquired a steering column, purchased a rebuild kit from Zip Products, and set to work rebuilding the acquired column, ripping out the bodged in box, and putting things to right. Copious reference was made to the ST-12 and Joe Calcagno's rebuild notes. And everything came together well and looked good.
Until I got to the adjusting process, where I finally get things lined up and realize that the steering box is working in reverse! Turning the steering wheel to the right turned the wheels to the left. The only thing I'm able to figure is that somehow the worm gear in incorrect and spirals the wrong way.
So, before I rip everything apart again, is there anything else that could cause the steering to be reversed? Do we know of these wrong-spiral worm gears in the market?
-Brian
I have a '58 that had been (poorly) modified to install a power steering box. It was using rag joints as a u-joint, and would occasionally and with no warning shred the rag joint leaving me with no steering control. Hardly acceptable. On top, they had butchered the column, cut a notch out of the frame and welded the pump bracket onto the motor mount obstructing one of the mount bolts.
So, I acquired a steering column, purchased a rebuild kit from Zip Products, and set to work rebuilding the acquired column, ripping out the bodged in box, and putting things to right. Copious reference was made to the ST-12 and Joe Calcagno's rebuild notes. And everything came together well and looked good.
Until I got to the adjusting process, where I finally get things lined up and realize that the steering box is working in reverse! Turning the steering wheel to the right turned the wheels to the left. The only thing I'm able to figure is that somehow the worm gear in incorrect and spirals the wrong way.
So, before I rip everything apart again, is there anything else that could cause the steering to be reversed? Do we know of these wrong-spiral worm gears in the market?
-Brian
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 2,509
Likes: 529
From: Willowbrook IL
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15-'16
Folks,
I have a '58 that had been (poorly) modified to install a power steering box. It was using rag joints as a u-joint, and would occasionally and with no warning shred the rag joint leaving me with no steering control. Hardly acceptable. On top, they had butchered the column, cut a notch out of the frame and welded the pump bracket onto the motor mount obstructing one of the mount bolts.
So, I acquired a steering column, purchased a rebuild kit from Zip Products, and set to work rebuilding the acquired column, ripping out the bodged in box, and putting things to right. Copious reference was made to the ST-12 and Joe Calcagno's rebuild notes. And everything came together well and looked good.
Until I got to the adjusting process, where I finally get things lined up and realize that the steering box is working in reverse! Turning the steering wheel to the right turned the wheels to the left. The only thing I'm able to figure is that somehow the worm gear in incorrect and spirals the wrong way.
So, before I rip everything apart again, is there anything else that could cause the steering to be reversed? Do we know of these wrong-spiral worm gears in the market?
-Brian
I have a '58 that had been (poorly) modified to install a power steering box. It was using rag joints as a u-joint, and would occasionally and with no warning shred the rag joint leaving me with no steering control. Hardly acceptable. On top, they had butchered the column, cut a notch out of the frame and welded the pump bracket onto the motor mount obstructing one of the mount bolts.
So, I acquired a steering column, purchased a rebuild kit from Zip Products, and set to work rebuilding the acquired column, ripping out the bodged in box, and putting things to right. Copious reference was made to the ST-12 and Joe Calcagno's rebuild notes. And everything came together well and looked good.
Until I got to the adjusting process, where I finally get things lined up and realize that the steering box is working in reverse! Turning the steering wheel to the right turned the wheels to the left. The only thing I'm able to figure is that somehow the worm gear in incorrect and spirals the wrong way.
So, before I rip everything apart again, is there anything else that could cause the steering to be reversed? Do we know of these wrong-spiral worm gears in the market?
-Brian
Don
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 264
Likes: 15
From: San Jose CA
This picture is a view from the left front wheel well towards the center of the car.
-Brian
Last edited by bk2w; Jun 1, 2016 at 12:04 AM.
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 26,118
Likes: 1,874
From: Greenville, Indiana
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 264
Likes: 15
From: San Jose CA
View of the pitman arm, drag link and third arm, taken looking towards the front of the car.
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Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 264
Likes: 15
From: San Jose CA
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 10,343
Likes: 668
From: Beverly Hills (Pine Ridge) Florida
Please confirm that your tie rods are located in back of the "A" arms (where they "should" be).
And let us have a picture of your 3rd arm with the center tie rod ends.
Just a guess here, but bet that the added on power steering gear forced the PO to reverse the spindles side to side, which put the tie rods forward of the "A" arms, and reversed the direction of motion..
Plasticman
And let us have a picture of your 3rd arm with the center tie rod ends.
Just a guess here, but bet that the added on power steering gear forced the PO to reverse the spindles side to side, which put the tie rods forward of the "A" arms, and reversed the direction of motion..
Plasticman
Last edited by Plasticman; Jun 1, 2016 at 10:50 AM.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 264
Likes: 15
From: San Jose CA
Please confirm that your tie rods are located in back of the "A" arms (where they "should" be).
And let us have a picture of your 3rd arm with the center tie rod ends.
Just a guess here, but bet that the added on power steering gear forced the PO to reverse the spindles side to side, which put the tie rods forward of the "A" arms, and reversed the direction of motion..
Plasticman
And let us have a picture of your 3rd arm with the center tie rod ends.
Just a guess here, but bet that the added on power steering gear forced the PO to reverse the spindles side to side, which put the tie rods forward of the "A" arms, and reversed the direction of motion..
Plasticman
Is there anything different between L and R steering arms, knuckles or control arms? Any way of telling which side the parts should be installed on?
-Brian
Team Owner
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 31,497
Likes: 1,313
From: Huntsville AL
Your pitman arm (the arm coming off of the steering box and connecting to the steering linkage doesn't look right.
There should be a number cast into the pitman arm. Can you tell us what it is?
There should be a number cast into the pitman arm. Can you tell us what it is?
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 264
Likes: 15
From: San Jose CA
What aspect doesn't look correct?
-Brian
Team Owner
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 31,497
Likes: 1,313
From: Huntsville AL
It may need some adjustment once you resolve the spindle issues. Good luck with it.
Last edited by emccomas; Jun 1, 2016 at 11:35 AM.
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 10,343
Likes: 668
From: Beverly Hills (Pine Ridge) Florida
Eureka! The tie rods currently connect to the steering arms in front of the A-arms. I'll have to switch things around to fix that.
Is there anything different between L and R steering arms, knuckles or control arms? Any way of telling which side the parts should be installed on?
-Brian
Is there anything different between L and R steering arms, knuckles or control arms? Any way of telling which side the parts should be installed on?
-Brian
I think that the tie rod arms are bolted to the spindles, and you would need to unbolt them, and swap them side to side, and aim them towards the rear.
Here is a link to a terrific front end rebuild thread by Tom Parsons (DZAUTO here on the forum), but he does not get into that aspect in this thread.
http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/sh...hp?tid/218134/
Plasticman
Last edited by Plasticman; Jun 1, 2016 at 11:45 AM.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 264
Likes: 15
From: San Jose CA
Brian,
I think that the tie rod arms are bolted to the spindles, and you would need to unbolt them, and swap them side to side, and aim them towards the rear.
Here is a link to a terrific front end rebuild thread by Tom Parsons (DZAUTO here on the forum), but he does not get into that aspect in this thread.
http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/sh...hp?tid/218134/
Plasticman
I think that the tie rod arms are bolted to the spindles, and you would need to unbolt them, and swap them side to side, and aim them towards the rear.
Here is a link to a terrific front end rebuild thread by Tom Parsons (DZAUTO here on the forum), but he does not get into that aspect in this thread.
http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/sh...hp?tid/218134/
Plasticman
I've seen Tom's fabulous write up, and I do plan on eventually rebuilding the whole front end much as he lays out. I was hoping to postpone that for now, though, since I'd really like to get the car back on the road and enjoy it for a few months before tearing it apart again. It's already been on cinderblocks for 2+ years while life happened.
http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/pro...ebuild-part-1/ is another rebuild thread that does show a nice picture (#5) of the tie rods and the steering arms pointing to the rear. My setup does not match that, so I'll see about swapping the arms later this week.
Thanks!
-Brian
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 264
Likes: 15
From: San Jose CA
One issue on placement I haven't found a solution for is that the PO notched the frame to install the power steering box, and welded in some angle-iron to form a mounting bracket. I've cut out the angle-riron, but the notch is right where the manual steering box bolts on. I have the correct iron spacer installed between the frame and the box, and added spacers (grade 8 nuts and washers) to put the box close to where I think it should be, but I don't have any hard measurements to confirm that I've got the right distance. I think the only issue I might have is that box is rotated a bit along the axis of the column, which shouldn't affect the steering significantly. Eventually, I'll be getting help to fix the frame, but that's a bigger task than I can tackle right now.
It's a good thing I enjoy pulling parts off this car and fixing them up, since so many of them seem to need it.
-Brian
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 10,343
Likes: 668
From: Beverly Hills (Pine Ridge) Florida
Plasticman,
I've seen Tom's fabulous write up, and I do plan on eventually rebuilding the whole front end much as he lays out. I was hoping to postpone that for now, though, since I'd really like to get the car back on the road and enjoy it for a few months before tearing it apart again. It's already been on cinderblocks for 2+ years while life happened.
http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/pro...ebuild-part-1/ is another rebuild thread that does show a nice picture (#5) of the tie rods and the steering arms pointing to the rear. My setup does not match that, so I'll see about swapping the arms later this week.
Thanks!
-Brian
I've seen Tom's fabulous write up, and I do plan on eventually rebuilding the whole front end much as he lays out. I was hoping to postpone that for now, though, since I'd really like to get the car back on the road and enjoy it for a few months before tearing it apart again. It's already been on cinderblocks for 2+ years while life happened.
http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/pro...ebuild-part-1/ is another rebuild thread that does show a nice picture (#5) of the tie rods and the steering arms pointing to the rear. My setup does not match that, so I'll see about swapping the arms later this week.
Thanks!
-Brian
Good article and thanks. Note that on the article's #18, they show a Fatman dropped spindle support, and stated the following:
"18. Drop spindles, or spindle uprights, like these from Fatman Fabrications (top) effectively raise the mounting point of the wheel up into the wheelwell, rather than decreasing the suspension travel with lowering springs or coilovers like on a late-model car. It is the only way to effectively lower the ride height on a C1."
This is not true, since 53/54 Chevy passenger car spindle supports will bolt right in, and drop the front end down 3/4" (Tom Parsons put me on to that, and I did it a few years ago). I looked at the Fatman supports, but their drop is about 2"!
Good luck,
Plasticman
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 264
Likes: 15
From: San Jose CA
-Brian