Bolts
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,608
Likes: 3
From: TEXAS - you mean there are other states?
Bolts
Alot of components are ready to be re-installed on my car. I do not want to use bolts that will rust within a very short time. Dr. Rebuild's bumper bolt kits are the silver looking bolts. Is this the correct color for the bolts? Should I have them re-coated with the black oxide style coating?
Racer
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 313
Likes: 3
From: North of Boston Ma
Is there a good hardware store close to you? Buy stainless steel they wont rust usually can be found in most common sizes.
Don't use them if its in a place that needs to be a certain grade for strength.(chassis areas and so on)
Don't use them if its in a place that needs to be a certain grade for strength.(chassis areas and so on)
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,608
Likes: 3
From: TEXAS - you mean there are other states?
Thanks guys... maybe I mislead you all. Due to the strength of SS, I think I should not go that way. Rather, my Q is that Dr Rebuild's bolts are the correct grade, but I am concerned about the coating. Maybe it is not as rust preventative as it needs to be. I am concerned to do all teh re-assembly work and have bolts that may be rusty soon after installation
Team Owner
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 23,831
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From: Springfield MO
St. Jude Donor '07
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2001
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From: Wildwood IL
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Racer
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 315
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I thought Batman was wrong so I checked the numbers instead of using my memory.
Grade 8: 150,000psi
Grade 5: 120,000psi
SS: 70,000psi
zinc plated steel (grade 2): 60,000psi
These numbers show that a ss bolt (18-8) is significantly more than "just below" a Grade5. It's bout half the strength of a Grade 5 or about the same as a Grade 2.
Grade 8: 150,000psi
Grade 5: 120,000psi
SS: 70,000psi
zinc plated steel (grade 2): 60,000psi
These numbers show that a ss bolt (18-8) is significantly more than "just below" a Grade5. It's bout half the strength of a Grade 5 or about the same as a Grade 2.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,608
Likes: 3
From: TEXAS - you mean there are other states?
Tim_Ko - thanks for the specifics. This is all good info on SS. I will check out the ARP catalog as well.
But, my question is regarding the coating on the bolts we all get (and I bought from Dr Rebuild). Trying to find out if the coating is decent enough or whether I should consider additional coatings or possibly alternative bolts.
But, my question is regarding the coating on the bolts we all get (and I bought from Dr Rebuild). Trying to find out if the coating is decent enough or whether I should consider additional coatings or possibly alternative bolts.
Racer
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 315
Likes: 0
Tim_Ko - thanks for the specifics. This is all good info on SS. I will check out the ARP catalog as well.
But, my question is regarding the coating on the bolts we all get (and I bought from Dr Rebuild). Trying to find out if the coating is decent enough or whether I should consider additional coatings or possibly alternative bolts.
But, my question is regarding the coating on the bolts we all get (and I bought from Dr Rebuild). Trying to find out if the coating is decent enough or whether I should consider additional coatings or possibly alternative bolts.
I agree with Eddie. If you are asking about bolts to hang your bumpers, then go with stainless. Make you sure you get stainless flat washers, lock washers and nuts. Use anti-seize on the threads. If you feel you must, use a torque wrench. You will never have a problem. If you want to disassemble it 10 years from now, the nuts will spin off like you put them on the day before.
Are you replacing any other bolts or was it just the bumper bolts?
The Bolt Depot will sell you (1) bolt. McMaster sells them in box's (25). The Bolt Depot will fullfil your total order for less than Mcmaster but McMaster is cheaper (volume pricing).
Hope that helps.
-Tim
Racer
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 315
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Thanks 71.
I was curious and went to AlloyBoltz.com and found that they do have (for example) a specialty ss 3/8 bolt - 170,000psi for $3.68. (compare: A grade 8, 3/8-1.5 version from home depot is $1.00). I'll have to email them to find out what material they are using.
From the alloyboltz website:
"This bolt has a .630 diameter flange with a 3/8 6 point hex head. ARP grade 8 stainless bolts, studs, and nuts are virtually impervious to rust and corrosion. Rated at 170,000 psi makes these stronger than regular grade 8 fasteners. These are maintenance free fasteners and come with a polished finish."
I was curious and went to AlloyBoltz.com and found that they do have (for example) a specialty ss 3/8 bolt - 170,000psi for $3.68. (compare: A grade 8, 3/8-1.5 version from home depot is $1.00). I'll have to email them to find out what material they are using.
From the alloyboltz website:
"This bolt has a .630 diameter flange with a 3/8 6 point hex head. ARP grade 8 stainless bolts, studs, and nuts are virtually impervious to rust and corrosion. Rated at 170,000 psi makes these stronger than regular grade 8 fasteners. These are maintenance free fasteners and come with a polished finish."
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 232
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From: Henrietta New York
To answer your plating choice on steel bolts.
Blk. Oxide : Least protection
Bright Zinc plate: Second best
Zinc plate with the yellow chromate color: Best
The above is what is normally available for hardware.
Blk. Oxide : Least protection
Bright Zinc plate: Second best
Zinc plate with the yellow chromate color: Best
The above is what is normally available for hardware.
Racer
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 315
Likes: 0
It's Special!
Interesting answer - it's special!
Tim,
It's a special compound from ARP that ranges from 170,000 psi to 220,000 psi depending on exactly which type of bolt, nut or stud you choose. Their Stainless is stronger than grade 8. It is used by NASCAR, NHRA and most racing serires due to its strength.
Thanks,
Bob
Alloy Boltz
813-645-3185
Visit our Website @ www.alloyboltz.com
Tim,
It's a special compound from ARP that ranges from 170,000 psi to 220,000 psi depending on exactly which type of bolt, nut or stud you choose. Their Stainless is stronger than grade 8. It is used by NASCAR, NHRA and most racing serires due to its strength.
Thanks,
Bob
Alloy Boltz
813-645-3185
Visit our Website @ www.alloyboltz.com
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,608
Likes: 3
From: TEXAS - you mean there are other states?
Hi Tim
Yes all bolts are being re-installed..... so all bolts are being consdiered at this point. The body is off and I am starting re-assembly... headlamps, bumpers, coresupport,tranny mounts, suspensions ......... I did buy the 'packet' bolts from Dr Rebuild for like bumpers and stuff.
Yes all bolts are being re-installed..... so all bolts are being consdiered at this point. The body is off and I am starting re-assembly... headlamps, bumpers, coresupport,tranny mounts, suspensions ......... I did buy the 'packet' bolts from Dr Rebuild for like bumpers and stuff.
Team Owner
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 23,831
Likes: 10
From: Springfield MO
St. Jude Donor '07
I thought Batman was wrong so I checked the numbers instead of using my memory.
Grade 8: 150,000psi
Grade 5: 120,000psi
SS: 70,000psi
zinc plated steel (grade 2): 60,000psi
These numbers show that a ss bolt (18-8) is significantly more than "just below" a Grade5. It's bout half the strength of a Grade 5 or about the same as a Grade 2.
Grade 8: 150,000psi
Grade 5: 120,000psi
SS: 70,000psi
zinc plated steel (grade 2): 60,000psi
These numbers show that a ss bolt (18-8) is significantly more than "just below" a Grade5. It's bout half the strength of a Grade 5 or about the same as a Grade 2.
Racer
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 315
Likes: 0
There are a couple of good books out there on bolts and fasteners but I've found that the mcmaster site provides better "data". The books talk about fastener types generally; but master gives you the tabular data.
I didn't mention that Alloy Boltz grade 8 stainless bolts come in limited sizes - the largest size is (as I recall) 3/8. So, they don't have a ss arp grade 8 bumper bolt if you wanted one for some reason.
Hope that helps.
Last edited by Tim_Ko; Sep 5, 2007 at 04:43 PM.
Racer
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 315
Likes: 0
Hi Tim
Yes all bolts are being re-installed..... so all bolts are being consdiered at this point. The body is off and I am starting re-assembly... headlamps, bumpers, coresupport,tranny mounts, suspensions ......... I did buy the 'packet' bolts from Dr Rebuild for like bumpers and stuff.
Yes all bolts are being re-installed..... so all bolts are being consdiered at this point. The body is off and I am starting re-assembly... headlamps, bumpers, coresupport,tranny mounts, suspensions ......... I did buy the 'packet' bolts from Dr Rebuild for like bumpers and stuff.
Generally, I will reuse non-engine bolts if they are in good shape but I always run them through a tap and die to clean the threads and then coat with anti-seize. The bolts will spin together nicely, can be torqued accurately and can be removed easily.
Pro
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 527
Likes: 112
From: Atlanta area
I hate to throw yet another variable into the fastener question, but here goes.
SS bolts look great, and definitely won't let your bumpers fall off, but they will cause your chassis parts to corrode if they're subjected to moisture. It's called "dissimilar metals" which means that SS and carbon have a galvanic reaction to one another when they come in contact. THe SS actually corrodes away the carbon steel underneath, but it SS isn't harmed (just turns brown).
If you are building your Vette as a fair-weather cruiser, don't worry, but if you will drive in rain on a regular basis, you will see rust forming aroung the bolt heads and nuts as the steel underneath corrodes.
Many of the silver-colored (or green or blue) bolts available are coated with a coating called Dacromet. This is the same stuff the auto makers use for chassis bolts, now, and it's much better than using SS in a wet environment.
Just my $.02.
SS bolts look great, and definitely won't let your bumpers fall off, but they will cause your chassis parts to corrode if they're subjected to moisture. It's called "dissimilar metals" which means that SS and carbon have a galvanic reaction to one another when they come in contact. THe SS actually corrodes away the carbon steel underneath, but it SS isn't harmed (just turns brown).
If you are building your Vette as a fair-weather cruiser, don't worry, but if you will drive in rain on a regular basis, you will see rust forming aroung the bolt heads and nuts as the steel underneath corrodes.
Many of the silver-colored (or green or blue) bolts available are coated with a coating called Dacromet. This is the same stuff the auto makers use for chassis bolts, now, and it's much better than using SS in a wet environment.
Just my $.02.