C-3 200 MPH aerodynamics
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2004
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C-3 200 MPH aerodynamics
Allright guys I need some informed opinions. Assuming you can get enough ponies from under a stock hood (you can). We are looking at the aerodynamics of running a stock body form from 180 - 200 mph.
This is strictly straight line, no cornering, run for 4 miles to get top speed!
One school of thought (my brother) thinks we need to lower the car and look at putting aluminum belly skins on the underside of the car.
I'm thinking that lowering and belly pans are a handling deal - and lower and smoother would increase Venturi effect - in essence suck the car to the ground and steal horsepower.
I'm thinking if we do anything we ought to look at "shortening" the front airdam" to lessen "wetted" area. I also think we need to be carefull to keep the car level - not nose high or nose low.
I was also afraid of this car getting "light" up front - but if you look at the weight in the front of the car - and how "small" the lifting surfaces would be - I'm thinking that is a non issue.
Any one with any ideas - or esspecially any expertise in this area?
Carl "200 or bust" Johansson
This is strictly straight line, no cornering, run for 4 miles to get top speed!
One school of thought (my brother) thinks we need to lower the car and look at putting aluminum belly skins on the underside of the car.
I'm thinking that lowering and belly pans are a handling deal - and lower and smoother would increase Venturi effect - in essence suck the car to the ground and steal horsepower.
I'm thinking if we do anything we ought to look at "shortening" the front airdam" to lessen "wetted" area. I also think we need to be carefull to keep the car level - not nose high or nose low.
I was also afraid of this car getting "light" up front - but if you look at the weight in the front of the car - and how "small" the lifting surfaces would be - I'm thinking that is a non issue.
Any one with any ideas - or esspecially any expertise in this area?
Carl "200 or bust" Johansson
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From: Smalltownville Michigan
Cruise-In 5, 6 & 10 Veteran
St. Jude Donor '09
get with burners.. he has some pretty wild rear pans on his car...i would think that 78 and newer ones would be more capable of the speed due to the better aerodynamic lines...
Team Owner
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From: All humans are vermin in the eyes of Guru VA
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Cruise-In V Veteran
The early C3 aerodynamics are horrible. .41, but I believe it makes up for it with a small frontal area 19 sq ft.
Replacing the chrome mirrors with the later sport mirrors might help.
Somebody also mentioned vortex generators(airplane part) that should help with the air going over the hood.
Also I think there might be a need for some kind of spoiler to help direct flow around the rear, as we have that flat drop off which hurts us alot with aerodynamics.
Mind you this is all what I heard.
Replacing the chrome mirrors with the later sport mirrors might help.
Somebody also mentioned vortex generators(airplane part) that should help with the air going over the hood.
Also I think there might be a need for some kind of spoiler to help direct flow around the rear, as we have that flat drop off which hurts us alot with aerodynamics.
Mind you this is all what I heard.
Safety Car
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 4,883
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From: North Easton Mass
Find out who the top C3 racers were in the 70's and see what they did to their cars. Aerodynamics were still more of an art than a science when the C3 was born and there weren't any computer simulations available to test different designs.
No doubt that it can be done, but think about what is going to happen to a fiberglass bodied car if you lose control at 200 mph. Make sure you wear a helmet so they know which side to face up in the casket.
Rick B.
No doubt that it can be done, but think about what is going to happen to a fiberglass bodied car if you lose control at 200 mph. Make sure you wear a helmet so they know which side to face up in the casket.
Rick B.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2004
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Originally Posted by Blair Winch Project
Find out who the top C3 racers were in the 70's and see what they did to their cars. Aerodynamics were still more of an art than a science when the C3 was born and there weren't any computer simulations available to test different designs.
No doubt that it can be done, but think about what is going to happen to a fiberglass bodied car if you lose control at 200 mph. Make sure you wear a helmet so they know which side to face up in the casket.
Rick B.
No doubt that it can be done, but think about what is going to happen to a fiberglass bodied car if you lose control at 200 mph. Make sure you wear a helmet so they know which side to face up in the casket.
Rick B.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2004
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This is an 82 - so we do have the long window and the rear spoiler - that ought to help give turbulant flow - less low pressure / suction on the rear.
Where do I find this Burners guy?
As for earlier vettes - the one picture I found was an older C-3 at Lemans going 213 - he had a big air dam up front - but I'm thinking that was for handling.
Where do I find this Burners guy?
As for earlier vettes - the one picture I found was an older C-3 at Lemans going 213 - he had a big air dam up front - but I'm thinking that was for handling.
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From: Forked River NJ
I remember them saying that the L88s that ran at Lemans used to get very light in the front and the steering would be almost non existant when they approached 180 to 200. The cure was a big front air dam. If you think that it is only a small erae it is enough to lift the front. you will need some type of spoiler to help keep it down. The later C3s were better.
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From: Smalltownville Michigan
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St. Jude Donor '09
do a search for him on here... he's out of Santo, Tx if I remember right.. his rear pan had fins/strakes on it. Wish i got some of the pics of it at CI..i was in awe of that car.. it was a rolling research project!
Melting Slicks
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: pr, frederick md.
i cant recall the exact name but that race they have in nevada, where top speed is the goal. i would think if you studied what these guys do, you would get an idea how to make your c-3. ive seen some of it, and they all have an air dam. belly pans with the diverters built into the rear are common place. the object is to keep the air from under the car, to avoid lift, right? i would not place much concern with the idea of to much down force slowing you down as you stated. that being said, i believe the c-3 is an excellent place to start, as the later styles appear very slippery. especially when you compare to some stuff these guys run. ive seen trucks, old desotos, elcaminos, you name it. and their already going as fast as your hoping to go. if it was me i would worry more about hp, and less about aero. the best aero car cant do squat without something pushing it. once you hit that wall, its gonna be about hp, not aero. just my .02
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2004
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Yup - they run 2 of those open road races a year in Nevada - and also a similar race in Mexico - that is the ultimate goal for this thing - along with a C-4 we are building.
But along the way we are having some fun running them at Bonneville - just for Kicks!
But along the way we are having some fun running them at Bonneville - just for Kicks!
Safety Car
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From: St. Charles IL
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A CI-6 Car Show Winner
Originally Posted by Carl Johansson
Where do I find this Burners guy?
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/member.php?userid=11152
Team Owner
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From: Zionsville, PA NRA Life Member
St. Jude '03-'04-'05-'06-'07-'08-'09-'10
If I'm remembering the correct guy , talk with " gkull ". I think he was doing some Bonneville salt flats with his C3.
If it's not him
Jeff
If it's not him
Jeff
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2002
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From: Manchester, Dead Center in the Middle of TN 25 miles to Jack Daniels,10 miles to Geo Dickle, and .8 mile from the Liquor Store at I-24 Exit 114
St. Jude Donor '05
Sure you can do 200 MPH at Bonneville in a Corvette. Here is a guy in a '53 Studebaker Lowboy that did with the A/C on! jim
" Jack Chisenhall, the president of Vintage Air, Inc., recently drove his highly modified '53 Studebaker through Bonneville's measured mile at an astonishing 219.585 miles per hour--with the air conditioning blowing at a steady 37-degrees!"
http://www.the-glas-shop.com/vintage.htm
" Jack Chisenhall, the president of Vintage Air, Inc., recently drove his highly modified '53 Studebaker through Bonneville's measured mile at an astonishing 219.585 miles per hour--with the air conditioning blowing at a steady 37-degrees!"
http://www.the-glas-shop.com/vintage.htm
Pro
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From: The Armpit of Illinois Platato says..... "Sometimes your the windshield & sometimes your the bug".
St. Jude Donor '05
Definitely modify your tops where they hang over the front windshield. Use some foam & pardon the pun, 200 mph tape. or modify in some other way to avoid the huge drag effect
Platato
Platato
thats a good point.