carpenterdesign

This car is a perfect example of where the SVRA group 6 rulebook is slightly wrong and needs to be rewritten. Vintage racing is all about the car, not the trophy, thus cars that have REAL HISTORY and pictures to prove their history need to be maintained and preserved to look as they did when originally driven. In the case of this car, it was raced in IMSA and should maintain that visual aesthetic. If and when the car's current lap times are exceeding the best group 6 lap times then it should be moved up to group 10.

In other words, it should be encouraged to be left how it actually ran not how a group that was formed years after the fact wants it to be run.

Love the car. Keep the flares how they are!!!

jerry gollnick

run it in group 10 and no one will say a word. Cant run that configuration in group 6.

gbvette62

There is nothing wrong with the Group 6 rules.

Group 6 is for cars that raced prior to 73, in SCCA Trans-Am, A & B Production, A Sedan, and comparable FIA classes. Group 10 rules are based on IMSA's mid 70's rules, as well as Trans-Am and other SCCA classes found in the SCCA's 73 GCR. These are the rules that car appears to have been built to.

I'm all for leaving cars the way they "actually ran". That car was built to the post-72, IMSA and SCCA rules, and it belongs in Group 10 with other 73-95 IMSA and Trans-Am cars. Many of the cars in Group 10, are the same cars it would have raced with in the 70's.

That car would never have been legal to race in A or B Production in 72, so it shouldn't be racing in Group 6 now. This is not a knock on the car. I like the car, but it was built to the rules that cars in Group 10 race under, and that's where it should be racing.

carpenterdesign

I am not an expert, I may be missing something, and perhaps the images below are mislabeled, but the coachwork seems to fall in line with cars like the ones attached that were racing during the 1972 season. This car definitely signifies part of the transition period where the rules relaxed and allowed clearance for wheels. With the complex shape of the midyear body, I am sure that the rule "...exterior of fenders may be altered to provide for clearance provided fender opening profile, viewed from the side of the automobile and the material, are not changed," offered up various interpretations. Is there anything else that drastically falls out of line with what is being seen via photos as the norm circa 1972?

Photos courtesy of the Corvette Racecar Registry Website and http://www.camaros.org/forum/index.php?topic=7850.0

gbvette62

I'm not sure about the other two pictures, but the one of Larry Park's 67, is definitely labeled wrong. The GT-1 class didn't exist until about 1980. Before that, Corvettes ran in A or B Production, depending on the engine used. I know that car, we raced against Larry in SCCA Pro Solo, and I'm pretty sure that car was built after 72 (at least in that configuration).

Based on the wheels on it, I'm pretty sure the picture of car number 33 was taken sometime after 72 also. The max wheel allowed in the 72 GCR was 8", and the ones on the rear of #33 look like 10 inchers. Ten's were approved for use starting in 1973.

The third car pictured (the black #41) belongs to a friend of mine. I know some of the history of the car, but not when the flares were added, though I'm sure I could find out. That car is currently being rebuilt, after a big wreck at Watkins Glen, that destroyed both ends of the car.

The SCCA didn't always enforce the rule book 100%. It was quite common for them to allow Corvettes to run with the wheel openings radiused in the 60's, though usually not flared. The SVRA is somewhat flexible, when it comes to flares in Group 6 also. One of the Corvettes I crew on, regularly races with SVRA in Group 6 with flares, as does the black number 41 above (though it's now orange).

There were a lot of mid-years similar to the OP's, that raced against tube frame GT-1 cars, well into the 90's. From all indications, the car appears to have been built to the post 1973 rules, and it should probably race in Group 10, with other cars built to those rules.

redvetracr

I believe SCCA production rules allowed wheels to be 1.5" over stock, making a 9.5" wheel legal on A/P & B/P Corvettes, I didn`t race in 72 but by 74-75 when I started we were all on (affordable) 10" wheels, 9.5" wheels were not affordable for most of us.

gbvette62

68 and up Corvettes were allowed to run 9.5" wheels because the stock wheel was 8". 63-67's were initially limited to 7.5" wheels, because the widest stock wheel available on a mid-year was a 15x6 wheel. Like you running 10's, most people racing mid-years ran either 7" or 8" wheels, because there were no reasonably priced, readily available 7.5" wheels.

I might be wrong, but I thought it was in 73, that the SCCA relaxed the rules some, to allow mid-years to use the same size rims as 68 up Corvettes? I knew a couple people who I think were running 10's on mid-years, around 78-80.

Even now in the SVRA, the wheel rule is the same, 1.5" over stock, or 15x7.5 for mid-years, and 15x9.5 for 68 up. And just like the SCCA in the 70's, SVRA makes an exception for Corvettes, and allows mid-years to run 15x8.5's Torq-Thrusts, and 68 up to run 15x10 Torq-Thrust D's.

carpenterdesign

It is pretty awesome the knowledge you all have!!! Thank you for the in-site!

TCracingCA

IMSA in 1971or SCCA ASR class would have been the only one to let it run flared in 1971/72. SCCA allowed wheel well mods, but not full on flares yet. But SCCA losing competitors tolerated in 1972 the flares but SCCA legal size rims and tires like Greenwood or Cormany in the ex-Garner car!ran at the 1972 ARRC.

The FIA was run from 1968 essentially to Group rules and approved homologated cars! The Corvette got that essentially later 1968 for the 1969 season, but in FIA in time for the late LeMans run in September 68 (Greders)! 1968 you had the unflared Garner , Yenko DX, Greenwood, Delorenzo cars. Then they all got flared for 1969. When the Delorenzo cars for example first showed at Daytona in January 1969, they weren't flared, but got them that weekend (#66:#67cars) and the Essek/Lowther car. In SCCA the 1969 rim widths had the car's 9.5 rims and rubber sticking out of the wheel wells which was a problem. At an event like Watkins Glens it got a little confusing due to the FIA rules, but a mostly SCCA field (Owens team unflared, John Paul/Essek car. flared, but taken off to finish up the season in SCCA). So under FIA you could run a 10 inch rim and under SCCA a 9.5, but some SCCA cars on these hybrid FIA events SCCA cars were wearing 10 inch rims on the top cars.! The C2s were pretty restricted to 8.5 rims and a modified wheel well in the 1971 IMSA,even though their were no competitors, but FIA they were restricted because nothing wide was homologated. In SCCA they were restricted to the 7.5 inch rims! In 1973 they were allowed to match the C3 with 10 inch for Trans Am, and IMSA, and FIA, essentially was allowed in ASR class SCCA, and Solo I, but not in Production class!

1973 SCCA Production classes tolerated the flares to not lose competitors as long as you had legal wide rubber and rims!
The Trans Am- SCCAs pro class was newly revised to essentially Group FIA rules, and depending on the Homologation of a certain car, the Corvettes were allowed to have flares as was the new RSR Porsches GP4 and the RS GP3. Marshall Robbins and John Greenwood were top cars,
IMSA allowed in anything you brought! Pro or Amateur cars and you could run for purses!

So 1972 C2 like the #99 of Currin in IMSA had flared, but earlier in 1972 Daytona no flares!

For 1974 you had the introduction of the AAGT rules in IMSA.

For Trans Am they split that to Category 1 & 2, which essential was the AAGT tube cars and FIA Group 4 in one category and the Production based IMSA and Pro level SCCA in the other.

The later GT-1 classes were a weight vs engine displacement rule!