Engine ID
Thread Starter
Heel & Toe
Joined: Aug 2002
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From: 65812 Bad Soden / Ts
Engine ID
I'm fairly new - can anyone help me identify my engine block, since I suspect it's not what originally came with the car? At the back of the engine on the left side is the number 3959512 casted into the block. On the right side is J28 casted in. There does not appear to be a number stamped into the front right side of the block (but it might be covered with a layer of paint). My body ID number is J59S105936. Does anyone have the information as to what the correct engine number should be for my car?
Any info is welcome!
Thanks!
David
Any info is welcome!
Thanks!
David
Team Owner
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 38,897
Likes: 1,923
From: Washington Michigan
Re: Engine ID (David Tasa)
3959512 was used in passenger car 327's in '62-'63, and was used as a 327 service replacement for many years after that - yours was cast on October 2, 1968, so it's a service replacement. The correct (283) block for a '59 in your VIN# range would be #3756519. Your car was built approximately March 30th, 1959, so you'd want a 3756519 block cast up to six months prior to that date (2-4 weeks was more typical, but NCRS allows up to six months).
Thread Starter
Heel & Toe
Joined: Aug 2002
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From: 65812 Bad Soden / Ts
Re: Engine ID (JohnZ)
Thanks John, for that very helpful information! Now, can you, or anyone, tell me what the valve adjustment should be for that 327 engine, assuming it has the standard cam shaft for that block and solid lifters (that much I know!)? Also, what's the best way to set the valve lash, can it be done statically, with the engine hot? Any tips there would be much appreciated!
Thanks!
David
Thanks!
David
Safety Car
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,780
Likes: 442
From: Southwest MI
Re: Engine ID (David Tasa)
hi Dave
do an archive search, you'll find very descriptive instructions there on lashing valves.
Tip: the valve lash needs to be "correct" at operating temperture. But running it long enough to get it hot, then quickly lashing them before they cool is a real pain! What I do, is run it till it is good and warm, lash ~1/2 of the valves, then run it again, to get it warm again, and lash the remaining valves. THEN, allow it to cool.....till it gets to room (garage) temp, and then measure/record the cold lash for each valve. From then on, you just lash the with the engine cool, to the cold lash specs (which will become the correct HOT lash specs once the engine warms). It's much quicker, easier, and less stressful, to lash them cold (no rush, no hot oil, no time to warm.....which really takes ~30 mins, or so, depending on conditions)
good luck - Mike
[Modified by 66427-450, 12:19 PM 11/15/2002]
do an archive search, you'll find very descriptive instructions there on lashing valves.
Tip: the valve lash needs to be "correct" at operating temperture. But running it long enough to get it hot, then quickly lashing them before they cool is a real pain! What I do, is run it till it is good and warm, lash ~1/2 of the valves, then run it again, to get it warm again, and lash the remaining valves. THEN, allow it to cool.....till it gets to room (garage) temp, and then measure/record the cold lash for each valve. From then on, you just lash the with the engine cool, to the cold lash specs (which will become the correct HOT lash specs once the engine warms). It's much quicker, easier, and less stressful, to lash them cold (no rush, no hot oil, no time to warm.....which really takes ~30 mins, or so, depending on conditions)
good luck - Mike
[Modified by 66427-450, 12:19 PM 11/15/2002]
Thread Starter
Heel & Toe
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 19
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From: 65812 Bad Soden / Ts
Re: Engine ID (David Tasa)
Unfortunately I don't know what cam is in this engine. I did take the intake manifold off (it has an Edelbrock intake manifold and carburetor) and replaced the gaskets. While I had it apart, I took out one of the lifters and took it to a local Corvette parts dealer who varified that it was a solid lifter - so I know it has solid lifters and the configuration of the lifters is all in a straight row, (unlike pictures I've seen of engines with hydraulic lifters in a kind of zig-zag formation - if that means anything). I tried setting the valve lash as outlined in the '59 owners manual, that is, with a feeler guage and the engine idling, but found that was like changing a wagon wheel in the middle of an Indian attack!! So instead, I adjusted them statically by moving the car back and forth in gear until the rotor lined up with each spark plug wire and then adjusted the intake valves to .012" and exhaust to .018" hot. This made the engine run much quieter and would seem fine, BUT, if this is a 327 engine,and not a 283, have I set the valves correctly, or will it eventually burn the valves?? Any suggestions or thoughts? If 99% of the 327s had hydraulic lifters, what do I have here?
David
David
Team Owner
Joined: Oct 2000
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From: Washington Michigan
Re: Engine ID (David Tasa)
Without pulling the cam, it's pretty difficult to identify it; however, assuming it's a Chevy cam, you may be able to identify it using a dial indicator to measure its lift, as there were only two different Chevy small-block solid-lifter cams prior to 1970 (the "097" Duntov, used from '57-'63, and the "30-30", used in '64-'65 Corvettes and in '67-'69 Z/28's).
Lobe lift can be measured from the end of the pushrod or pushrod end of the rocker arm, or gross lift can be measured at the valve spring retainer (measuring lobe lift is more accurate, as the published "Gross Lift" numbers are based on a design 1.5:1 rocker arm ratio, and the actual ratio never exceeds 1.44:1).
"097" Duntov: Lobe Lift is .262" intake/.266" exhaust, Gross Lift is .393" intake/.399" exhaust.
"30-30": Lobe Lift is .323" for both, Gross Lift is .485" for both.
Lash specs for the Duntov are .012"/.018"; for the "30-30", they're .030" hot and running. If it looks like you have a "30-30", let me know and I'll e-mail you a procedure to set them cold.
[Modified by JohnZ, 12:33 PM 11/16/2002]
Lobe lift can be measured from the end of the pushrod or pushrod end of the rocker arm, or gross lift can be measured at the valve spring retainer (measuring lobe lift is more accurate, as the published "Gross Lift" numbers are based on a design 1.5:1 rocker arm ratio, and the actual ratio never exceeds 1.44:1).
"097" Duntov: Lobe Lift is .262" intake/.266" exhaust, Gross Lift is .393" intake/.399" exhaust.
"30-30": Lobe Lift is .323" for both, Gross Lift is .485" for both.
Lash specs for the Duntov are .012"/.018"; for the "30-30", they're .030" hot and running. If it looks like you have a "30-30", let me know and I'll e-mail you a procedure to set them cold.
[Modified by JohnZ, 12:33 PM 11/16/2002]
Thread Starter
Heel & Toe
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 19
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From: 65812 Bad Soden / Ts
Re: Engine ID (JohnZ)
John,
Again, thank you for this information. I will get a dial indicator at the next opportunity and measure the lift, as you suggested. My guess is that since the adjustments I made were relatively small on the valve lash, and since I'm sure they hadn't been adjusted for a long time, that I probably have the Duntov cam. The valves were slightly noisy before and quieted down afterwards, so I think the .012 and.018 settings are probably correct - but as soon as I can get a dial indicator, I'll check for sure to have more peace of mind. Since I have an Edelbrock intake manifold and carburetor, I'd asked on their technical hot line what the valve lash would be if I had an Edelbrock cam as well (since I see that they are sometimes sold as a performance package). But I was told that Edelbrock cams were only made for hydroulic lifters, so I figured I could rule that out and think it's much more likely that I have one of the stock chevy cams.
Again, I'd like to thank you for your help and was wondering if I might be able to contact you off list, should I determine that I do have the 30-30 cam?
My email address is davidtasa@aol.com. Perhaps you could send me yours.
David
Again, thank you for this information. I will get a dial indicator at the next opportunity and measure the lift, as you suggested. My guess is that since the adjustments I made were relatively small on the valve lash, and since I'm sure they hadn't been adjusted for a long time, that I probably have the Duntov cam. The valves were slightly noisy before and quieted down afterwards, so I think the .012 and.018 settings are probably correct - but as soon as I can get a dial indicator, I'll check for sure to have more peace of mind. Since I have an Edelbrock intake manifold and carburetor, I'd asked on their technical hot line what the valve lash would be if I had an Edelbrock cam as well (since I see that they are sometimes sold as a performance package). But I was told that Edelbrock cams were only made for hydroulic lifters, so I figured I could rule that out and think it's much more likely that I have one of the stock chevy cams.
Again, I'd like to thank you for your help and was wondering if I might be able to contact you off list, should I determine that I do have the 30-30 cam?
My email address is davidtasa@aol.com. Perhaps you could send me yours.
David
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Team Owner
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 38,897
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From: Washington Michigan
Re: Engine ID (wallyknoch)
The 1970 LT-1 used P/N 3972178 (casting #3972182, with a "1" surrounded by a square next to it); was used through 1972 on LT-1's, and was the last solid-lifter SB Chevy cam.
Cruising
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12
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From: Ottawa ONT
Re: Engine ID (JohnZ)
John,
You sound like just the guy I need for help. I have a 63 coupe with a 350 in it. I would like to put back in the correct engine but can't seem to figure out which one of two possibilities it is. The car is an automatic so I have it down to the two possible 327's but can't figure out which one would be correct. Can you point me in the right direction as to what I should be looking for and where I might find out more info.
Dave
Ottawa, Canada
[Modified by Oolong, 4:07 AM 11/22/2002]
You sound like just the guy I need for help. I have a 63 coupe with a 350 in it. I would like to put back in the correct engine but can't seem to figure out which one of two possibilities it is. The car is an automatic so I have it down to the two possible 327's but can't figure out which one would be correct. Can you point me in the right direction as to what I should be looking for and where I might find out more info.
Dave
Ottawa, Canada
[Modified by Oolong, 4:07 AM 11/22/2002]
Team Owner
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 38,897
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From: Washington Michigan
Re: Engine ID (Oolong)
Dave - As you noted, with Powerglide, it had to be either a 250hp or 300hp originally; both had the same tach redline and the same standard axle ratio, and I don't know what other "clues" might lead you to which of the two engines it had originally. Maybe one of the other Forum members who really know 63's like Duke or Chuck can help you out.
