Hi,

I am new to the Corvette scene and have only looked at C2's, so I'm even greener when it comes to C3's. A friend of mine has one and swears by it. I'm looking to get one, but am not sure which is best. I've heard people who say that the 427 is the best engine ever put in a 'Vette and I've heard others who claim the 454 is. I don't know much, but I do want to get a pre 1973 C3 to avoid all of the power robbing emissions equipment.
I want to cap off my spending at around the mid $30k range (is this realistic)? I'm obviously not putting the L-88's, L-89's, and LS6's in contention because of their huge sticker prices.
I've seen a 427/435 around town in the low $40's, although I'm not sure of it's condition. I have not seen any 454's, but the highest HP output for any 454 (aside from the LS6) has been 390HP. Is this accurate? Which engine has the better performance, and which has the most that can be squeezed out of it. Would getting the most out of a 454 (bigger engine) be a really expensive alternative?

Thanks!

I have a '98 Torch Red Targa, but older cars are my real passion! :cheers:

 

Clarification...The only 427 I would be interested in would be the L71, since the L89 is out of the question. The 454/390 was only available in 1970...I think. Also, did any come with side exhausts?

 

427 to 454's are similiar but different animals. As a general statement teh 427 is a better spinner while the 454 is a torque animal. Either engine can be built to whatever extreme you would like. If I had to pick which engine I would trust at 6k all day long I'd take the 427, If I wanted to play smoke the tires around town then I'd pick the 454. If I had the budget your working with I'd be looking at the mild 69, 427 cars, L-68 for example. If you want to buy a lot of potential without spending a ton of bucks you may want to look at the 73-74 big blocks, they don't have the huge amounts of power the 68-71 BB's had but they can be coaxed just like any other BB chevy.

:cheers:
Pat Kunz

 

I have a 427 and a 454. I am running the 454 in my 69 for one reason, there is no substitute for cubic inches. When I can affors one I will build a 540 or bigger, until then I will continue to make use of the N.O.S Fogger system. Come ot think of it, I will probably run the squeeze on the future big motor also.

 

I would say that the 350 is the best motor...But that is just my opinion :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

The '71 LS-5 454 was the first year with hardened valve seats to run on unleaded fuel. They also had 465 ft/lbs of torque in stock trim. Torque is what wins street races. :)

According to text I have read it was also Zora Duntov's favorite because it was almost as fast as the LS-6 but was a lot more comfortable to live with. I have owned one for 11 years and it's a keeper for sure.

 

I don't think you can go wrong with either big block. For $30K you can buy a nice C3 Vette in any year. The 427 ('68 & '69) Vettes appear to be bringing the higher $ values. Probably due to their association with the Midyear big blocks!!

I love my '72 LS5! I think I got more Corvette (less issues) for the amount of money that I was willing to spend, than I could have with a comparable 427 car!

Don't discount the '73 and '74 454 Vettes. There isn't much difference in the motors between these Vettes and the '71 and '72 ones. Emissions issues didn't really hit until '75. You could get an awesome '73 or '74 for $30K!!

My advice (actually advice given to me on this forum when I was looking!) is buy the best Corvette you can for the money that you are willing to spend!!

Keep us posted!!


[Modified by QikStik, 8:47 AM 10/24/2001]

 

For me, the bigger question would be , "Do I want shiny bumpers or not?" Any of the big blocks are great cars and has been said earlier, can easily be warmed up to your desired level of performance. The condition of the car would be more important than 427 vs 454. I remember driving a '68 390 horse 427 that was a dog compared to the '69 350/350 I eventually bought.

For what it is worth, I love the performance of my 427. Below 100mph, tires are the only limit to its performance.

Chuck

 

From what it's worth deptartment, The 427 and larger motors all spin up to 7K and live at 6K.

I reved the 427 at 7k all day long, as I do the 533 motor now. The trick with building a long stroke high reving monster with mega torque is high quality rods, crank and valve trane.

 

Well,
You can not go wrong with either engine. I have both now. I think the 427 is worth a little more for a collectors value.

My personal choice is the 427.

 

Thanks for the responses guys!

Someone brought up a good point about the LS-5 being the first to accept unleaded fuel.

I live in Northern CA, and the highest octane (unless you really look for racing fuel or aviation fuel) in almost all pump stations is 91. With the big blocks having a compression ration of 10:1 (or is it 11.1?), will pump gas suffice? Will it run fine with it or will they ping in hotter weather or while stuck in traffic?

 

Pre-71 cars were the higher compressions big blocks. In '71, the compression on an LS5 was 8.5:1. I've never run mine on anything else than 94 octane but I'm sure that you won't have any problems on 91 octane fuel.

Personally, I would stick to '71 or later for this reason. It is so much less hassle instead of dealing with lead additives and/or octane boost for the cars that were not designed to run on pump gas. I read a lot about big blocks and most people are saying that the LS4's are darn good engines that put in decent performance and represent the best value in corvettes right now. But if you are high on a bumper car, '71-'72 is the one I would go with.

$30K will get you a nice one no matter.

 

Hardened valve seats are a non-issue. I build engines and machine cylinder heads & valves. I have never seen valve seats damaged by unleaded fuel. Most valve seat damage occurs due to carbon build up on the back of the valve.... mostly from burning oil (primarily valve seals). The stuff encroaches on the valve seat contact area and breaks off in chunks. The chunks get slammed between the valve face and the valve seat, eventually causing pitting and a "burnt" valve face & seat. I've seen no evidence of unleaded fuel damage to non-hardened cast valve seats. In fact, I just finished up 4 late model heads that do not have hardened valve seats... and none of them were damaged by unleaded fuel.

RE: 427 vs 454 vs 350.... I choose a 540.

I have a 327 and a 454. Too much work to get good 0-60 times from the 327. The 454 just yawns and stomps the 327.
Torque is the 0-60 de-Terminator. 427 vs 454...? They both look the same. Cubic inches buys you torque. So it depends on what you want to do with the beast. You can easily take a 73 or 74 BB and bring it up to 1970 numbers.

 

My intention is to buy something with some investment value. Not the best investment, but something that will hold it's own. Depending on the money that's required, I'm really planning on just driving the car as a daily driver and then swapping out the engine to keep the originality of it.

That brings about a whole new set of questions...What engine is the easiest to get HP and Trq out of, which is the easiest to live with etc. But I'm not looking into that quite yet, since I don't have the budget.

For now I'm just debating on which stock engine configuration to get. What are the HP and Torque figures anyway? I only know HP. L71 has 435 and LS5 has 390. Also, are these numbers accurate or were they downplayed? And if they were reduced for liability reasons, what are the true figures?

 

Can't help you with the "investment" aspect... I never look at cars as an investment. Strictly from an enjoyment view. Get a copy of the Corvette "Black Book" to help you with options. The 435 & 400 427's were "TriPower" cars.... 3 two barrel carb setups (six barrels total)... you will pay dearly for an original TriPOwer car. Better forget those. The 390 HP cars were single 4 barrel cars.

When we convert to the hydrogen engine from fossil fuel engines, the investment scheme will take a dump.

 

Also, remember that in 1972 they started measuring HP in "net" rather than "gross" numbers, so the 1972 and later HP's may not be as bad a comparison as you might think. Personally, I'd look for a 1973 and build the engine up. I like the chrome rear bumper with the rubber nose. And don't rule out the small blocks. You can buy yourself a nice small block car for far less than $30,000. Then, have an awesome small block engine built and drop it in. You can make over 500 HP with a small block, and the car will handle better without all the weight of the big block up front. My 383 in my Z28 makes peak HP of 420HP at 6,000 rpm's and 425 lb/ft of torque at 4,500. Very "big block" numbers without the weight (along with being a small block, it has aluminum heads). I saw a World Products Motwon 415 CI small block engine in a recent Chevy High Performance that made over 500 HP. Personally, I'd save my money on the car by buying a REAL nice small block car, and then drop a REAL nice small block engine into it, and I'd pocket the rest.

 

4-2-7!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Wow if I had mid 30Ks to spend, I would go for a 63-67 Vette. Buy a 63-67 without matching numbers and put a 502 in it.

 

Well, mid 30k is prior to taxes and miscellaneous costs. In CA, taxes are 8%! Then I'm going to have to spend a couple of hundred to have someone put the car on a lift and check it thoroughly. Then I might have to drop some money for cosmetic changes etc. So at the end of the day, it looks like my "sticker price" budget is closer to 29k.

Sp far I have not been able to find many things for 29k. Maybe I'm not looking in the right place? The dealer I am going to is selling the car for a client (consignment), and the asking price for the tripower 427 convertible(numbers matching is the claim, but I haven't checked) with little to nothing else as far as options was originally for sale for 42k! I know this is ridiculous and inflated, but I unfortunately live in the SF/Bay Area, where the tech boom inflated everything. It was reduced to 37.9k because it was not selling. The dealer told me that the owner would sell it for 35k. That's still 5-6k too much. The car has other problems (which I'm trying to get an answer for in other posts).

Where are you guys finding these awesome cars for the low prices you're mentioning? :confused: Since I started my search a couple of weeks ago, I have just gotten the feeling that I won't be able to get anything with my budget.

 

Stay away from the dealer. Have you looked in the for sale adds here. My friend sold his 427 69 roadster with side pipes last year for 26,000 . The car was numbers matching and in really good shape. It isn't easy to get over 30K for a C3.