how should i upgrade 2004r for performance
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 832
Likes: 0
From: Sarasota Florida
how should i upgrade 2004r for performance
i have a 700-r4 that i want to use as a core for a brand new 200-4r. i can go to autozone and get a 200-4r for like $500-$600, but i don't think it can handle the power. i could get the 200-4r that was build for a mid-80s monte carlo ss, which has a high performance 305, which is the closest match to a vette. i know i wouldn't need to upgrade it for the 350 i have now, but i'm thinking it's worth going this route because i can do the upgrades myself. but what is exactly replaced to make these transmissions handle lots of horsepower?
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,192
Likes: 27
From: Boca Raton Florida
I just did all that. I got a Master Rebuild kit off ebay that included all the soft seals and o-rings inside, Red Alto clutches, New Steels.
The Transgo Shift Reprogram kit has the mods necessary to upgrade the shifting. I also put in the wide Kevlar 2nd gear band, I hear that that was a good idea that just didn't work as good as it was supposed to. Recomendations seem to be the wide regulat band, jury still out for me. I bought the bearing kit also off ebay, replaced all the plastic bearings. Finally I got the Super Servo, Superior I believe. The combination of the servo and wide band is supposed to give VERY positive 1/2 shift.
If your going to do this, get a core from a local tranny shop and rebuild that, no reason to pay $600 for something your going to completely gut and replace all the internals anyway. You should be able to get a deal under $100. I have about $700 in my tranny.
The Transgo Shift Reprogram kit has the mods necessary to upgrade the shifting. I also put in the wide Kevlar 2nd gear band, I hear that that was a good idea that just didn't work as good as it was supposed to. Recomendations seem to be the wide regulat band, jury still out for me. I bought the bearing kit also off ebay, replaced all the plastic bearings. Finally I got the Super Servo, Superior I believe. The combination of the servo and wide band is supposed to give VERY positive 1/2 shift.
If your going to do this, get a core from a local tranny shop and rebuild that, no reason to pay $600 for something your going to completely gut and replace all the internals anyway. You should be able to get a deal under $100. I have about $700 in my tranny.
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,881
Likes: 9
From: staten island ny
As far as which is the closest match to your vette I think it depends on your rear end gearing. The 700 has an extremely low 1st gear so if you have 3.70 or better in the rear 1st gear is almost useless in the 700. The 700 is more suited for 3.23 or even in the 2.80 category. '82 vettes that have the 700 use a rear end in the 2.87 area i think. Hope this helps.
ESU
ESU
Racer
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 363
Likes: 0
From: Winston-Salem NC
Do some research over at http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/transmission-talk/
The Buick Grand National guys have been beefing these things up for years to withstand lots of torque, and some of those guys really know these trannys inside and out.
The Buick Grand National guys have been beefing these things up for years to withstand lots of torque, and some of those guys really know these trannys inside and out.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 832
Likes: 0
From: Sarasota Florida
As far as which is the closest match to your vette I think it depends on your rear end gearing. The 700 has an extremely low 1st gear so if you have 3.70 or better in the rear 1st gear is almost useless in the 700. The 700 is more suited for 3.23 or even in the 2.80 category. '82 vettes that have the 700 use a rear end in the 2.87 area i think. Hope this helps.
ESU
ESU
i plan to put like a 4.11 in the rear of my car, so i think the 200-4r will be best for me.
i will call some local shops and find a used 200-4r and go from there.
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,881
Likes: 9
From: staten island ny
ESU
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 832
Likes: 0
From: Sarasota Florida
I'm no expert but a 4.11 rear with a 700 would mean about 6 mph in 1st in about 15 ft and you'd have to shift lol. Come to think of it 4.11 might be too high for the 2004 also. You may have to ask around on that rear ratio. Maybe give bowtie overdrives a call and see what they say. Make believe you are buying the tranny from them.
ESU
ESU
i think i have a 3.55, but i may have a 3.23. if i were to just go to a 3.73, would i tell a big difference from a 3.55?
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,881
Likes: 9
From: staten island ny
ESU
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Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 65,492
Likes: 230
From: Orange Park Florida
NO a minor change in gearsets will make no practical differance in overall operation.....you need a ratio change of at least 10% on a heavy vechicle to notice anything, in a 3300 lbs vette with a 350 engine, you will notice only the extra fuel consumption....
IMO, with an automatic you want a 321 ratio, for a street car....
for a special purpose car....YMMV....
IMO, with an automatic you want a 321 ratio, for a street car....
for a special purpose car....YMMV....
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 832
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From: Sarasota Florida
First thing I would do is find out what rear you do have. Other guys with 76s might chime in. There are codes under the differential like OH, OE or something similiar that denote what the gears are. Jack up the rear 1st and start with seeing what you have, then you can progress to the next step of picking a tranny. I dont think the codes can be seen w/o jacking it up, they are stamped in the metal. Again others with more experience hopefully will chime in with the codes.
ESU
ESU
couldn't there be another ring and pinion inside it too? i don't know if it's stock or not. but i would guess it probably would be.
i know that both the 200-4r and the 700r4 have lower 1st gears than the th350 that i have right now.
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 65,492
Likes: 230
From: Orange Park Florida
the 200 4r has a 2.5x first gear, and then a drop to similar 1.6-8 something second....
which with a torque converter is much more acceptable....
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 832
Likes: 0
From: Sarasota Florida
yeah i know the 200-4r is a much better tranny as far as how the gears are evenly spread out.
if i go to a transmission shop is there a certain 200-4r i need to look for (like a certain year or model number)?
if i go to a transmission shop is there a certain 200-4r i need to look for (like a certain year or model number)?
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,404
Likes: 1
From: Ansonia/NYC CT
And I would offer some advice as to which rear you should go with, but I don't know what you plan on doing. As for the 4.11.......Unless you only want to be doing 90mph top spead, and revving your engine pretty damn high to drive on the interstate, I would avoid, unless you plan on going with, like.....a T56 or something.
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,404
Likes: 1
From: Ansonia/NYC CT
I alos have no idea where you would look to find the identification code, I have looked all over mine, and can't find it. I have somewhat of a similar problem, only, my rear is not the same one the car came with, and I have no idea where it came from, what it's ratio is, etc, lol.
Instructor
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
From: Apple Valley MN
I to have been doing some research - here's the numbers i put together:
The TH-700R4 gear ratios are:
1st= 3.06:1 / 2nd= 1.63:1/ 3rd= 1.00:1 / 4th= .70:1
The 200R4 gear ratios are:
1st= 2.74 / 2nd= 1.57 / 3rd= 1.00 / 4th= 0.67
The TH-350 gear ratios are:
1st= 2.52:1 /2nd=1.52:1/3rd= 1.00:1
The TH-400 gear ratios are:
1st= 2.48:1 /2nd= 1.48:1 /3rd= 1.00:1
My 81 now has 3.38 gears so i am looking at the 200r4
The TH-700R4 gear ratios are:
1st= 3.06:1 / 2nd= 1.63:1/ 3rd= 1.00:1 / 4th= .70:1
The 200R4 gear ratios are:
1st= 2.74 / 2nd= 1.57 / 3rd= 1.00 / 4th= 0.67
The TH-350 gear ratios are:
1st= 2.52:1 /2nd=1.52:1/3rd= 1.00:1
The TH-400 gear ratios are:
1st= 2.48:1 /2nd= 1.48:1 /3rd= 1.00:1
My 81 now has 3.38 gears so i am looking at the 200r4
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,716
Likes: 4
From: New Baden Illinois
I believe that the specific ratios were used for specific engines and transmission. I think the L48 autos all had 3.08. You may get a higher gear with the L82. The manuals also had the higher gear ratios.
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 65,492
Likes: 230
From: Orange Park Florida
I to have been doing some research - here's the numbers i put together:
The TH-700R4 gear ratios are:
1st= 3.06:1 / 2nd= 1.63:1/ 3rd= 1.00:1 / 4th= .70:1
The 200R4 gear ratios are:
1st= 2.74 / 2nd= 1.57 / 3rd= 1.00 / 4th= 0.67
The TH-350 gear ratios are:
1st= 2.52:1 /2nd=1.52:1/3rd= 1.00:1
The TH-400 gear ratios are:
1st= 2.48:1 /2nd= 1.48:1 /3rd= 1.00:1
My 81 now has 3.38 gears so i am looking at the 200r4
The TH-700R4 gear ratios are:
1st= 3.06:1 / 2nd= 1.63:1/ 3rd= 1.00:1 / 4th= .70:1
The 200R4 gear ratios are:
1st= 2.74 / 2nd= 1.57 / 3rd= 1.00 / 4th= 0.67
The TH-350 gear ratios are:
1st= 2.52:1 /2nd=1.52:1/3rd= 1.00:1
The TH-400 gear ratios are:
1st= 2.48:1 /2nd= 1.48:1 /3rd= 1.00:1
My 81 now has 3.38 gears so i am looking at the 200r4
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,192
Likes: 27
From: Boca Raton Florida