Frame off advice needed
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 5,420
Likes: 1,234
From: Sarver Pa
2021 C1 of the Year Finalist - Modified
Frame off advice needed
I have been working on my own Vettes for years and word gets around. I was approached by a fellow that has a 69 Vert with a bad frame. He asked me to change the frame under it and I am seriously considering doing it for him. BUT, I don't have a clue how much to tell him for an estimate ! I looked at the car and the frame is bad, (so is the car)so it will need all new bushings, lines,mounts etc. It runs and drives so I don't have to do the engine and trans.The brake calipers look fresh.I have done this on mine and helped other people, but never kept track of the hours. Anybody have any ideas on what a job like this is worth??
Thanks, Pops
Thanks, Pops
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,084
Likes: 14
From: Airdrie Alberta
I would probably charge time and materials .
Once you take these apart you never know what you will run into...some parts may be reusable, some not. Everything will need to be sand blasted, refinished and reassembled, new fasteners etc
It is pretty hard to set a fixed price unless you set it very high, as each car will be different. shops will charge anywhere from 45-$75 per hour.
I have the same dilema with my paint and body work that I do as a hobby, I use to just charge a fixed rate for the complete job but udercut myself so many times.
I performed a rotisserie resto on a 66 Mustang convert that won an outstanding in class at World of Wheels and now every car show he attends I get people wanting me to do the same to thiers.
http://pic4.piczo.com/CoopersGarage/?g=5609519&cr=4
Charge a price that will make it worth while for yourself taking into account wear & tear on your equipment, tools and marrage...life is too short to do it for free
Once you take these apart you never know what you will run into...some parts may be reusable, some not. Everything will need to be sand blasted, refinished and reassembled, new fasteners etc
It is pretty hard to set a fixed price unless you set it very high, as each car will be different. shops will charge anywhere from 45-$75 per hour.
I have the same dilema with my paint and body work that I do as a hobby, I use to just charge a fixed rate for the complete job but udercut myself so many times.
I performed a rotisserie resto on a 66 Mustang convert that won an outstanding in class at World of Wheels and now every car show he attends I get people wanting me to do the same to thiers.
http://pic4.piczo.com/CoopersGarage/?g=5609519&cr=4
Charge a price that will make it worth while for yourself taking into account wear & tear on your equipment, tools and marrage...life is too short to do it for free
Last edited by hwcoop; Aug 20, 2007 at 05:03 PM.
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 5,420
Likes: 1,234
From: Sarver Pa
2021 C1 of the Year Finalist - Modified
What would you guesstimate it at ? That's what the guy wants. Around 10 grand ? Frame, parts and labor.
BTW, I just shipped a 86 Fiero GT to Ardrie !
Thanks, Pops
BTW, I just shipped a 86 Fiero GT to Ardrie !
Thanks, Pops
Safety Car
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 4,883
Likes: 11
From: North Easton Mass
Is he looking for an original restoration or creative? A frame for a 69, if you can find a good one, will run at least $1,500 - $2,000, maybe more. Good chrome bumper frames are getting scarce and sellers know what they have. In addition to all new bushings you will probably want to put in new brake and fuel lines, rebuild the trailing arms, replace all of the U-joints, fix any leaks in the engine/trans/differential. Shops up in the Boston area are getting close to $100/hr for labor, and you know from having done this before that are going to be a lot of suprises.
Rick B.
Rick B.
Racer
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 265
Likes: 1
Time and Materials...
Like the man said, Time and Materials.
The best way to approach this is to agree on an hourly rate and charge that.
I used to end up doing all kinds of computer work for people and I got tired of never having any time for "my" projects. So I started charging what I feel my time is worth to have to work on something else and taking time away from what I would much rather be doing. I still get some people paying the $$$ for me to fix their machines and I am OK with that.
So, set your $$ for the work you do and don't sell yourself short either. Figure what a pro body shop charges and then charge about 75% of that.
Just some ideas.
The best way to approach this is to agree on an hourly rate and charge that.
I used to end up doing all kinds of computer work for people and I got tired of never having any time for "my" projects. So I started charging what I feel my time is worth to have to work on something else and taking time away from what I would much rather be doing. I still get some people paying the $$$ for me to fix their machines and I am OK with that.
So, set your $$ for the work you do and don't sell yourself short either. Figure what a pro body shop charges and then charge about 75% of that.
Just some ideas.
Safety Car
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 3,730
Likes: 707
From: Shelton, Connecticut
St. Jude Donor '08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16
What are you removing?
I did a 72 frame off restoration. I estimated it would cost 200 - 300 for parts and paint. That was in 1988. Wound up costing me almost a grand. If you have to pull the interior, you have to figure close to 100hours for removal and reinstall. That is three full weeks of working on just that car. That is provided the new frame doesn't need any prep work. With all the effort that is required, you need to figure all suspension front and rear, brake and gas lines, u joints etc. That is all separate effort.
Racer
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 495
Likes: 1
From: Spokane Washington
1969-82 rolling chassis $9,200 unassembled with brake calipers and rotors , gas tank and fuel and brake lines, rear end ratio of choice. ) or Choice 2 :Assmbled bolted together $9,950.
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Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 5,420
Likes: 1,234
From: Sarver Pa
2021 C1 of the Year Finalist - Modified
Thanks for the advice guys. Let's see 100 hrs at $50 hr + nice frame + $1000 or more in parts ....I told him between $7500 to $10,000 and haven't heard from him in 3 weeks. I think reality sunk in. There may be a 69 Vert for sale soon because the car needs interior and paint also.
Or maybe Joe Blow and Bubba will take on the job for $20 hr and tear it apart and leave it set for a couple years !! I've seen it happen.
Or maybe Joe Blow and Bubba will take on the job for $20 hr and tear it apart and leave it set for a couple years !! I've seen it happen.
Racer
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 265
Likes: 1
Van Steel charges $4200 for a chassis rebuild. That doesn't include pulling the body or putting it back or new hard lines for brakes and gas. Acid dip and powder coat is an extra $1200.
So just to get a clean, powder coated frame completely rebuilt is $5400.
So figure $10K is about right for that job if you are going to pull the body and put it back. If the car is in really rough shape that estimate might go higher because you will have to fix body mounts and other essential body repairs like the floor/firewall.
I am going through the process myself and if I had the $$ I would have paid someone to do the fixes to the body. I have about 500+ hours in this already and I haven't even started fixing fiberglass, figure that to be about another 500 hours. But its a labor of love and I enjoy this stuff... right?
So just to get a clean, powder coated frame completely rebuilt is $5400.
So figure $10K is about right for that job if you are going to pull the body and put it back. If the car is in really rough shape that estimate might go higher because you will have to fix body mounts and other essential body repairs like the floor/firewall.
I am going through the process myself and if I had the $$ I would have paid someone to do the fixes to the body. I have about 500+ hours in this already and I haven't even started fixing fiberglass, figure that to be about another 500 hours. But its a labor of love and I enjoy this stuff... right?
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,560
Likes: 5
From: the land of a never ending frame-off resto-mod. May Visa have mercy on my soul.
If he decides to go with it PUT IT IN WRITING!!!! I know, I am having a heck of a time with a guy about my vette as to what he did vs the actual job. What a mess. Lawyers are hungry and will love to take it on but they want the $$$$.
It looks like small claims court for me to cut my losses with this jerk. From now on EVERYTHING is in writing estimates or actual work.
It looks like small claims court for me to cut my losses with this jerk. From now on EVERYTHING is in writing estimates or actual work.