Anyone here using these?


I am using a 14 inch K&N filter in my 69 vette currently. Will adding a high flow air cleaner really improve air flow to the carb or just suck dirt in?

 

It's only going to suck more dirt in as a result of sucking more air in, but certainly not a higher percentage of dirt. I'll be ditching mine soon for a conical filter at the end of that pretty Procharger right there. And you can see from the faint dirt ring on it that it is sucking air in.

 

Wow...
Post some pics when you are done. We would love to see your procharger set up complete.

 

I have one, but after reading this, it makes me reconsider:

http://speedtalk.com/forum/viewtopic...&highlight=lid

 

Jesus...

 

I had one of those too. I thought maybe i could get a couple more horses on my 383. Decided I didnt like the way it looked,and took it off. Went back to the standard 14" chrome lid. Any HP difference would have been very very small anyway.

So to get more HP I ditched the 500hp 383 for a 611hp 502 and put the chrome lid on top of it!!! Horsepower problem solved!!!!

 

That link is full of contradictions and no proof. 2 of the guys knocking the lids make their own product for sale. No documentation on their dyno pulls? All magazines lie about the results? No test results on real world. No tests or results on the bases being used. No tests on air flow?
I just wasted 5 minutes of my life reading it. Wish I hadn't.

Now that that's said, I can say I have no stock in K&N. I have a K&N extreme with a 1" drop base and it woke my engine up. Considerably faster throttle response over the flat base with 2" paper filter that was on the car when I got it. Throttle responds faster and car pulls harder with the K&N. Mileage...I couldn't tell you and don't care.

 

 

That board is populated by a lot of very knowledgable guys. Some of them I am sure you have heard of.
Joe Sherman is one of the guys that dislikes the lids and he has actually won one of he engine masters competitions and is always getting magazine coverage.
Im not saying to blindly believe everything you read, but totally disregarding what these guys say isnt a great idea either.

 

What brand of lid is that anyway?
I would not mind using it even if the HP gain is not significant. I would not want to use it if it is going to pull in all sorts of dirt from the top into my carb

 

K&N Xtreme Lid

 

I've used a K&N X-Stream lid (or maybe it's a Summit Powerlid) for 5 years with no sign of dirt being sucked throught lid. One of the benefits of a K&N lid is that it allows hot air to escape out the top when you park it after driving in hot weather.

THEN I began experimenting with air boxes. The X-Stream/Powerlid doesn't fit under my stock hood with a Ram Air Box. I had to switch to a flat cover without a wing/knurled bolt through the top. The X-Stream/Powerlid is just taking up space on my workbench. It's for sale - $10+shipping.

 

Wow, 10 bucks is tempting... but then I'd have to get the K&N 3x14" too....

Is that a custom box on there now?? I like the cold air intake idea.

Dan

 

Originally Posted by blckslvr79

"I have a K&N extreme with a 1" drop base and it woke my engine up. Considerably faster throttle response over the flat base with 2" paper filter that was on the car when I got it. Throttle responds faster and car pulls harder with the K&N."

Are we discussing the capability of filter lids in the real world on a car with low hood clearance or professional NHRA racing? I'm sure some of those guys know something about building engines. I wasn't calling them liers, but it's going to take more than a couple guys ranting on a web link in contradiction to each other and no documented facts other than "what they can recall" and "how they FEEL", to convince me that the product is junk. Let's see some published graphs and facts from a neutral source. There are no facts in that link, just opinons from guys in competition with the product. Without facts, I tend to not doubt a products ability, especially when I've used it and felt the difference.

But then again, I guess that's all these sites are, opinions. The only thing I could agree with in that link is that too much of a drop base puts the lid too close to the carb and could harm airflow. In general, keeping the base as level as possible with the top of the carb improves performance because drop bases slow airflow. In any event, from my experience in a street car with limited room for an aircleaner, the K&N extreme lid helped my performance. Without cutting a hole in my hood or spending $800 on a highrise hood, the Extreme did the job for me for minimal cost.

 

My take on these things is such:

The quality of airflow though the engine is almost as important as the quanty. You want a smooth flow through the carb to properly atomize the fuel and hold it in suspension.

Look at the design of the LT-1 air cleaner lid as well as the General's other high performance lids. Note how it directs air in a smooth arc to toward the center of the venturies to best atomize the fuel and increase the velocity. The General was on to something. There are several aftermarket imitations, but none quite like the originals.

So if the engine is getting enough air, one of those pleated tops only serves to create turbulance and disturb the air flow.

The question is how much air do you need? Certainly a 14"x2" element is not sufficient. Much of the element is actually obscured by the drop base. Then what little air is available has to squeeze though a small area between the base and lid and this both restricts and disturbs this flow starving the engine. (Without the drop base, things are a little better.)

So in a case like this, the pleated top may increase power by virtue of letting more air into a starving engine.

A 14"x3" element would probably be OK for most street engines as it provides more area that is not obscured by the base and provides a much greater area for the air to squeeze though on its way to the inner top.

I run a 14x4" element with a drop base, and in my case, I would bet that a pleated top would reduce my hp, especially as I have gone to great lengths to provide the smoothest air flow path.



Note that I even made an "O-ring" that fits within the drop base next to the carb that fills the small "valley." When air comes up around the base, it slams into that valley creating a turbulant area. Car Craft Magazine found 10 hp in a similar situation by ridding an engine of a similar type gap.

 

If the object of these air cleaners is to increase air flow for more power over another one or style, then why not leave it off and get the maximum airflow possible or even available. Therefore leaving the air cleaner off would end the issue of which is better if power is the answer.... No ?,....

 

Well put!
Wish I had the room.

 

Come on..., if you are in the 9 second club you know better than that.

No one wants to suck dirt into their engine regardless of the power loss unless the car is purpose built for racing.

Also, you know that even with no element in place, the engine makes more power simply by having the base in place..., because it smooths out the airflow into the carb (what a concept!)

 

If this is all over air flow, then a tall velosity stack would be the best setup for max power, not a air cleaner in any shape or form.... Right!

. To the best of my knowledge air cleaners never won any drag races either.....

 

Boy, this thread took a spin in a new direction.