Big Block Feel
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 327
Likes: 3
Big Block Feel
Just sitting here day dreaming and I was thinking back on my old 67 427(390hp) and I was just wondering if it was possible to build up a small block to feel like a big block. I've never been in something newer than a C3 and all of them were close to stock motors. I've read about 383 or 406 SB's and was wondering if those had a BB feel. If not what would, other then a BB itself? I've had a 73 L82 and now a 74 L48 and of course not even close. And I know an LS motor doesn't do it either. Or am I just day dreaming for nothing?
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 769
Likes: 36
From: Goose Creek SC
I built a 406 for an El Camino and it was close in sound and feel to a 402 and faster than a stock 402. IMO the BB heads bring them to a different level and equivalent torque feel is just hard to duplicate. However, without a doubt, you can get 'fast' with an sbc.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,948
Likes: 72
From: Oxford MA-----You just lost the game!!!!
You can get a 454 c.i.d. small block chevy with a 4.185 in. bore and 4.125 in. stroke on an aftermarket block with a raised cam. If you added about a hundred and fifty pounds of weight to the front end, it would probably feel alot like a big-block.
Scott
Scott
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,223
Likes: 4
From: Regina Saskatchewan
I had a 396 years ago that I put in a '37 plymouth coupe. I've got a 383 in my present vette. The 383 has got a nice throaty nasty sound , but the 396 still had a BB feel, was throatier and nastier. Cruising 'main' - there was no doubt there was a BB under the hood ( when I had the hood on ). I think one is apples and the other oranges. Ya can't turn an orange into an apple
Race Director
Joined: Dec 1999
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From: Forked River NJ
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,223
Likes: 4
From: Regina Saskatchewan
You obviously have not driven or riden in a LS motored car. Not the stock LS1 but an LS3 or 7 will smoke a big block. Throw a cam in them and you have never seen power like that from any normal BB. The LS is way lighter and can produce gobs of tire frying torque very easily. They come with 430 to 505 hp stock. How many BB cars did that.
Mind you , at parties I can tell you what brand of beer you pour into my glass , just by tasting it. Majority think they can, but suprisingly not a lot can. Hey maybe I've got 2 superpowers ! Maybe I'm finally good for something else !
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2007
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From: Graceland in a Not Correctly Restored Stingray
You can certainly build a big-inch SB with plenty of torque, but a BB of equal CID will typically have a higher bore/stroke ratio, higher rod/stroke ratio, higher rocker arm ratio, better flowing heads, and larger valves. Nothing against SB die-hards, but comparing a 427 SB to a 427 BB is definitely an apples and oranges thing.
And, for those who insist that the BB is a supermassive lump that will ruin handling, the thing you're overlooking is called "chassis tuning". Besides, a BB with alum heads, intake and water pump is only ~100# more than an L82, and that weight is behind the front axle.
Last edited by TheSkunkWorks; Sep 3, 2011 at 07:15 PM.
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,697
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From: Syracuse NY
Ive got a 82 Z28 with a well worked 350. Somewhere around 400 HP (Butt dyno figures) While my BB Vette feels like its got more torque, my Camaro feels much stronger across the board. So to answer your question.....yes, a small block can come close to a BB in feel.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 327
Likes: 3
So it sounds like you can get the BB feel(grunt) out of a small block and of course I'm not really talking speed, although it wouldn't hurt. I'm also wondering, will a SB clutch,trans and rearend handle all that lowend torque, or is there no difference in the mechanical stoutness (454) factory original installation. As I'm daydreaming I'm thinking about my 74 which is all original #'s matching machine and just thinking if I yanked the motor and put in a 383 or 406 would anything else going going back have to be changed? My thought is if I popped the hood now and guys would say "Oh I see it's all original" and a month later, after the 383 was installed I would want the same look. Of course the numbers wouldn't match the original L48.
Race Director
Joined: May 2003
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From: Science Bitch! Mississauga, Ontario
Canadian Events Coordinator
As I'm daydreaming I'm thinking about my 74 which is all original #'s matching machine and just thinking if I yanked the motor and put in a 383 or 406 would anything else going going back have to be changed? My thought is if I popped the hood now and guys would say "Oh I see it's all original" and a month later, after the 383 was installed I would want the same look. Of course the numbers wouldn't match the original L48.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,116
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From: Livonia MI
I've been in some well set up 406 SB's, that flat out scream, and 100 lb lighter package than BB's. I have a C6 ZO6 LS7, and believe me, it's got the feel. Guy's stock on drag tires, are dipping into the 10's with these. Whole thing only tips the scales a bit over 3100 lbs, with the LS motor being 120 lb less than an iron headed small block.
Le Mans Master
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From: LONG ISLAND
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You obviously have not driven or riden in a LS motored car. Not the stock LS1 but an LS3 or 7 will smoke a big block. Throw a cam in them and you have never seen power like that from any normal BB. The LS is way lighter and can produce gobs of tire frying torque very easily. They come with 430 to 505 hp stock. How many BB cars did that.
Close, yes.... but there is NOTHING like a true, factory big block !!!
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,223
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From: Regina Saskatchewan
And so did mine once I was finished with it. If you are including 'sound' as part of BB 'feel' - even a deaf guy could tell the difference between an LS and a BB. And I consider sound part of the mystique of a BB.
Maybe my mother couldn't tell the difference ...... maybe some girls.....
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: LONG ISLAND
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Race Director
Joined: Dec 1999
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From: Forked River NJ
not being a jerk just joking. This debate can go on forever.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,116
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From: Livonia MI
Yup, "Gordonm's" right, as driving living proof of that in an LS7 car. Never will sound like an older BB, as different firing order. Over 200 lbs lighter, with much better flowing heads, so guess I'll just have to live with with sound. Hard to say what actual hp ratings were before 72', as lot's of games were played. Tranny's are really today's stars, with multi low an high gear ratio's.