ZL-1 engine vs LS 3
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 2,337
Likes: 14
From: Norfolk VA
ZL-1 engine vs LS 3
Hello all. I just finished looking up information on the vaunted ZL-1 engine and was was wondering what is all the hype about this engine.? I ran across in announcement that GMPP was recreating this engine in the form of a crate motor. (old news) I was also wondering with the newer LS engines that produce as much if not more horsepower/torque than this "dinosaur" of an engine. It was said that this engine ran poorly on the street then, and I'm sure it would now. Today, 427ci is now considered to be a small block engine. With all of this said, how would this dinosaur stack up against the LS3, 7, or the 9. And also the572 bb engine?
Last edited by Oldguard 7; Apr 14, 2010 at 10:36 PM.
Race Director
Joined: May 2006
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the engine was an aluminum version of an L-88. So you had a big block with the weight of a small block. It was never intended to be street driven, radio and heater delete. You are also comparing a carbureted engine to computer controlled fuel injection. I believe part of the new ZL-1 thought could be nostalgia for the good old days. Below gives more detail from GMPP
"The reborn ZL-1 block has provisions for both a dry-sump or regular oil pump systems and a mechanical fuel pump. The lightweight big-block is engineered to produce up to 800 hp with reliability, and it’s aimed at vintage Can-Am racers, street rodders, nostalgia drag racers, and ZL-1 enthusiasts."
"The reborn ZL-1 block has provisions for both a dry-sump or regular oil pump systems and a mechanical fuel pump. The lightweight big-block is engineered to produce up to 800 hp with reliability, and it’s aimed at vintage Can-Am racers, street rodders, nostalgia drag racers, and ZL-1 enthusiasts."
Last edited by MelWff; Mar 11, 2010 at 04:16 PM.
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2002
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From: Taylor Michigan
The only similarity between the new ZL1 and the old is the block and heads, both are aluminum....The old has all the horsepower and the new has been drastically cut on the internals resulting in much lower HP. They are the same in appearance only....
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 5,691
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From: columbus oh
Hello all. I just finished looking up information on the vaunted ZL-1 engine and was was wondering what is all the hype about this engine.? I ran across in announcement that GMPP was recreating this engine in the form of a crate motor. (old news) I was also wondering with the newer LS engines that produce as much if mot more horsepower/torque than this "dinosaur" of an engine. It was said that this engine ran poorly on the street then, and I'm sure it would now. Today, 427ci is now considered to be a small block engine. With all of this said, hoe would this dinosaur stack up against the LS3, 7, or the 9. And also the572 bb engine?
Race Director
Joined: May 2006
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Ironcross:
I believe you are referring to the engine availalbe in current production corvettes. The original poster is referring to an over the parts counter reissue of the original block from 1969. This is a link to the reissued part.
http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/Chev.../12370850.html
I believe you are referring to the engine availalbe in current production corvettes. The original poster is referring to an over the parts counter reissue of the original block from 1969. This is a link to the reissued part.
http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/Chev.../12370850.html
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,142
Likes: 54
From: Taylor Michigan
Ironcross:
I believe you are referring to the engine availalbe in current production corvettes. The original poster is referring to an over the parts counter reissue of the original block from 1969. This is a link to the reissued part.
http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/Chev.../12370850.html
I believe you are referring to the engine availalbe in current production corvettes. The original poster is referring to an over the parts counter reissue of the original block from 1969. This is a link to the reissued part.
http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/Chev.../12370850.html
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 6,231
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From: Seattle WA
St. Jude Donor '14
What's missing? The block is a better casting than the original, and I don't see any skimping here with an all-forged bottom end. OK, so it's 9.5:1 vs. 12.5:1...which means it will run on pump gas vs. racing gas, and it's got oval-port heads. It's just a lower energy version - but not by all that much.
http://www.gmperformanceparts.com/Pa...l.jsp?engine=3
"Building on that foundation, the short block contains a forged steel crank, forged steel rods, and forged aluminum pistons for a 9.5:1 final compression ratio. Aluminum, oval port heads have a 110 cc combustion chamber and carry 2.19-inch intake and 1.88-inch exhaust valves. A matching, high-flow aluminum oval-port intake feeds the heads with the help of an 870 cfm carburetor. The camshaft is a hydraulic roller with valve lift numbers of .510-inch on the intake and .540-inch on the exhaust. We even added 1.7:1 aluminum roller rockers. Like the original ZL1, the Anniversary 427 comes grossly underrated at 430 horsepower. "
Most of the modern performance LS engines, including the 572 MkV would dominate the orginal ZL-1. It does raise the thought...what would an LS big block look like? 800 CID? :-D
http://www.gmperformanceparts.com/Pa...l.jsp?engine=3
"Building on that foundation, the short block contains a forged steel crank, forged steel rods, and forged aluminum pistons for a 9.5:1 final compression ratio. Aluminum, oval port heads have a 110 cc combustion chamber and carry 2.19-inch intake and 1.88-inch exhaust valves. A matching, high-flow aluminum oval-port intake feeds the heads with the help of an 870 cfm carburetor. The camshaft is a hydraulic roller with valve lift numbers of .510-inch on the intake and .540-inch on the exhaust. We even added 1.7:1 aluminum roller rockers. Like the original ZL1, the Anniversary 427 comes grossly underrated at 430 horsepower. "
Most of the modern performance LS engines, including the 572 MkV would dominate the orginal ZL-1. It does raise the thought...what would an LS big block look like? 800 CID? :-D
Last edited by billla; Mar 11, 2010 at 06:27 PM.
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Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 2,337
Likes: 14
From: Norfolk VA
Race Director
Joined: May 2006
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OK I'm confused, the OP, Oldguard 7, referred to the reissue of a complete engine. All I could find was https://store.gmperformanceparts.com...umber=12370850
This is a bare engine block which you can built anyway you want using modern heads, cam, etc. Some of the posters above are referring to the anniversary 427 complete engine which is not the same. So which version of the ZL-1 are we dealing with in this thread? Thanks.
This is a bare engine block which you can built anyway you want using modern heads, cam, etc. Some of the posters above are referring to the anniversary 427 complete engine which is not the same. So which version of the ZL-1 are we dealing with in this thread? Thanks.
Last edited by MelWff; Mar 12, 2010 at 10:39 AM.
Race Director
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,674
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From: Millington Illinois
St. Jude Donor '08-'09
http://www.gmperformanceparts.com/En...6392&engCat=bb
with Ironcross, This is nothing like the original but a better street motor. A modern Clone would be cheaper and make more power. Buy the block, Build it to a 496 with 11 to 1 compression, rectangular port AFR heads, Solid lifter ZL1 blueprint cam and a modern intake and carb. You could run pump gas, have the "feel", sound and idle of the original, put out 600 HP and rev to 7000 RPM.
with Ironcross, This is nothing like the original but a better street motor. A modern Clone would be cheaper and make more power. Buy the block, Build it to a 496 with 11 to 1 compression, rectangular port AFR heads, Solid lifter ZL1 blueprint cam and a modern intake and carb. You could run pump gas, have the "feel", sound and idle of the original, put out 600 HP and rev to 7000 RPM.
Safety Car
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,558
Likes: 4
From: Oakland California
I just read the information on the ZL-1 and there's room for a lot more power. You can start off with a bigger cam and then maybe boost the compression up a bit since it sits at 9.5:1. LS1 engine are great, but there's nothing like the sound of a big block engine. I would rather go with an LSX engine because you can make a lot of power and still keep it street friendly, plus you'll suck up less gas, and have better fuel control. Either way, these are both great engines.
.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,403
Likes: 95
9.5 compression 3 points down in power but streetable, heavy big block chevy valve's hydrauilic lifters limiting any revs. Its nice fairly light weight slug.
LS7 probably around 11.0 compression for power $1600 worth of lightweight titanium valves so the engine can keep reving make some power.
LS7 probably around 11.0 compression for power $1600 worth of lightweight titanium valves so the engine can keep reving make some power.
Last edited by Little Mouse; Mar 12, 2010 at 02:44 PM.
Safety Car
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,558
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From: Oakland California
in my face. As long as it's a 
V8 I'm happy with it
.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 7,353
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From: Graceland in a Not Correctly Restored Stingray
BB's forever...
As eclipsing the modern LS7's performance (including on top end) happens to be among the targets of the pump gas 427 BB I've been "engineering" and collecting parts for these long months, I'd love to have one of those ZL1 blocks in which to plug all of my bits. Sure, it's getting expensive and funding it is taking me a good long time, but I'm confident enough in reaching that goal (and with decent manners, too) that I'm actually putting my $$$ where my mouth is. Just wish I had more of it...
Anyway, call me a dinosaur if you will, but I'd just rather have a BB of my own creation in my shark than to buy off-the-rack, no matter how gee-whiz the current selection.
Anyway, call me a dinosaur if you will, but I'd just rather have a BB of my own creation in my shark than to buy off-the-rack, no matter how gee-whiz the current selection.
Last edited by TheSkunkWorks; Mar 12, 2010 at 04:21 PM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,101
Likes: 3
From: Cruising somewhere in St. Louis, Missouri
This is nothing like the original but a better street motor. A modern Clone would be cheaper and make more power. Buy the block, Build it to a 496 with 11 to 1 compression, rectangular port AFR heads, Solid lifter ZL1 blueprint cam and a modern intake and carb. You could run pump gas, have the "feel", sound and idle of the original, put out 600 HP and rev to 7000 RPM.
oohhh ooohhh ooohhh aaahhh aaahhh aaahhh
