Finally got it running good!
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 151
Likes: 1
From: Cedar Springs MI
Finally got it running good!
I just picked it up after being 2 1/2 wks in the shop, wont mention the shop as I am not happy with them and they came highly recommended.
Had the rear end sealed up, found out I have 3:77 gears
I told them to trace the slow starting issue I have had since day 1 and get it running good. I had my 4th carb on there since summer, 2 600 Edelbrocks both junk, then I ordered a 600 Holley, when I opened the box it was a 670 Avenger, put it on in the fall and was never able to tune and test, ran like crap when I drove it this spring idle was OK.
Got it back FRI and it stumbled sputtered and shaked all the way home about 30 MI in stop and go traffic.
I called Pep Boys and asked if they would take back the carb 6 mo after and they said yes
So now I installed a 600 Holley and tuned the timing "which they supposedly did" and it runs pretty good now, still a little pinging but maybe some premium will fix that.
The starting issue they said was the cam but it did it totally stock as well but it is getting 12 volts to the starter.
Had the rear end sealed up, found out I have 3:77 gears
I told them to trace the slow starting issue I have had since day 1 and get it running good. I had my 4th carb on there since summer, 2 600 Edelbrocks both junk, then I ordered a 600 Holley, when I opened the box it was a 670 Avenger, put it on in the fall and was never able to tune and test, ran like crap when I drove it this spring idle was OK.
Got it back FRI and it stumbled sputtered and shaked all the way home about 30 MI in stop and go traffic.
I called Pep Boys and asked if they would take back the carb 6 mo after and they said yes
So now I installed a 600 Holley and tuned the timing "which they supposedly did" and it runs pretty good now, still a little pinging but maybe some premium will fix that.
The starting issue they said was the cam but it did it totally stock as well but it is getting 12 volts to the starter.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 151
Likes: 1
From: Cedar Springs MI
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 151
Likes: 1
From: Cedar Springs MI
I had it set to 8 degrees BTDC before I took it in. I dont know now as they messed with it and I didnt put my light on it last night just turned it until the the idle sounded better.
They said the starter still drags but it seems better to me so far but its been cold out.
They said the starter still drags but it seems better to me so far but its been cold out.
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 201
Likes: 0
From: some hole in the ground town- camp verde:) arizona
i've had some issues w/ starters in a couple of vehicles. one it cranks really slow. the problem with that car is it has over 100k, low compression in every cylinder, and isn't driven very often so when we do start it up it has to get some compression built up and everything lubed up inside. warm starts are much better with it though. the corvettes old starter was a little slow too. replaced it and wow what a difference. this new one really cranks it fast. i'd try replacing it and see if it makes a difference.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 6,231
Likes: 65
From: Seattle WA
St. Jude Donor '14
Hard turnover and pinging are fairly good indications that the timing is NOT set correctly. Most modern shops have absolutely no idea how to correctly set timing.
Timing lights are cheap, and it's not hard to learn to do...
Timing lights are cheap, and it's not hard to learn to do...
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 151
Likes: 1
From: Cedar Springs MI
I may have to get a Holley spring kit this weekend and have some fun.
Maybe just more gas would help that issue.
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 6,231
Likes: 65
From: Seattle WA
St. Jude Donor '14
By the way, that pinging is called "detonation"...and if it happens enough, you'll destroy the engine.
Spend 15 minutes and just time the thing right.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 151
Likes: 1
From: Cedar Springs MI
does someone have a PIC of where timing should be?? I think with my cam it should be a little advanced but maybe I'm not using the right mark.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 6,231
Likes: 65
From: Seattle WA
St. Jude Donor '14
The sticky has everything you need to set it correctly:
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c3-t...long-post.html
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 151
Likes: 1
From: Cedar Springs MI
I'm getting a bit confused here. You noted that you had the timing set to 8 BTDC before the shop "messed with it"...so why do you need a pic to set timing? Timing has nothing to do with what cam you have.
The sticky has everything you need to set it correctly:
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c3-t...long-post.html
The sticky has everything you need to set it correctly:
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c3-t...long-post.html
I used the the 2nd notch from the bottom of the gauge I believe.
Drifting
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,908
Likes: 129
From: Fredericksburg Virginia
My speed guy places little emphasis on the IDLE timing. He feels strongly about the ADVANCED timing since that is where the engine runs most of the time. After that is set correctly, you check the idle timing to see where you're at.
My 1970 LT-1 clone engine with aftermarket TI is set to 38 degrees advanced timing. I recall that it ended up 8 or 10 degrees at idle.
You can get a dial-advance timing light at Harbor Freight for under $50. That would suit you fine for as often as you're going to use it. Just twist the dial until you're reading TDC on the crank when you have the engine revved up enough to fully advance the distributor. Read the dial, and that's your full advanced timing.
And personally, I wouldn't consider running anything but premium. Not 92 Octane or Valero/Citgo junk premium, either. 93 Octane from Shell, Sunoco, or other. BP (Amoco) is best.
My 1970 LT-1 clone engine with aftermarket TI is set to 38 degrees advanced timing. I recall that it ended up 8 or 10 degrees at idle.
You can get a dial-advance timing light at Harbor Freight for under $50. That would suit you fine for as often as you're going to use it. Just twist the dial until you're reading TDC on the crank when you have the engine revved up enough to fully advance the distributor. Read the dial, and that's your full advanced timing.
And personally, I wouldn't consider running anything but premium. Not 92 Octane or Valero/Citgo junk premium, either. 93 Octane from Shell, Sunoco, or other. BP (Amoco) is best.
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,372
Likes: 4
From: Springfield VA
Problem is very few cars out there now require a light so to try and train someone on one to them is a waste of time for most techs.
This is one thing you either need to find a older tech or better yet a skill the owner should learn.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,241
Likes: 4
From: Okinawa Okinawa
Click on billa's link and follow directions. You will be good to go once you are done. Doesn't take anytime at all.
Do this quickly before your pinging gets the best out of one of your pistions....although, then you can get a new crate engine.
Do this quickly before your pinging gets the best out of one of your pistions....although, then you can get a new crate engine.
Pro
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 668
Likes: 21
I just put new 186 heads on my 69 Elcamino. Once I got it back together I took out the old timing light just to see the engine has no timing tab. (That's what I get for buying someones project) Last owner bragged about a famous builder putting the engine together and how much it cost.(He got ripped off). I ended up timing by ear. Yes, I did have to retard it because of pinging. Rund great now. My dad showed me how to use a timing light and block the vacuumon the distributor, when I was just a little boy. Well before I became a crazy teenage motorhead. Now I'm an old fart. Any I agree we all should be able to set our own timing. Maybe you could use a mini high torque starter. They do work well.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 151
Likes: 1
From: Cedar Springs MI
I said screw the light and just did it while running both at idle and reved up a bit until no pinging and smooth acceleration. After that I tweaked the carb a bit leaning it out as it was backfiring after I turn it off.
leaned it out until it ran rough and then backed up 1/4 turn.
I had to adjust the idle up a bit after that because in gear it was too low.
took it for a a couple 100 MPH runs on back roads and it ran great!
leaned it out until it ran rough and then backed up 1/4 turn.
I had to adjust the idle up a bit after that because in gear it was too low.
took it for a a couple 100 MPH runs on back roads and it ran great!
Race Director
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,674
Likes: 122
From: Millington Illinois
St. Jude Donor '08-'09
I said screw the light and just did it while running both at idle and reved up a bit until no pinging and smooth acceleration. After that I tweaked the carb a bit leaning it out as it was backfiring after I turn it off.
leaned it out until it ran rough and then backed up 1/4 turn.
I had to adjust the idle up a bit after that because in gear it was too low.
took it for a a couple 100 MPH runs on back roads and it ran great!
leaned it out until it ran rough and then backed up 1/4 turn.
I had to adjust the idle up a bit after that because in gear it was too low.
took it for a a couple 100 MPH runs on back roads and it ran great!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,948
Likes: 72
From: Oxford MA-----You just lost the game!!!!
Keep the shiny side up!
Scott