Shimming a starter
10-28-2008, 02:17 PM
#1
Pro
Thread Starter
Shimming a starter
Any Pics or Illustrations on Shimming a Starter.....I've seen different places to check clearance ( Side and Tip of the Starter Gear )
10-28-2008, 05:22 PM
#2
Team Owner
I see from your profile that you have a '73, what engine is in it? I'm not sure it matters as I think both the 350 and 454 from '73 (and loads of other GM cars from about '66-'81 or so) use a "10 MT" starter. It is my understanding that these starters were made to not need any shims. Can you tell us more about what is going on?
10-29-2008, 12:21 PM
#3
Pro
Thread Starter
I see from your profile that you have a '73, what engine is in it? I'm not sure it matters as I think both the 350 and 454 from '73 (and loads of other GM cars from about '66-'81 or so) use a "10 MT" starter. It is my understanding that these starters were made to not need any shims. Can you tell us more about what is going on?
It's a 350/400 Turbo.........When I bought the car the stock starter would grind ( not real bad ).......but it didn't want to start ( slow cranking ) when it got hot. I would have to let it cool off.....So iI finally got tired of that and ordered a High Torque Mini-Starter from Summit $200. Had to order the Diode Kit for the "R" terminal, put it on and it made a terrible noise, tried no Shim, 1 Shim, 2 Shims, then it would not disengage. So I sent it back and put the stock one back on ( at least I knew it would work ). Later I bought another High Torque Mini locally, put it on using stock bolts ( had to use washers to make up the difference in length ) and it worked good when it was hot, but it would grind, then the grinding got real bad, so I took it off and put on a new Zoom Flexplate ( figured it had to bad ). Put the Mini back on then it started kicking out, took it back and they fixed it ( said the motor kicked back on it ). When I went to put it back on I bought new grade 8 bolts with the right lenght and torqued them to 30 FT LBS and cracked the housing ( thought it might be OK since it was in place ) worked good for awhile ( still grinds ) Then tried to start it one morning and the end came off. So back to the stock starter again. It was a nice day so we went for a cruise about 50 miles away. Then went to start it and it cranked a few times, then clicked, tried to jump it, no go. Had to get a Rollback and took it to a relatives Funeral Home parking lot and left it overnight. Went the next day a put another Mini on in the parking lot and got battery charged. It started, but made grinding noise, shut it off and tried again and it barely started. I made it home and tried to start it and it just made a grinding noise. So I took it back and the guy gave me my money back and said he didn't know what was wrong. Then I went to AutoZone and bought a Gear Reduction Starter for a '73 ( it didn't have the "R" terminal ) So i went to the guy that sold me the Mini and he switched Solenoids out for me. Now I'm getting ready the put the new starter on now and want to make sure I have it shimmed right ! Could I have a warped Tourque Converter ? If it still grinds when I put this one on I'm going to diconnect the Tourque Converter and crank it then an see what happens ! !
10-29-2008, 12:29 PM
#4
Race Director
I see from your profile that you have a '73, what engine is in it? I'm not sure it matters as I think both the 350 and 454 from '73 (and loads of other GM cars from about '66-'81 or so) use a "10 MT" starter. It is my understanding that these starters were made to not need any shims. Can you tell us more about what is going on?
most starters dont need shims. Shims pull the drive away from the ring gear. Not necessarily what you want to do. Destroys ring gears and then you have to pull the trans.
10-29-2008, 01:37 PM
#6
Quickest
The quickest easiest way to set the shims in a Chevy pad mount starter is get an 3/8" allen wrench.
Take the wrench and go under the car. See if the wrench just slides in and fits between the armature shaft on the starter (the shaft the pinion gear is on) and the tips of the ring gear. If it is too tight, you need a shim. If it is just right, it is. If it is too much of a gap you have to shim only one side to bring it closer to the ring gear.
This is much easier than using a .020 wire gauge or the sound method.
Take the wrench and go under the car. See if the wrench just slides in and fits between the armature shaft on the starter (the shaft the pinion gear is on) and the tips of the ring gear. If it is too tight, you need a shim. If it is just right, it is. If it is too much of a gap you have to shim only one side to bring it closer to the ring gear.
This is much easier than using a .020 wire gauge or the sound method.
11-03-2008, 01:52 PM
#8
Pro
Thread Starter
FINALLY ...................I've got a starter that works without making any grinding noise and starts on the first try when its hot. Installed the Autozone Gear Reduction Starter ( Life time warranty ) ! No shimms needed ! Time to ROCK-N-ROLL !
Last edited by TERRY CLARK; 11-03-2008 at 01:54 PM.
11-03-2008, 02:18 PM
#9
Drifting
The "Not starting when it's hot" is called heat soak - doesn't have anything to do with shimming or not shimming. The best rule of thumb for starter replacement and whether or not you have to shim is to replace with the exact starter (AC Delco - NOT Delco Remy), and to duplicate what was used from the orginal install - i.e. was the old starter shimmed or not? In my case I went through 3 starter replacements until I actually found an AC Delco store and bought the correct starter for my 81. The factory starter I took off was shimmed - the shims went back in - no grinding and no heat soak. (Two Delco Remy starters failed due to heat soak - no cranking when hot).
11-03-2008, 04:23 PM
#10
Pro
Thread Starter
The "Not starting when it's hot" is called heat soak - doesn't have anything to do with shimming or not shimming. The best rule of thumb for starter replacement and whether or not you have to shim is to replace with the exact starter (AC Delco - NOT Delco Remy), and to duplicate what was used from the orginal install - i.e. was the old starter shimmed or not? In my case I went through 3 starter replacements until I actually found an AC Delco store and bought the correct starter for my 81. The factory starter I took off was shimmed - the shims went back in - no grinding and no heat soak. (Two Delco Remy starters failed due to heat soak - no cranking when hot).
I know heat soaked has nothing to do with shimms....everybody on the forum talks about shimming starters. I wanted to make sure before I tried a new starter and take a chance on doing damage to a new Flexplate.
