I removed my old trailing arms to replace the bushings. I had to saw the bolts. That was fun! The old bolt is frozen where it passes thru the bracket. Since I cut it I have about 2 inches inside the pocket. I've soaked it with PB blaster and tried heat but it won't budge. I can't get anything on it to beat it out either (not enough room). Any tricks for getting it out? Thanks.

 

I took an old 3 inch bolt that fit in the hole of the TA bolt hole and a punch, 2 lb hammer, kept soaking with PB blaster and got mine out...took a while but it finally came out...

 

62C1,
I've had really good luck with a flat pry-bar / fencing tool. I'm talkinging about the ones about 10" long, 2 " wide and in the shape of a "7". You can get good pressure on the bolts with one of these. Good luck,

Jim

 

If i under stand you correct all need to do is get all the shims out of the way, Then take a sawzall with a long blade and cut the bolts off on both sides next bushing , The trailing arm will now come out.
David

 

He already has the arms out. He is now trying to get the frozen portion of the bolts out.

 

Time to replace the bushings, IMHO. Just cut the bolt and the flared ends of the sleeve off, then the rest should fall out.

 

I get it now. When he said he was replacing the bushings i didn't under stand why the bolt would need to be remove from a bushing thats going to be cut out any way, My bad.
David

 

How do you have 2" of bolt left over after you have removed the arms? If you cut the bolt either side of the arm, outside the shims, then removed the arm, you should have only a short 1/8" or less left in the brkt. Try using a sawsall inside the brkt flush w the inner wall after the arm is out to cut remaining bolt length, then use drift pin at an angle to push out the remaining piece. And in my opinion, replace w rubber bushings, not ploy. the poly don't and I mean don't work in this application.

Go ahead, the rest of you can gang up on me if you want, I can tell you why they don't. I went round and round w a forum vendor where I bought my poly set. After measuring and trying unsuccesfully, I got them to agree with me that they won't work as designed. I dont want to diss this vendor as they are reputible and helpfull to many on the forum, but I'll tell you why they dont work if you PM me. The rubber works the best when install correctly at ride height and will last 15 yrs.

 

I say you tell us on the 'floor'. You can do that once versus PM'ing 58.32657 million members. BTW...I have poly bushings in mine.

 

I like the rubber, put NOS bushings in mine...

 

I had already dome everything else in poly so I said F-it...make 'em all match.

 

Here you go Jim,
Got a few minutes?

The components that make up poly bushing assemblies are the outer cup, poly bushing, inner steel spanner sleeve w retaining washer on one end and machined shoulder on bear end, countersunk "end" washer, misc shims.

The poly bushings get pressed into the outer cups, the cups then get pressed into the trailing arms and the inner spanner sleeve slides through the inside of the poly bushings. The spanner sleeve already has a washer staked over on one end of it and you place the other "end' washer on the machined shoulder on the bear end of the spanner and stake it over to hold the whole assy together. The shims are there to use if needed to ensure the assy is tight.

Then this whole assy is placed into the pocket of the car and more shims are placed either side of it to set the correct toe in and one long bolt goes through everything and is tightened up and away you go.

OK, does anybody know or care what is actually happening when your suspension travels up/down? What is the intended bearing surface of your traing arm? How is this supposed to work?

The toe in shims are squeezed tight in the pocket between the "end" washers of the spanner and the inside of the pocket, the spanner is squeezed tight between the toe shims, the poly bushings are pressed in the cups. The intended bearing surface is betwen the spanner sleeve and the poly bushings. In a perfect world, the spanner is a slip fit to the poly bushing, which is where you put the special poly grease and shouldered "end" washers of the spanner keep it from being overtightened and squeezing the poly flanges in the cups. The trailing arm pivots around it. All else is tight.

The poly bushing is straight w a straight hole through it to which the spanner should slip fit and pivot inside the poly. Problem is, even before assy, the spanner was a press fit to the poly by .005. Then press a straight bushing into a tapered cup and it squeezes the whole bushing into a new shape. The flanged end is squeezed smaller and the end squashed inside the tapered end is now over .030 smaller than the OD of the spanner sleeve. So now imagine pressing two poly bushings into the two tapered cups, now try and press that spanner sleeve through both now tapered/misshaped poly bushings, That is one tight a$$ fit. Now go and bolt this into your pocket and tighten it all up. Have any idea where the bearing surface is now? If you think its where its supposed to be, your in for a rebuild. The three other places for it to pivot is the poly turning inside the cup, or the cup turning in the trailing arm, or the spanner sleeve turning around the long bolt. And if thats happening, then the "end" washers of the spanner are twisting against your toe shims. What determines the pivot now at this juncture, is the one w the least resitance. But the greatist resistance is between the spanner and the poly from the tapered cups squeezing the spanner shaft.

The supporting vendor I got them from worked w me and we tried everything like machining the ID of the poly after it was squeezed in the tapered cup to produce a straight slip fit. They gave me extra sets to work with and even supplied me w the rubber ones I ended up using. They pressed the best, fit the best and will be just right. This vendor saw my point and wondered why they never came across it and said they were changing their tune. They were very helpfull and had my interest at heart. Only thing better would be spherical hard bushing.

Well thats it. Sorry for being long winded but you wanted it. Hope it helps.

 

Frank, thinking some more on this, I was wondering just where the pivot friction point is, weather poly or rubber? If my TA is moving up and down inside the pocket, and the alignment shims are wedged between the pocket walls and the bushing end washers, isn't the slippage taking place between the shims and washers, or shims and pocket walls? I can't see the rubber or poly twisting inside the shells with amount of squeeze on them. What am I missing?

 

I agree with Tony. I have been installing poly bushings in the trailing arms of my customers Corvettes for 20 years and never had a problem with them, Not one! As for the rubber ones that i have installed, They have to be replaced after just a few years of service.
David

 

As an update. Followed ctgene's advice. Used a bolt with PB blaster and it finally popped out after beating on it for several hours. Funny, the other side popped out after 2 hits. I replaced the bushing with the Guldstrand metal spherical bearing. This is a race only car so ride comfort/noise doesn't matter. I thought about poly but I don't want to do this job again and with the stress I put on the suspension I think metal is the better choice. Guldstrand says these bearings have been in cars for 30 years without failure. They're also greasable.

Frank24, the reason I had so much bolt left over is I couldn't cut the bolt "outside" the shims because the shims were fused together. There was no rubber bushing left so I cut the bolt between the shims and the bushing then pried the shims off the remaining piece of bolt.

Thanks everyone for your help.

 

Good Mornin Tony/David.

You definetly do not want the friction or slippage taking place between the toe shims/end washer. As they just rust together over time. It cant take place between the toe shims and inside pocket walls because the walls are fixed along w the toe shim.

Imagine the whole assy, poly or rubber, installed in the car. Now remove the t/a, cups and poly/rubber bushing. Whats left? The inner spanner sleeve w end washers squeezed between the toe shims and pocket walls right? Now lets replace the POLY components. The poly setup is supposed to be a slip fit between the end washers w no lateral "squeeze". And be a slip fit around the spanner sleeve. See now how the poly bushing rotates axialy around the spanner w no binding as the t/a moves up/down. The poly is pressed into the cup and does not slip there because the friction there is supposed to be greater than at the spanner. But in actuality, the spanner has the greatest amount of friction (at least in the manufacture of the ones I had) and slippage is forced to try to take place elswhere.

Now lets replace the RUBBER components. There is no "slippage" in the rubber set up. The rubber is adheired to the spanner and well as the cup and since the spanner is squeezed tight to the toe shims and inner walls, the rubber twists axially about the spanner about 2 deg up and 2 deg down during t/a travel. That is why it is important to install the rubber at ride height or w the half shafts level so that is the nuetral or center point of the twist is in the relaxed mode during most of the time. And only during bump or drop is the rubber flexed. If the rubber is installed tightly while the t/a is hanging down, then its always flexed/stressed in the up position and you set yourself up for premature failure every time.

David, who makes the poly bushings that you install? Where do you get them? If they are of a conventional type, they are not right when you press them into the cups and expect the ID of the poly to stay a straight bore for a slip fit to the spanner.

Love this forum.

 

[QUOTE=62C1;1564857897]As an update. Followed ctgene's advice. Used a bolt with PB blaster and it finally popped out after beating on it for several hours. Funny, the other side popped out after 2 hits. I replaced the bushing with the Guldstrand metal spherical bearing. This is a race only car so ride comfort/noise doesn't matter. I thought about poly but I don't want to do this job again and with the stress I put on the suspension I think metal is the better choice. Guldstrand says these bearings have been in cars for 30 years without failure. They're also greasable.

Tell me more about the spherical bearing. Do you need to modify the t/a and where did you get them? To me, thats one better than the rubber.

 

Spherical Metal Bushings

http://www.guldstrand.com/scripts/pr...?idproduct=206

http://www.guldstrand.com/scripts/pr...?idproduct=104

 

The spherical bearing is an easy install. You tack weld the stock sleeves in the trailing arm in place. Guldstrand also recommends welding a small piece of strap iron over the opening at the front of the arm to give added strength. The bearings press into the stock sleeves and a bushing with cups are placed inside. The bushings are swedged to the cups to hold the assembly together. There is a special bolt which is center drilled for a grease fitting which replaces the stock trailing arm bolt. Once the arm is installed just shoot some grease through the bolt to lubricate the bushing. It's recommended they be greased about once a year. The bearing assembly not only allows normal up and down motion of the arm but also allows bind free lateral movement as well. And you don't have to change the bushing every few years.