C3 Tech/Performance V8 Technical Info, Internal Engine, External Engine, Basic Tech and Maintenance for the C3 Corvette
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

427 or 454?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Sep 26, 2005 | 01:32 PM
  #21  
GDaina's Avatar
GDaina
Race Director
Supporting Lifetime Gold
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 16,978
Likes: 7
From: In Dreams There Is Truth Ohio
Default

Originally Posted by langg
I understand that some of the last 427 blocks were 'relieved' by the factory to accomodate the longer 454 stroke. Any way to tell externally if the block has the reliefs.
if you turn the bloc upside down, you will see notches at the bottom of the inside cylinder walls..

Even if the block doesn't have the notches, a die grinder will do the job.

Install the crank and piston, rotate the crank, mark the area where it hits, then grind a small notch..don't grind a lot, cause if you do, you will hit the water jacket...just little at a time till the rod rotates without interferance, then do the next...or you can take it to a machine shop and have them do it.
Reply
Old Sep 26, 2005 | 03:08 PM
  #22  
pauvil's Avatar
pauvil
Racer
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 317
Likes: 0
From: PA
Default

gkull, so what's your 427 do in the quarter, cause I bet I could take you with my 327!!! I know I'm stupid!! but what does your last line mean??
I only have a hot rodded 427 and I don't have any illusions of taking on somebodies hot rodded 540 ci monster. Thats about as stupid as the guy with hot rodded 350 ci taking me on.

are you telling me that a 327 won't rev quicker than say a 383?? I wasn't talking about torque, I said more cubes was better. He asked the difference.
Reply
Old Sep 26, 2005 | 04:04 PM
  #23  
gkull's Avatar
gkull
Team Owner
25 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 21,953
Likes: 1,445
From: Reno Nevada
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
Default

rev quicker in neutral only. That statement is also not true. I used a 40 lbs hollow drilled 4340 nitrided 3.750 stroke crank in my 383. typical stock SBC forgings are 50 ish pounds and the cast SBC cranks are @56#

The least rotating mass motor will gain rpm the quickest

Longer stroke might have a marginal loss on friction, but the motor with the most TQ can accelerate the fastest.

I was just commenting on the wrong notion of the shorter stroke 427 ci reving faster than a 454 or 502.

If you build 3 motors with everything the same intake system, heads, cam shaft, exhaust system, including compression. but all you changed was cubic inch by changing the stroke length. Like 3.76 = 427 4.00 for 454 and 4.25 for 480 or so ci. They will all have the same HP within a few. Only the longer stroke will have the same HP at a lower rpm. The big change from 427 - 480 is 53 ci with might give you a additional 800-100 pounds of TQ

1/4 mile is really for people that drink beer with a lime in it. Lets call this group "girliemen". Real men do the 1 mile drag racing out at santioned events in their street cars. That's where you shut up the guys that think they have a hot c-5 Z06 or the new C-6's. High tech FI late Vette with 350 ci does not rev faster than old carburated 383 or now my 427.
Reply
Old Sep 26, 2005 | 04:37 PM
  #24  
panchop's Avatar
panchop
Melting Slicks
 
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,130
Likes: 1
From: mesa,az
Default

Originally Posted by gkull
1/4 mile is really for people that drink beer with a lime in it. Lets call this group "girliemen". Real men do the 1 mile drag racing out at santioned events in their street cars.
dammn dissing my sport and my beer all in one post. LOL you gonna put my panties in a knot.
Reply
Old Sep 26, 2005 | 04:41 PM
  #25  
1979L82's Avatar
1979L82
Instructor
20 Year Member
All Eyes On Me
 
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 107
Likes: 0
From: New Berlin WI
Default 454 0r 502

Originally Posted by norvalwilhelm
I would rather have the 502. On the street cubic inches wins most of the time. The only problem you can run into is lack of traction on street tires and then a smaller less powerful engine might win. Jumping from a 427 to a 454 amounts to about 25 horses more with identical engines.
The 502 would be even more of a jump.
The cost of building either motor is the same for parts.

there is no replacement for displacement, ...

well maybe money if it is a factor
Reply
Old Sep 26, 2005 | 04:48 PM
  #26  
gkull's Avatar
gkull
Team Owner
25 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 21,953
Likes: 1,445
From: Reno Nevada
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
Default

The whole original idea of lime or lemon in drinks is to make non-refrigerated drinks better. Now this is the modern era where we all have refrigeration and the lime is used to cover up the taste of all the urine from all our south of the border friends filling the vats.

to the poster - If you can get a BBC 427 and make it a complete running motor with correct dynamic compression for todays pump gas for less money than the 454-502 I'd say that you will be happy.
Reply
Old Sep 27, 2005 | 08:16 AM
  #27  
Alexarz's Avatar
Alexarz
Racer
 
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 262
Likes: 0
From: Kissimmee Fl
Default

I agree with gkull about the 1/4 mile being too short. I have never heard of 1 mile drag races, however. In my opinion, drag racing should be extended to 1/3 mile rather than 1/4. If it is extended, we will see fewer jalopies beating Vipers, etc. 1 mile seems a bit too long, though.
Reply
Old Sep 27, 2005 | 08:36 AM
  #28  
pauvil's Avatar
pauvil
Racer
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 317
Likes: 0
From: PA
Default

Not always true, The most torque will only accelerate fastest if set up properly, true, ie, gears, trans, ignition, etc, I've seen plenty of "big torque motors get "cleaned up" by small blocks, and I did say "the cubes are obvious". I'm not here to argue, only learn from others. Anyway I love my Chevys, I have 2-327's, 3-350's and 2-454's, always wanted to get my hands on a 427.

Last edited by pauvil; Sep 27, 2005 at 08:43 AM.
Reply
Corvette Stories

The Best of Corvette for Corvette Enthusiasts

story-0

10 Ugly Corvettes That We Still Kinda Love

 Joe Kucinski
story-1

Top 10 Most Expensive Corvettes Ever Sold on Bring A Trailer

 Brett Foote
story-2

10 Things Every Corvette Owner Needs (2026 Edition)

 Michael S. Palmer
story-3

8 Most "Only Corvette Owners Understand" Quirks and Problems

 Pouria Savadkouei
story-4

10 Reasons the C6 Z06 is Still A Performance Benchmark After 20 Years

 Joe Kucinski
story-5

How Much Horsepower Every Corvette Engine "LOST" in 1972

 Joe Kucinski
story-6

Top 10 DOs and DON'Ts for Protecting Your Convertible Top!

 Michael S. Palmer
story-7

Top 10 Most Explosive Corvettes Ever Made: Power-to-Weight Ratio Ranked!

 Joe Kucinski
story-8

150 hp to 1,250 hp: Every Corvette Generation Compared by the Specs That Matter

 Joe Kucinski
story-9

8 Coolest Corvette Pace Cars (and Replicas) of All Time

 Verdad Gallardo
Old Sep 27, 2005 | 09:28 AM
  #29  
GDaina's Avatar
GDaina
Race Director
Supporting Lifetime Gold
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 16,978
Likes: 7
From: In Dreams There Is Truth Ohio
Default

Originally Posted by pauvil
Anyway I love my Chevys, I have 2-327's, 3-350's and 2-454's, always wanted to get my hands on a 427.

All ya gotta do is throw in a 3.76" stroke crank and pistons, rods are the same, into one of your 454's and voila, you have a 427.
Reply
Old Sep 27, 2005 | 09:55 AM
  #30  
pauvil's Avatar
pauvil
Racer
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 317
Likes: 0
From: PA
Default

I realize this but think I'm going for 496.
Reply
Old Sep 27, 2005 | 01:13 PM
  #31  
Jay M's Avatar
Jay M
Drifting
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,600
Likes: 0
From: Valencia (near LA) CA
Default

When I asked my engine builder if I should move up to a 454 his answer was that cubic inces = torque, and torque is what you feel when you drive. Each cubic inch is about = to 1 lb of torque. And you will feel 27 lbs. of torque when you drive.

He also said that cubic inches are like free power. To get the same power out of a smaller engine you need to build it a bit more radically, higher compression, bigger cam.

As far as a 427 spinning up quicker... well I can hit the redline in first gear pretty fast! sometimes faster then I can shift to second

~Jay
Reply
Old Sep 27, 2005 | 01:34 PM
  #32  
duliz's Avatar
duliz
Intermediate
15 Year Member
 
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
From: McAllen TX
Default

the zz502 has decent power launching your car in the low 12s in the quarter. The engine is very driveable. I've driven it in the heat of the day 105degree F and never overheated. This engine has plenty of vacuum (fairly small cam for its size). Corvettes have fairly good traction so traction is not much of a concern with my auto tranny and 3.08 gears. With high gears allows me to drive at fairly low rpm at highway speeds. A world of difference from my stock 180hp 350.
Reply
Old Sep 28, 2005 | 10:24 AM
  #33  
69396Chevy's Avatar
69396Chevy
Instructor
 
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 153
Likes: 1
From: Monroe MI
Default

where is the 427 at? If your not interested I bight be if its nto to far away?
Reply
Old Sep 28, 2005 | 10:57 AM
  #34  
iree75's Avatar
iree75
Instructor
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 222
Likes: 0
From: Leander TX
Default

This is exactly what I am doing.. I bought a 427 for what I thought was a good deal. I ended up putting another 3k + into it after I tore in to it and found that it was an 11.25 to one CR motor and the late 60's square port iron heads which did not have hardened seats or guides (ok with the miles I'm going to put on it they prally' would have been ok). I just want the thing to be fun and run on pump gas. I'm guessing the motor was running on pump gas as I saw evidence of it pinging itself to death on the pistons (melted tops, ring land damage).

I'm happy I decided to tear it down to see what I had. I still came out a bit cheaper going this route, but not the deal I thought I had. But it was fun building it though. -F
Reply
Old Sep 28, 2005 | 11:19 AM
  #35  
langg's Avatar
langg
Thread Starter
Racer
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 456
Likes: 0
From: Forty Fort PA
Default

After some digging, it turns out that the 427 is a truck motor. Vintage is suppsedly late '60s. Did Chevy make a 4-bolt 427 truck motor in the '60s?
Reply
Old Sep 28, 2005 | 02:17 PM
  #36  
norvalwilhelm's Avatar
norvalwilhelm
Race Director
10 Year Member
 
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 11,872
Likes: 12
From: Waterloo ontario Canada
Default

Originally Posted by CGGorman
All things being equal, the short stroke will rev higher before grenading...if the valvetrain can take it.

Depends on how you like to drive. I like high revs. I also like torque, but like Norval said...traction can be a problem with too much torque. My 427 has plenty of torque, so I'm planning to rebuild it to spin all day at 7,000.
It costs more to build revs into a motor then cubic inches. The 427 was meant to rev to 7500 for short bursts. Sure you can build it for higher revs but it costs too much, eats piston rings and wrist pins.
I would rather just build it bigger.
Even the valve springs to run high rpm for extended periods eats lifters.
No rpm is not worth the price. Build cubic inches.
Reply
Old Sep 28, 2005 | 07:17 PM
  #37  
jpatrick636's Avatar
jpatrick636
Drifting
15 Year Member
 
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,253
Likes: 1
From: East China MI
Default

I wish I had a 572. After which, I would wish I had a 640.
Reply




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:16 AM.

story-0
10 Ugly Corvettes That We Still Kinda Love

Slideshow: 10 ugly Corvettes that we still kinda love.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-06-03 10:34:17


VIEW MORE
story-1
Top 10 Most Expensive Corvettes Ever Sold on Bring A Trailer

A lot of money has changed hands at the online auction house over the years.

By Brett Foote | 2026-06-03 10:21:50


VIEW MORE
story-2
10 Things Every Corvette Owner Needs (2026 Edition)

Slideshow: 10 great gifts Corvette enthusiasts actually want for Father's Day!

By Michael S. Palmer | 2026-06-03 15:43:40


VIEW MORE
story-3
8 Most "Only Corvette Owners Understand" Quirks and Problems

Slideshow: These are the quirks, annoyances, and oddly lovable problems that every Corvette owner eventually learns to live with.

By Pouria Savadkouei | 2026-05-28 09:31:39


VIEW MORE
story-4
10 Reasons the C6 Z06 is Still A Performance Benchmark After 20 Years

Slideshow: 10 reasons why the C6 Z06 is still a performance benchmark after 20 years.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-05-27 17:20:09


VIEW MORE
story-5
How Much Horsepower Every Corvette Engine "LOST" in 1972

Slideshow: How much horsepower every Corvette engine lost in 1972.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-05-27 16:54:53


VIEW MORE
story-6
Top 10 DOs and DON'Ts for Protecting Your Convertible Top!

Slideshow: How to Protect A Convertible Top: 10 DOs & DON'Ts

By Michael S. Palmer | 2026-04-03 00:00:00


VIEW MORE
story-7
Top 10 Most Explosive Corvettes Ever Made: Power-to-Weight Ratio Ranked!

Slideshow: The 10 most explosive Corvettes ever built based on power-to-weight ratio.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-05-20 07:23:03


VIEW MORE
story-8
150 hp to 1,250 hp: Every Corvette Generation Compared by the Specs That Matter

Slideshow: From C1 to C8 we compare every Corvette generation by the numbers.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-05-12 16:54:12


VIEW MORE
story-9
8 Coolest Corvette Pace Cars (and Replicas) of All Time

Slideshow: Some Corvette pace cars became collectible legends, while others perfectly captured the look and attitude of their era.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-11 09:50:51


VIEW MORE