i have figured out my combo so far. i will be running a 3.875 forged eagle crank with a set of forged eagle 6" h-beam rods, srp forged pistons with -5cc. bore will be 4.030. the block has been decked to 9.0110. i am going with afr heads with 75cc chambers. the cam i have selected will give me a good dcr with the static comp ratio that this works out to. everything will be port matched from the carb all the way to the headers. i will be running a dual plane intake also. now the questions i have are should i go with 195 runners or the 210 runners for this set up? also what carb should i go with 850cfm? the cam is a crower hyd roller.
adv. dur. 286* 292* / dur @ .050 236* 240* / gross lift .555" 559" any idea what kind of power i will be looking at with this set up?

thanks for all the help i have gotten with setting this thing up so far.

 

..... you 'MIGHT' find some helpful-info here:

http://drr.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/frm/f/80760912

 

http://www.ryanscarpage.50megs.com/combos1.html Check out combo #17 on this site. It has AFR 190 on it. If you go with the new AFR 195 eliminators. It is almost identical with quite a bit better flowing heads and a little more cam lift to compliment your extra 13 cubic inches. With a dual plane I gather your looking for street performance. The new AFR 195 heads flow better than most 210's and will have better throttle response and low end torque for street use because of better port velocity. The 70 LS6 454 is the highest HP rated stock big block ever built by chevy. It used a 780 CFM Holley. 800 CFM should feed a hydraulic roller 396 just fine and be a good match for high performance street use with a dual plane!

 

Basically the setup I'm building. I have the AFR Elim 195 & a 750 annular street Demon. Dynosim predicts 500+/500+

 

No question in my mind what size to use, the AFR 210's, not long ago 396's were big blocks, doubt they used 195cc heads. My motor is 10ci bigger and I have 220cc heads, runs pretty good, if you like the HP and TQ mine makes I would be considering similar size heads.



*Just a note, the new 100% CNC ported AFR 195's would work too as noted above ( see I don't always disagree with you ) because they flow more than the 210's problem is the cost about 2 grand. I would not use the normal 195's

Specs are in my sig to get HP and TQ curve similar to this see my sig. This motor is a pleasure to drive on the street and when you nail the gas, hang on tight

Just a note 2, most of those combinations on Ryan Car Page make sense and seem like the engine specs match the HP and TQ except Combo 17, show me a 383ci with 190cc AFR street heads, 9.5:1 CR and hydraulic roller with less than .550" lift that makes 503HP @ 5500 RPM and 517TQ and I'll believe it untill then I will look where the info came from, the AFR website

 

Motorhead, yes & no. I looked over AFRs numbers & the 195 comps are outflowing even the old 220s. My DynoSym only calculated a 14hp/7'lbs increase by using the 195 eliminators with competition package, on my configuration. I'm not sure the extra $ justify the few extra horses. BTW the 'normal' 195s are 100% CNC'd also, just with not as fine a step as the comps, plus the comps are using 2.08 intakes vs 2.055 in the standard heads. I'm sure when the new 210 elminators come out they'll flow enough to cause localized pressure drops, but in a street engine I don't need flow over .550 lift anyway. I do like your numbers though, you have an exceptionally flat torque line.

 

I take everything I see in print with a grain of salt, if he can get AFR 195's for less than $1500 that outflow the old 210's then by all means he could use those heads.

I believe the AFR 195 heads that flow the big numbers are $2000 or so and you could always get big flow numbers from a set of $2000 heads.

 

at least it looks like i am on the right track so far. i am looking at the annular carb also. the afr 195's flow 280 cfm at .550 lift and the 210's flow 289 cfm at .550 lift.

 

Ok Check this out: Tests NOT DONE BY AFR!! http://www.adperformance.com/index.p...roducts_id=208 Check out the flow numbers, Engine build specs,Torque curve and peak HP. These are AFR 195 Street heads for under $1500 that outflow the old 210's. This power comes from using well matched components!!!THAT IS MY POINT!!!You will get more torque a little earlier and a flatter torque curve with your motor due to the bigger CI and solid roller but we are comparing apples and oranges, He is building a street motor with dual plane, hydraulic roller under 600 lift.

 

i did a little more checking and the flow numbers from the afr 195's are out flowing most of the the 210's and even some 220's from other companies at .550 lift. (dart and brodix). with that being the case and the fact i can get the afr's at under $1500. the smaller port will be more street friendly even if i do leave a small amount of top end hp on the table i think this might be the best choice. the 210's i looked at flowed 276 and 278 cfm compaired to the afr's 280.

 

Check out the difference on the exhaust side! it is even bigger!! Don't think you will leave anything on the table with these and a hydraulic roller!

 

Just a note on using the forged H beam rods, when I did my 396 the H beams "shoulder" was very wide and my machinist could not get a comfortable clearance on the bottom of the cylinder, it would have meant grinding very close to the water jacket or grinding quite a bit from the ARP rod bolts and was worried about reaching te correct torque setting, so we switched to a SCAT forged I beam with cap screw heads and had no problems.
Also had to use a small base circle cam.

Nick

 

good info to know thanks.

 

I am checking around and even looked at Jegs website, the heads on their site that flow in the 280cfm range are $2000. Like I said for 2 grand this is no big deal even if the flow 300cfm. If you can get a set of 100% CNC'ed intake port that flows 280cfm or better for ~$1500 then that is fine. If you have to pay $2000 then you might as well get the old 210's for much less or heads like mine for lesss than $1500.

The info is very sketchy and probably designed that way. I see a 100% CNC'ed intake port 195cc head with 2.05" intake valve that flows 280 cfm and a 100% CNC'ed intake port 195cc head with 2.08" intake valve that flows 300 cfm on the AFR website. How much are these heads ?

AFR site is no help at all as they don't give prices. I would make sure first that the heads you are getting do indeed flow these numbers and like I said if they are under $1500 then they are a reasonable deal. But I can guarantee the heads that outflow the old 210's are 2 grand

 

the set i have access to at less than $1500 flows 280 cfm at .550. i can get a set for close to $2000 that flows 300 cfm.

i know i am opening a can of worms but any good reccomendations on a carb? size, type, and brand? i would like one that will be easy to set up, give good throttle response, and perform well with this set up.

 

Info looks pretty clear to me. The flow ratings shown are the Street head with the 205 intake valve. The intake port for this head, which flows 280 CFM on the intake side and 211 CFM on the exhaust side @ .550 lift is 70% CNC'ed AFR SBC 195 Street Heads ***New Eliminator Series***
$1,439.00

AFR Eliminator Series SBC 195's!

AFR's All new port design, all new chamber design, new casting design and updated valvetrain! The new AFR 195 race ready head outflows the previous comeptition version head (Roughly 285 cfm out of the box!) Casting improvements include improved oil drainback, heavier duty castings and better material control. Revised valve, 8mm LS1 technology, and matching springs, retainers and locks are all standard on the new AFR Eliminator line. These lightweight components will allow a more reactive, higher rpm and more reliability. When comparing the new and old AFR style valve train the valves alone yield a 23g weight savings. This weight difference will allow higher rpm potential and will allow the springs greater control before valve float. The new 1.260" spring package allows a 40 gram weight reduction vs. the older 1.550" spring option, yet allows for the same spring pressure. When comparing the new and old valvetrain a single cylinder utilizes a 126g reduction in weight where it matters most - on the valve side of the assembly. Consider this icing on the cake with improved flow characteristics, and an improved casting on the already industry leading AFR cylinder heads.

We're AFR's largest West Coast stocking dealer! If you need AFR's FAST contact us for the fastest Eliminator delivery available!

We stock the following 195 part numbers:

1034

1036

1038

1040

If you're looking for any of them contact us for the fastest AFR Eliminator delivery available!


AFR 195 SBC ELIMINATOR STREET
FLOW NUMBERS



AFR INTAKE AFR EXHAUST


.200 137 CFM 110 CFM


.300 194 CFM 158 CFM


.400 240 CFM 190 CFM


.500 270 CFM 207 CFM


.550 280 CFM 211 CFM


.600 286 CFM 215 CFM



New dyno results with AFR's SBC Eliminators::



Test Description:WELL OVER 500 HP!

This test compares AFR's original 195 street heads to AFR's new "Eliminator" 195 street heads (new port and chamber design, 8 mm lightweight valves and lightweight 1.260 springs and retainers). This test was conducted at American Speed (3006 23rd Ave. Moline, IL 61265) on a DEPAC Engine Dyno

Engine Specs:



383 CID
9.6 : 1 CR
Edelbrock RPM Air Gap Intake
Comp 236/242 Hydrolic Roller Cam
Holley 750 Carb
1.75 Long Tube Headers
MSD Ignition
38° advance with original AFR 195's
37° advance with Eliminator AFR 195's
Penzoil 15w-40
93 octane Amoco pump fuel

AFR 195cc Street Heads, Straight Plug w/heat riser, 75cc 1036*

AFR 195cc Street Heads, Straight Plug w/heat riser, 65cc 1034*

AFR 195cc Street Heads, L98 Angle Plug w/heat riser, 75cc 1038*

AFR 195cc Street Heads, L98 Angle Plug w/heat riser, 65cc 1040*


AFR 195cc SBC Street Cylinder Head


The Ultimate Bolt-on Emissions Legal Street Weapon




Note:

Hydraulic roller cams typically experience valve float at 5800-6000 rpm because of their fast ramp rates. AFR suggest you upgrade your springs to AFR part #8032, 1.530 O.D. with higher spring pressures and use our Patented “Hydra Rev Kit” to reduce chances of valve float associated with rpm 6000 or higher.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Basic Package Components

100% CNC Ported Combustion Chambers

100% CNC Ported Exhaust Ports

70% to 100% CNC Ported Intake Ports

3-angle Valve Job

AFR 8mm Ls1 Style Intake Valve, 2.050" standard length

AFR 8mm Ls1 Style Exhaust Valve, 1.600" standard length

AFR Ls1 Style 1.290" OD Hydraulic Dual Valve Spring, 135 lbs. on seat, .600" maximum lift, AFR #8017

10º 4140 Chrome Moly Retainers, AFR #8510

10º Valve Locks, AFR #9005

3/8" Rocker Studs, AFR #6410

Guide Plates, AFR #6105

Valve Seals, AFR #6611

Hardened Shims, AFR #8043

Intake Valve Seats, AFR #9060

Exhaust Valve Seats, AFR #9070

Bronze Valve Guides, AFR #9050

Special orders available upon request.

All Accessory Holes are Predrilled & Tapped!


Specifications, Features, and Supporting Components

Head Torque 65-70 Ft. Lbs.

Rocker Stud Torque 55-60 Ft. Lbs.

Intake Port Gasket, 1.280”x2.090” w/ 3/8" radius, AFR #6810

Important: Do not port match your intake manifold to this Fel-Pro gasket, as they do not exactly fit AFR heads.

Exhaust Port Gasket Fel Pro #1404, AFR #6834

Head Gasket 350cid Fel Pro #1003, AFR #6800

400cid Fel Pro #1014, AFR #6802

Head Bolts & Studs Standard ARP, AFR #6310 & #6305

Head Bolt Washers Manley, AFR #6320

Stud Girdle AFR #6201

Suggested Manifold Edelbrock RPM Performer, AFR #5030

Spark Plug Starting Range AC FR3LS

Combustion Chambers 75cc or 65cc

Spring Pocket can be cut to 1.625, no deeper.

Valve Spacing Standard

Rocker Arms Standard

Valve Angle 23º

 

AFR and their vendors outa setup a meeting to get the flow numbers right

Straight from the AFR website, BTW 5 CFM is not as little as it seems you pay money for 5 cfm, they gotta their BS straight

 

Cant we all just get along

All I know is that my 396, 215 cc aluminum heads, .570 lift solid roller with a BG six shooter and it goes like "sh*t off of a hot shovel" as we say back home!!!!

 

OK lets compare Victor Jr, 215 CC to AFR 195 CC street heads These are Edlebrocks numbers!!. 77569, #77579, #77589, #77599 .100 lift 67/64 .200 lift 119/112 .300 lift 177/153 .400 lift 226/188 .500 lift 265/207 These are the flow numbers for the victor Jr. 215 CC heads from .100 lift to .500 lift

 

You compare, now your just being silly, what does that have to do with anything here ?