Welding Steering joints
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 9,078
Likes: 7
From: DFW TX
Cruise-In VII Veteran
St. Jude Donor '07
Welding Steering joints
The steering joints I bought from Speedway are the weld on versions. 3/4" steering shaft. My question is "Can I weld them without damaging the ujoint bearing?" The Flaming river and Borgs catalog say no. What's you opinion on this. 
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 244
Likes: 0
From: Thomson Illinois
Should be no problem, I dont think you will have to worry about the bearings at all. The root weld would not need to be anything massive, so you should be able to get around it quickly so you wont be getting all that hot. If you think it may be getting a little too warm, stop and cool it with water then continue. I would think the bearings are sealed, if so water will pose no harm to them.
If they are being sold as "weld on", then I am sure the manufacturer has prepaired the part for welding and believes you may consider this as an option.
KC
If they are being sold as "weld on", then I am sure the manufacturer has prepaired the part for welding and believes you may consider this as an option.
KC
Last edited by kdcollins; Mar 13, 2006 at 07:29 AM.
Drifting
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,651
Likes: 13
From: Holly MI
Budman,
I have been looking at the same pieces. I thought the weld in ones didn't have the same type of needle bearing as the "billet" joins Flaming River and Borgeson sell. It looks like it's just a large pin. If that is the case, welding them shouldn't be a problem. If you can TIG it and keep the heat low it really shouldn't be a problem. Please keep us updated because I want to see how yours turns out. I'm in the process of selecting u-joints now for my rack conversion.
Ken
I have been looking at the same pieces. I thought the weld in ones didn't have the same type of needle bearing as the "billet" joins Flaming River and Borgeson sell. It looks like it's just a large pin. If that is the case, welding them shouldn't be a problem. If you can TIG it and keep the heat low it really shouldn't be a problem. Please keep us updated because I want to see how yours turns out. I'm in the process of selecting u-joints now for my rack conversion.
Ken
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Race Director
Joined: Nov 2000
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From: Waterloo ontario Canada
Originally Posted by bb69
Budman,
I have been looking at the same pieces. I thought the weld in ones didn't have the same type of needle bearing as the "billet" joins Flaming River and Borgeson sell. It looks like it's just a large pin. If that is the case, welding them shouldn't be a problem. If you can TIG it and keep the heat low it really shouldn't be a problem. Please keep us updated because I want to see how yours turns out. I'm in the process of selecting u-joints now for my rack conversion.
Ken
I have been looking at the same pieces. I thought the weld in ones didn't have the same type of needle bearing as the "billet" joins Flaming River and Borgeson sell. It looks like it's just a large pin. If that is the case, welding them shouldn't be a problem. If you can TIG it and keep the heat low it really shouldn't be a problem. Please keep us updated because I want to see how yours turns out. I'm in the process of selecting u-joints now for my rack conversion.
Ken
With Tig you heat the area up and then melt in a filler rod. Too slow a process.
Mig it.
Race Director
Joined: Dec 1999
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I would TIG it, with TIG you have much more control over the heat and you can do short sections if you're scared of the heat causing the grease to come out. This is a steering joint, it should be SECURELY welded to the shaft.
Drifting
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,651
Likes: 13
From: Holly MI
Originally Posted by norvalwilhelm
I don;t agree with Tigging. I puts more heat into the joint then mig. With mig it is so fast it melts in really quickly. You can do a little weld, let it cool and repeat until you are happy.
With Tig you heat the area up and then melt in a filler rod. Too slow a process.
Mig it.
With Tig you heat the area up and then melt in a filler rod. Too slow a process.
Mig it.
I'm in the middle of a TIG welding class, and this weekend we did stainless for the first time. Using a 3/32" 2% thoriated tungsten electrode ground to a tip, I could put the heat exactly where I wanted it. I also had great control of how much heat I could put in. The heat zones I have on the coupons are much smaller than what I get when I MIG. I'm not an expert welder by any means, but it sure seems to me I would have muc more control over how much heat went into the joint, and where it went. I think either method would work, but I sure like the pin point accuracy with the TIG.
Ken
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2000
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From: Waterloo ontario Canada
If you take a cold plate and are given 5 seconds to lay down as much weld as possible Mig would win easily.
In 5 seconds I could probably get 5 inches. That is a cold start.
Now try tig. It would take at least 5 seconds just to heat a spot up where you could even possibley start melting a filler rod and laying down a puddle??
Honestly could you lay a couple of inches of tig weld in 5 seconds from a cold start????
As for control with a mig you can really get into tight spots with a .030 wire.
One of the main features of mig is it's ability to lay down alot of material in a short time without putting alot of heat into the parent material.
In 5 seconds I could probably get 5 inches. That is a cold start.
Now try tig. It would take at least 5 seconds just to heat a spot up where you could even possibley start melting a filler rod and laying down a puddle??
Honestly could you lay a couple of inches of tig weld in 5 seconds from a cold start????
As for control with a mig you can really get into tight spots with a .030 wire.
One of the main features of mig is it's ability to lay down alot of material in a short time without putting alot of heat into the parent material.
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 9,078
Likes: 7
From: DFW TX
Cruise-In VII Veteran
St. Jude Donor '07
Originally Posted by Twin_Turbo
I would TIG it, with TIG you have much more control over the heat and you can do short sections if you're scared of the heat causing the grease to come out. This is a steering joint, it should be SECURELY welded to the shaft.
Racer
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 268
Likes: 13
From: Palmdale Ca
I've welded them before with no problem. I've know guys that have welded them and then cut them (just enough to remove the weld) to remove the steering shafts a year later and used the same u-joint on a new racer. Weld them.
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 244
Likes: 0
From: Thomson Illinois
Originally Posted by norvalwilhelm
If you take a cold plate and are given 5 seconds to lay down as much weld as possible Mig would win easily.
In 5 seconds I could probably get 5 inches. That is a cold start.
Now try tig. It would take at least 5 seconds just to heat a spot up where you could even possibley start melting a filler rod and laying down a puddle??
Honestly could you lay a couple of inches of tig weld in 5 seconds from a cold start????
As for control with a mig you can really get into tight spots with a .030 wire.
One of the main features of mig is it's ability to lay down alot of material in a short time without putting alot of heat into the parent material.
In 5 seconds I could probably get 5 inches. That is a cold start.
Now try tig. It would take at least 5 seconds just to heat a spot up where you could even possibley start melting a filler rod and laying down a puddle??
Honestly could you lay a couple of inches of tig weld in 5 seconds from a cold start????
As for control with a mig you can really get into tight spots with a .030 wire.
One of the main features of mig is it's ability to lay down alot of material in a short time without putting alot of heat into the parent material.
Drifting
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,651
Likes: 13
From: Holly MI
Originally Posted by norvalwilhelm
If you take a cold plate and are given 5 seconds to lay down as much weld as possible Mig would win easily.
In 5 seconds I could probably get 5 inches. That is a cold start.
Now try tig. It would take at least 5 seconds just to heat a spot up where you could even possibley start melting a filler rod and laying down a puddle??
Honestly could you lay a couple of inches of tig weld in 5 seconds from a cold start????
As for control with a mig you can really get into tight spots with a .030 wire.
One of the main features of mig is it's ability to lay down alot of material in a short time without putting alot of heat into the parent material.
In 5 seconds I could probably get 5 inches. That is a cold start.
Now try tig. It would take at least 5 seconds just to heat a spot up where you could even possibley start melting a filler rod and laying down a puddle??
Honestly could you lay a couple of inches of tig weld in 5 seconds from a cold start????
As for control with a mig you can really get into tight spots with a .030 wire.
One of the main features of mig is it's ability to lay down alot of material in a short time without putting alot of heat into the parent material.
While I agree you can't weld as fast with TIG, your statements above just reinforce the fact that you aren't putting as much heat into the metal. The only reason it doens't melt as fast, is because you aren't pumping the current into it. Now, if you set the TIG at 150 amps and pushed the pedal all the way down. that poor steel joint would be reduced to a molten pile of metal in 5 seconds. Welding fast still puts a lot of heat into the metal. It requires the same amount of energy to melt the metal no matter what process you are using. However, with the TIG you could create a much smaller bead, thereby introducing a lot LESS heat into the joint.
None of this matters for the joint at hand. I also think a lot of this has to do with personal preference. The few guys I know of that are really good with TIG use it for everything. I spent last weekend talking with a professional car builder, and he uses TIG for everything except tacking sheetmetal just because is such a PITA to setup TIG. I only have a MIG at home, so I would be using it. If I had the TIG available though, I would use that. So long as the joint is strong, I don't think it's going to matter in this case.
Ken
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 9,078
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From: DFW TX
Cruise-In VII Veteran
St. Jude Donor '07
Originally Posted by Yellow73SB
Hey bud man what spline are those? Im think about ordering one for mine isntead or buying the rag joint when I replace my steering box.