Roller cam ordered for 427 sbc/DD Dyno??
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,139
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From: Salina Kansas
Roller cam ordered for 427 sbc/DD Dyno??
Hey all,
Just ordered the solid roller cam for my 427 sbc motor that should be done in a couple of weeks. Below are the motor specs and cam specs. Keep in mind I had to get a cam that made 10" vacuum at 1,000 rpm due to the efi requirements.
Could anyone run this setup on a desktop dyno for me? I would really appreciate it if you have the time.
427 sbc (Dart Little M) 4" stroke, 6" rods (Scat 4340)
AFR Eliminator 210 heads
10.5-11.1 CR
1 7/8 Hooker headers with 4" sidepipes (spiral baffles)
5 speed TKO, 3.27 1st. 3.08 rear gears.Centerforce dual friction clutch. steel flywheel, not sure on weight, 32 lbs?
EFI: Edelbrock proflo semisequential efi. Based on a Victor Jr. intake, Has a 1,000 cfm TB and upgraded to 48 lb Venom injectors. Going to get a new chip burned for it as well.
Comp cams Solid Roller Cam: 630/630 lift, 111 degree LS and 252/258 dur. at .050 (with 1.6 ratio rockers factored in).
Any power estimates would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Dave
Just ordered the solid roller cam for my 427 sbc motor that should be done in a couple of weeks. Below are the motor specs and cam specs. Keep in mind I had to get a cam that made 10" vacuum at 1,000 rpm due to the efi requirements.
Could anyone run this setup on a desktop dyno for me? I would really appreciate it if you have the time.
427 sbc (Dart Little M) 4" stroke, 6" rods (Scat 4340)
AFR Eliminator 210 heads
10.5-11.1 CR
1 7/8 Hooker headers with 4" sidepipes (spiral baffles)
5 speed TKO, 3.27 1st. 3.08 rear gears.Centerforce dual friction clutch. steel flywheel, not sure on weight, 32 lbs?
EFI: Edelbrock proflo semisequential efi. Based on a Victor Jr. intake, Has a 1,000 cfm TB and upgraded to 48 lb Venom injectors. Going to get a new chip burned for it as well.
Comp cams Solid Roller Cam: 630/630 lift, 111 degree LS and 252/258 dur. at .050 (with 1.6 ratio rockers factored in).
Any power estimates would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Dave
Last edited by CorvetteDave01; May 25, 2007 at 09:08 PM.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,139
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From: Salina Kansas
Both Comp Cams and Edelbrocks EFI tech ppl indicated this cam would pull 10" @ 1,000 rpm, so I'm not too worried about the vacuum requirement (hope I'm right). I am concerned/interested in hp generation though.
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 21,953
Likes: 1,445
From: Reno Nevada
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
Damn! That is a big one. I looked in the cam catalog and they said for drag racing or mud bogs with 106 LC. Did you just request the 111 LC?
I thought that my endurance road racing profile of 248/250 4 &7 cylinder swap was a hot rod in my 434 ci. I would actually not recommend anything bigger for any vehicle run on the street even with our 5 speed trannies.
I'm getting a bouncy 11 ish inches of vacuum @900-1000 rpm
I thought that my endurance road racing profile of 248/250 4 &7 cylinder swap was a hot rod in my 434 ci. I would actually not recommend anything bigger for any vehicle run on the street even with our 5 speed trannies.
I'm getting a bouncy 11 ish inches of vacuum @900-1000 rpm
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,139
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From: Salina Kansas
Yeah the 111 LS was as low as I could go with this combo or I would have gone lower. Basically the grind was optimized for my motor, the EFI requirements and 6,000 rpm peak hp. Might not get 600 hp, but it is the most cam I can get with the EFI setup I am running. I'll be happy with 550 hp and it should still make good low end tq with the heads I have.
Still curious about what the DD numbers are though.
Still curious about what the DD numbers are though.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,139
Likes: 0
From: Salina Kansas
This is a drag race car, minimal street driving, but I did get the solid roller lifters with the oil groove so that I don't oil starve them when I do put around town some. I probably only put 500 miles on the car all last year and that included 1 drive to the track that was about 220 miles.
I plan to bracket race it 1-2 weekends/month.
The 111 LS and sequential EFI should smooth it out over a 106 LS and a carb though.
I plan to bracket race it 1-2 weekends/month.
The 111 LS and sequential EFI should smooth it out over a 106 LS and a carb though.
Last edited by CorvetteDave01; May 25, 2007 at 12:07 PM.
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 21,953
Likes: 1,445
From: Reno Nevada
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
I would like to know how some kids in "Tech" from Edl or comp cams could figure out your idle vacuum level when he has never worked on a big ci V-8?
I got the AFR flow numbers and plugged in a 252-258 with 111 LSA The problem just like my 434 is that you are in the stalled out no mans land where additional cam duration only makes minor HP gains.
There is only two fixes. Raise the compression is the only real way to make hotter cams work. That is why I went to 11.8 compression. The second fix is massive head cfm flow that can use the higher rpm flow potential. As for me I set my limiter so far at 7000 rpm to make my motor last at least a couple of years.
252-258 is going to sound like a race car, but driveability and gas mileage is really going to suck. Mine is bad enough even with less cam. In two 1/2 hour run sessions and driving to and from the track emptied my 25 gallon tank in 226 miles
I got the AFR flow numbers and plugged in a 252-258 with 111 LSA The problem just like my 434 is that you are in the stalled out no mans land where additional cam duration only makes minor HP gains.
There is only two fixes. Raise the compression is the only real way to make hotter cams work. That is why I went to 11.8 compression. The second fix is massive head cfm flow that can use the higher rpm flow potential. As for me I set my limiter so far at 7000 rpm to make my motor last at least a couple of years.
252-258 is going to sound like a race car, but driveability and gas mileage is really going to suck. Mine is bad enough even with less cam. In two 1/2 hour run sessions and driving to and from the track emptied my 25 gallon tank in 226 miles
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,139
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From: Salina Kansas
You may be right George and it this point, if you are, I may have to find out the hard way. However, Comp cams, Edelbrock's EFI tech and the engine builder all agreed that this should be fine with the 427 sbc. I'll let you know if I can't get it started in a few weeks, LOL.
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Team Owner
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 21,953
Likes: 1,445
From: Reno Nevada
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
Yeah the 111 LS was as low as I could go with this combo or I would have gone lower. Basically the grind was optimized for my motor, the EFI requirements and 6,000 rpm peak hp. Might not get 600 hp, but it is the most cam I can get with the EFI setup I am running. I'll be happy with 550 hp and it should still make good low end tq with the heads I have.
Still curious about what the DD numbers are though.
Still curious about what the DD numbers are though.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,139
Likes: 0
From: Salina Kansas
OK thanks man. Hey, maybe I'll get closer to that 600 hp mark than I thought! I wish I had the money to get it dynoed/dyno tuned, but I am tapped out at this point. Might be able to chassis dyno it down the road at least.
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 21,953
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From: Reno Nevada
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
Is it to late to call them back and get the 4 &7 cylinder swap on the cam?
I don't buy cams listed in the catalog. I go to lobe section and pick out the lobes I would like then ask for it to be ground on a small base circle billet steel with the lobe center angle of my choice. I had two 383 cams ground on 112 to make them more streetable
I have been very impressed with the TQ of big small blocks. I can not floor my Vette even in second gear unless it is going in a straight line. I have really been working on my shifting. but so far I still think that I would have a hard time running consistantly fast times on a drag strip
I don't buy cams listed in the catalog. I go to lobe section and pick out the lobes I would like then ask for it to be ground on a small base circle billet steel with the lobe center angle of my choice. I had two 383 cams ground on 112 to make them more streetable
I have been very impressed with the TQ of big small blocks. I can not floor my Vette even in second gear unless it is going in a straight line. I have really been working on my shifting. but so far I still think that I would have a hard time running consistantly fast times on a drag strip
Last edited by gkull; May 25, 2007 at 01:55 PM.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2005
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From: Salina Kansas
Would a 4/7 swap work on my EFI setup? I'm thinking that even switching plug wires for the hall effect distributor wouldn't be enough? Anyone know?
This wasn't a standard part number cam, it was a custom grind that the engine builder worked out with comp cams for this efi motor. I then confirmed the specs with the EFI tech folks as well to double check.
This wasn't a standard part number cam, it was a custom grind that the engine builder worked out with comp cams for this efi motor. I then confirmed the specs with the EFI tech folks as well to double check.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2005
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From: Salina Kansas
Hey George,
What do you have setup on your motor for a cooling system? I was going to go with the stock radiator and bought an aluminum Weind Team G water pump. Think that will be good enough without having to buy an aluminum radiator?
What do you have setup on your motor for a cooling system? I was going to go with the stock radiator and bought an aluminum Weind Team G water pump. Think that will be good enough without having to buy an aluminum radiator?
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 1999
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From: Reno Nevada
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
Then I came upon the problem reading an article. The Team G is a race pump made to run from 4000 - 9000 rpm in circle track cars. To get higher rpm massive flow without cavitation the impellers are designed for high RPMSo I had a machinist make a smaller aluminum pulley to Over drive the water pump. Now I can't hardly get heat in the motor using a 1/2 hole washer in place of a thermistat.
You just need a radiator in good condition. You can not run a thermistat with racing pumps - they colapse the motor upper output water hose. I did a post on it.
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 21,953
Likes: 1,445
From: Reno Nevada
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
From an old post
The Team G's are made for high rpm race cars. I came across a rpm VS gallon per minute chart on my Team G at sub 4000 rpm it did not even put out 5 GPM and then it kicks in and increased to 38 GPM clear out to 9000 rpm.
Custom machined pulley and pump face. I don't have milling machines and lathes so I had friends make the pulley out of chunk of aluminum. The aluminum pully is 2/3rds of the stock diameter so it is over driven 33% compared to stock pulley sizes.
The cost of these mods is high. It is probably cheaper to just get an aluminum higher volume pump. Or you might try the restrictor washers like I have instead of a thermostat. I don't even have to turn on my fans now where before I usually had them both running.
The width of the aluminum pulley did not clear the pump housing - So more milling time
The Team G's are made for high rpm race cars. I came across a rpm VS gallon per minute chart on my Team G at sub 4000 rpm it did not even put out 5 GPM and then it kicks in and increased to 38 GPM clear out to 9000 rpm.
Custom machined pulley and pump face. I don't have milling machines and lathes so I had friends make the pulley out of chunk of aluminum. The aluminum pully is 2/3rds of the stock diameter so it is over driven 33% compared to stock pulley sizes.
The cost of these mods is high. It is probably cheaper to just get an aluminum higher volume pump. Or you might try the restrictor washers like I have instead of a thermostat. I don't even have to turn on my fans now where before I usually had them both running.
The width of the aluminum pulley did not clear the pump housing - So more milling time
Race Director
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From: Who says "Nothing is impossible" ? I've been doing nothing for years.
If those heads flow more than 300cfm then you will be in sight of 600HP, I plan on making at least 600HP with my new 427ci with similar parts. I too am skeptical that cam will give you 10 in. at idle but I would put it in and try, you will probably be very close. You need at least 11:1 and even if you went higher it would still run on 93 octane 
Last edited by MotorHead; May 25, 2007 at 04:52 PM.
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 1999
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From: Reno Nevada
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
If those heads flow more than 300cfm then you will be in sight of 600HP, I plan on making at least 600HP with my new 427ci with similar parts. I too am skeptical that cam will give you 10 in. at idle but I would put it in and try, you will probably be very close. You need at least 11:1 and even if you went higher it would still run on 93 octane
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,139
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From: Salina Kansas
Well, I'm worried about the water pump now, I may have to look for an underdrive pulley as well OR get a different pump. Figured this one would cool well at all RPMs since it flowed more.
Think this cam is 4 degree advance built in, but the engine builder is going to index it.
Think this cam is 4 degree advance built in, but the engine builder is going to index it.