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Garage Build - Detached Input Requested

 
Old 02-07-2019, 04:35 PM
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Rcubed1952
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Default Garage Build - Detached Input Requested

Getting prepared for the rebirth of my '66 pearl silver 427/425 hopefully June. Wanting to build a new 2+ car garage to house the new baby, store my lawn tractor/equipment & have some room for wood working & working with stain glass.
Thinking about 1,000 SF, with 2 separate front facing 9'x8' doors, one rear facing 6'x7' door (for the lawn equipment) & one man door. No plumbing (not practical), possibly a split heat/cool in wall unit.
I have attached a quick sketch of my thoughts.

Looking for input other than build it twice the size you think you will need.
Input such minimum clear areas around the vehicles. Ceiling height (for a possible lift). Slab thickness (for a possible lift). Power panel capacity. Lighting/Lighting layouts Etc.

Many of you have been doing this a long time. I would appreciate any input I can get. Would rather learn for other's mistakes

Thanks
RRR
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Old 02-07-2019, 04:50 PM
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Dave Tracy
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Build it as large as you can (space and $). I would have at least a 14' ceiling to accommodate a lift or lifts with plenty to spare since you may be working on an SUV that is 7' high, 6' high on a lift (like my Ford Excursion). Also, the additional height would allow you to build a loft over the lawn area to increase your usable square footage. I would defer on the slab thickness to the lift company recommendations. Your area of the country is not on your post so heater/a/c may be a consideration. Also, you will want 220v to the garage along with water. You may consider a flat roof for a deck if you are building into a hill. Just some thoughts.
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Old 02-07-2019, 04:51 PM
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68hemi
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The only advice I can give you is to build it twice as big as you think you need because you will fill up the bigger one quicker than you can imagine.
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Old 02-07-2019, 05:20 PM
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AZDoug
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10' minimum sidewall height , and if you can, allow space above the lift so its not blocked by trusses so you can use more height of the lift. That will take some special designing, or use of steel.
Doug
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Old 02-07-2019, 05:22 PM
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Sam Kalmuk
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I would Square off the Plan to a 26' x 40' … you will regret the lost space from your plan....Where are the Stairs going to be for 2nd Floor....?
You will need this xtra space for Stairs... Get a Lift for 10,000 lbs, as a Truck is heavier than your Vette...Also have a Side-Mount Garage Door Opener, so the Lift can take a Truck "to the Top".... Ceiling at 14'Height. Consider Plumbing for a Washroom, under the Stairs, as it will be Very handy... Some Windows could be placed Higher on the Walls, for Light & Security reasons.
Taller Garage Doors, for your Truck to enter easily. Consider a Heated Floor, if you work in your Garage in the Winter months. Therefore No furnace. Also slope the Floor to a Drainage/catch for washing/cleaning your vehicles/tractors indoors.
Since you have a 2nd Floor, consider a Few Dormers for added Space Upstairs.... Also place the Man-Door at the Foot of the Stairs, so there is No difficulty in carrying things Upstairs (No bending around corners). Plenty of Electrical Outlets & Lights, with Security system add to House System...
Man, that is a List....I'm sure others will chime in...
All the Best
Sam
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Old 02-07-2019, 05:25 PM
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DAN70
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Originally Posted by 68hemi View Post
The only advice I can give you is to build it twice as big as you think you need because you will fill up the bigger one quicker than you can imagine.
I agree. It’s amazing how fast you run out of space.
Have fun.
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Old 02-07-2019, 06:56 PM
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L72copo
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Make the overhead doors 10' wide. Need that if you ever want to pull a trailer in. Might want to consider one door 18' wide. If your going with a truss roof the truss manufacture can design them with ceiling bump ups anywhere you want them. They do this all the time for making coffer ceilings in homes. The bump up would only be needed where you want to place your lift. I had one built into my shop and the additional charge was slightly less than $100.00. Also built mine with storage trusses instead of conventional ones. Up-charge on these were also minimum. Highly recommend plumbing, at the very least water to the shop. If code doesn't allow it just put a hose bib on the outside and punch it inside later. Through the wall drain for a sink can go into a dry well.
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Old 02-07-2019, 08:14 PM
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Hi - First question that comes to mind when planning something like this is Budget, $$ - how much do I have or want to spend, this will set the parameters of the type of building to be constructed and materials to be used - there are a lot of companies that build sheds / garages and a quick google search is a good starting point to see what you can get for your $$'s - when considering size, also think not only of current requirements but also future needs ie: number of cars, workshop area, and accumulation of stuff if you're a pack rat - topography will play an important part in cost, does the site slope and will the site need to be "cut" - once having determined floor size requirements one of the most important aspects for consideration is the floor; especially construction type if you're going to install a lift now or in the future; concrete would be recommended at least a foot thick to take to load of a car and the lift and especially the depth into which the Dyna Bolts will be drilled to anchor the lift - next big consideration is height; to accommodate a lift and …. a mezzanine loft to maximise storage space where you might like to store "stuff" or have an office away from home with a comfy chair, a beer fridge and a book shelf filled with car mags, or a place to escape if you get sent to the "dog house" K9 plush posturepedic inclusive; - you will also need to consider electricity supply - will domestic be adequate or need to upgrade to phase 3 - what equipment will you be using ie Lift, Air-Compressor, Air Conditioning, Power Tools etc - Lighting requirements will also need to be considered; number and wattage and do you want to have skylights cut into the roof and on the topic of roof, pitched or flat style and installation of a hot air extraction vent / wind vane - I would also think seriously about plumbing requirements ; firstly for safety and second for convenience in washing hands (you wont want the missus ranting about grease marks left in the bathroom basin) - besides hand washing a wash basin / sink will allow you to make a cup of tea and you'll find a fridge will be mighty handy - which brings up power points, you can't have too many power points at least one in each corner and one in the middle of each wall and maybe a couple up high also …. the following is a list just to keep it simple;

* Size - it does matter - don't build too small; allow for the future, $$'s and space permitting
* Size - consider height for installation of a car lift and more importantly doubling floor space / storage without doubling the building foot print
* Size - installation of a loft / mezzanine with steel frame work and wooden flooring
* Lighting - consider installing skylights or clear corrugated Perspex roofing panels
* Lighting - allow for enough lights for adequate illumination
* Lighting - place any windows up high to keep wall space free for shelving and also for security
* Ventilation - circulation of fresh air to stop mould and mildew and moisture build up and extraction of hot air through roof ventilation fans
* Shelving - install a pallet racking system for strength and ease on installation and removal
* Power - make sure the supply can cope and enough power outlets are installed for convenience
* Plumbing - a wash basin / sink will be invaluable and would seriously consider installing a Water Closet (WC)
* Kitchen bench with Micro Wave for light meals / snacks and … a drinks fridge (you could have this in the Mezz / Loft area with a comfy chair and a place to park the wife)
* Floor - Most important - make sure the floor is ultra flat with absolutely no sloping at all
* Floor make sure the floor is sturdy and able to carry the weight of a lift with a car on it - minimum concrete thickness 12" to accommodate Dyna Bolts.
* Floor make sure whoever lays any concrete slab uses trellis steel reinforcing to spread the load and prevent cracking
* Floor - have a concrete apron to help keep the inside clean and prevent ingress of unwanted Detritus
* Doors - Roller Doors are preferred as flat lift up doors will block lighting, take up over-head space and catch on any over head items
* Doors - too many doors are a security risk
* Drainage - make sure there are enough Ag Pipes laid under the slab and around the building to take care of excess rain and water run-off
* Drainage - if being built into a slope make sure any retaining walls have drainage holes to prevent pressure build-up and wall collapse
* Stakeholder engagement - ask the wife to assist with window curtains and décor - Yeah; I know it sounds like a pansy thing but gets huge brownie points

Just a few thoughts - Best Regards GV

Originally Posted by Rcubed1952 View Post
Getting prepared for the rebirth of my '66 pearl silver 427/425 hopefully June. Wanting to build a new 2+ car garage to house the new baby, store my lawn tractor/equipment & have some room for wood working & working with stain glass.
Thinking about 1,000 SF, with 2 separate front facing 9'x8' doors, one rear facing 6'x7' door (for the lawn equipment) & one man door. No plumbing (not practical), possibly a split heat/cool in wall unit.
I have attached a quick sketch of my thoughts.

Looking for input other than build it twice the size you think you will need.
Input such minimum clear areas around the vehicles. Ceiling height (for a possible lift). Slab thickness (for a possible lift). Power panel capacity. Lighting/Lighting layouts Etc.

Many of you have been doing this a long time. I would appreciate any input I can get. Would rather learn for other's mistakes

Thanks
RRR
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Old 02-07-2019, 08:19 PM
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63 340HP
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The plan looks a lot like my father's 24'x40' garage/shop.

Fill it out to the full 26' x 40' perimeter (bigger is better and it may even cost less). You can always pour/build an entry mud room at the man door later.

Tall 10'+ walls are a cheap added cost during the initial build, a bit more concrete and 2x6 studs and thicker sheeting (perimeter loft/shelf storage and the lift are options my father did not install, to his complaint).

My father installed a 16' wide roll up door (two 8' door kits screwed together & braced), and the wide door and big open floor space is very useful for car repairs and larger shop projects. The cars are moved outside the shop for almost every project (for the car's safety), leaving the big open space. My father's side door is a full 8' width, and very convenient for moving larger equipment in & out without displacing the cars or the project on the larger main floor. He later installed a full length (24'x10') awning outside the side door for short term overhead shade & rain protected storage (useful when you don't want to disturb the main work space overnight just to park a vehicle).

Plan the perimeter shop equipment sizes on a floor plan. A 3' or 4' perimeter can usually fit a compressor, lathe, or mill with the operator standing in the general workspace (where stored equipment can be moved outside as needed for operator safety clearance while operating the equipment). Plan the interior shop equipment work space and perimeter storage locations. Plan a place to bolt down a planer, table saw, and tubing bender or welding table with ample four side clearance in the main workspace (separate from a potential lift, for whatever your non-car hobby use needs). Plan perimeter space to park the equipment when not in use (wheeled equipment carriages and long bolts to lag the carriage into the central floor workspace are very useful).

Plan window heights. High windows let light in and free up floor to overhead wall space, and are more secure.

A minimum 100A, 220V, service (200A is preferred). 220V is needed for heavier shop equipment and a welder. Plan extra breaker circuits for electric heat. Plug outlets inside and outside, both near shoulder level (for perimeter equipment) and below bench level (for drop cords). Rough in ceiling truss boxes for overhead roll up doors and pendent plug box drop power. A wall switch disconnect for any pendent drop box plugs is useful (just open the wall switch to secure the plugged in equipment off for the night, rather than fighting to pull each plug). Inside and outside light switches near the man door (or every door), and rough in boxes for outside high wall security/work lights.

Water service, a hose bib on both ends at a minimum (with a drain back valve in a French well in a cold climate). Codes and permit costs restrict sinks and urinals during the initial build, but available cold water can make later additions much easier.

A roof vent with a damper is convenient for ventilation (if you don't plan AC). Deep roof eve setbacks (more roof overhang) is also good to keep the outside walls dry and cool.
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Old 02-07-2019, 10:46 PM
  #10  
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Here's a specs document and a feature article from Corvette Fever on my attached garage, built 20 years ago with the house; you may find some useful tips and hints you can apply to yours.
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Old 02-07-2019, 11:03 PM
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Mine is 28' wide by 30' long. I wish I went another 3' wide to have the car doors open fully without hitting each other. I loose 2' on each side due to tool boxes and stuff.

Depending on the area you are in I would put PECS heat pipes in the floor. It helps in the winter - keeps the feet warm and dries the floor fast. I put baseboard in - no sparks to worry about. The Pecs is great = I didn't but when I helped a friend he did and it is great. Esp if you are working near the floor.

If you get 2 lifts - get one drive on, better for storage and one with arms - better to work on.

I have a friend with a pit - it is great for oil changes and quick repairs. He has fiberglass grating for the cover - so if he drives on it, it doesn't collapse.

Last edited by BLUE1972; 02-08-2019 at 10:20 AM.
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Old 02-07-2019, 11:42 PM
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In addition to what has been mentioned, I’d use 3500 psi concrete for the floor. Using reinforced wire mats is also a good idea. A 5” slab is plenty, but I would thicken it where the lift will sit, and imbed anchor bolts if possible. If you are in a cold climate and plan to heat it, definitely insulate the foundation stem walls and under the perimeter of the slab with styrofoam or similar insulation.
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Old 02-08-2019, 12:06 AM
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As a person who listened to the "build as big as you can" I can state that it may not be the best plan. Somebody, and that somebody will probably be you will have to care for all that extra space and all those neat things that you bring home because you have the room. In my experiences, depending on lay out you need about 400-500 Sq feet to work on a vehicle. 25' deep and 20' wide. That's room for you, your car, a two post lift, tool boxes, benches, air compressor etc. An 1000 square foot building will give you a lot of room. If you are one of those guys, like I was, that drags all kind of projects home, then you could use more space. But if your honest plans are just the car, lawn care equipment, and a small woodworking shop. I think your pretty close on size. I have a 3200sq ft shop behind my house, I wish it was smaller, that way I could just throw away all the stuff I know I am never going to need that i seem to keep.
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Old 02-08-2019, 12:35 AM
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I like living out in the country and small towns...so we build metal buildings usually. I'm this far along in my latest shop as of Monday. Still need doors and electricity...working on it now. This is my 5th shop at different homes over the years. I've found I prefer it to be a deep shop where I can place the lift at the far end and park Vette on it and still have plenty of room to pull something in behind it. If I want to pull the engine..while it can be done on the lift...I like getting it all ready then rolling back off lift to use cherry picker.

This one is 30'x50' with a 30'x20' front awning and a 15'x50' side area for parking trailers and doing light stuff. It has 10" walls to allow for my 4 post lift. I found too many doors just eats up wall space for tables etc. So I just installed one 10'x10' on the front and an 8'x8' on the side.

I'm installing plenty of quad 110v plugs as well as 220v. In one shop I found it WAS possible to have too many because after a few years I'd never used some of them. I'm placing the compressor outside behind the shop on a pad...for wall space as well as noise.

I always install skylights. They help a lot. It's insulated with the white plastic covered type to reflect light. The spray foam works well...but looks terrible and the yellow color doesn't help lighting much unless you paint it.

This will have all LED lights..14000 lumen each.

Floor will be painted with basic Rustoleum epoxy kits. I've had great luck with them...at least as good as the high $$$ epoxy I used in one of them. There will be white rock around the columns in front to match the house.


JIM

Last edited by 427Hotrod; 02-08-2019 at 12:36 AM.
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Old 02-08-2019, 01:15 AM
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Use rolling doors,clears the overhead, allows for better lighting.
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Old 02-08-2019, 02:41 AM
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All great comments here and I'm guessing the next thread will be "What does your garage/shop look like?" Gonna be fun.

In addition to all the great comments here;

As big as budget allows
Interior should be at least 10'6" tall for lift, but go as high as you can for the next owner or truck, so if you can get 13', do it
You only need 5=6" of cement, I see 3500 psi in a post, I have gone as high as 8,000
24' of room will not allow for a work bench, tool box and room to move.... My 67 Caddy is like 22' long (feels like 2200)
Typical work space is at least 6 feet from wall, 30" for the bench, and 4 feet to move
You don't need 3 phase, as for $250 bucks you can get a 3 phase converter, but again, a garage this small you wont have room for a Bridgport/lathe,
Don't do a flat floor, for if you wash anything, its a pain. slight slope to doors
lots of lights and plugs
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Old 02-08-2019, 08:29 AM
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No matter how big you build it you will be wishing you went bigger. I went 28' x 28' with 12' ceilings and two 10' doors. I like the 28' depth because it allows for some nice work benches and cabinets up front and still gives you plenty of room to work at the front of the car.

Last edited by biggd; 02-08-2019 at 08:32 AM.
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Old 02-08-2019, 09:16 AM
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Get knowledgeable on local building codes early on. For example, where I am, plumbing would require a complete septic system. Overhead roll-up doors are not allowed for residential construction. Wind load requirements can affect construction method.
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Old 02-08-2019, 09:44 AM
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My last shop, built in 2006, was a 36' x 50' Morton building, 13' ceiling because I installed a two post lift. I wanted it 36' wide so there was space to pull two cars "nose to tail" into each space. Garage doors were 10' x 10' so less chance of dinging one when going in and out plus I also have some farm equipment that occasionally needs service and repair. Initially I installed fluorescent lighting but I am now in the process of replacing all the bulbs with direct wire (no ballast) LED's. Water is always handy to have in the shop. We remodeled the kitchen in our house and I moved the sink, oven and cook top to the shop, even have a 1950's GE refrigerator from my parent's house.

We installed AC and a large propane heater when the shop was built, but I think if I were doing it now I would use the mini split heat pumps. When the AC in my house died after 40 years use, we installed them in our home and they are very efficient (24 SEER) in both AC and heat modes.

Don't know where you are located, but over insulating is usually a good idea no matter where you live.

Charles

Last edited by cbernhardt; 02-08-2019 at 09:45 AM.
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Old 02-08-2019, 09:56 AM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by cbernhardt View Post
My last shop, built in 2006, was a 36' x 50' Morton building, 13' ceiling because I installed a two post lift. I wanted it 36' wide so there was space to pull two cars "nose to tail" into each space. Garage doors were 10' x 10' so less chance of dinging one when going in and out plus I also have some farm equipment that occasionally needs service and repair. Initially I installed fluorescent lighting but I am now in the process of replacing all the bulbs with direct wire (no ballast) LED's. Water is always handy to have in the shop. We remodeled the kitchen in our house and I moved the sink, oven and cook top to the shop, even have a 1950's GE refrigerator from my parent's house.

We installed AC and a large propane heater when the shop was built, but I think if I were doing it now I would use the mini split heat pumps. When the AC in my house died after 40 years use, we installed them in our home and they are very efficient (24 SEER) in both AC and heat modes.

Don't know where you are located, but over insulating is usually a good idea no matter where you live.

Charles
I have a lake house in NH with an attached 2 car garage. I just finished the room above the garage and I'm going to have foam insulation done on the garage walls. There's no heat now in the room above the garage so we only use it in the warm months. I was thinking of heating the room and the garage with a Hyper unit mini split but we can get temperatures below zero there in the winter. What do you think? I'd be happy with the garage in the 50's.

Last edited by biggd; 02-08-2019 at 11:50 AM.
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