my previous post

follow up post

'Bout ready to put the Master Cylinder in. Do I need to do anything to the booster as far as cleaning it up or anything else? The nuts holding the master to the booster were a booger bear to get off. They were hard to turn all the way to the end of the bolts. (and 15mm not 5/8" ) (started rounding one off before i realized it.)



I'm also having a terrible time getting the left front rubber hose off. Both rears and the right front came right off. Even with a 3/8" flare wrench (and the 5/8" under) it began to round off. I have sprayed it multiple times with PB Blaster over the last few weeks. I tried using a small needle nose vise grip to work it back and forth but to no avail. My next effort tomorrow will be to take the holding clip off so it will pull down through the frame bracket and use the vise grip on it again but this time trying to turn the hose end. I am also considering applying heat with a small propane torch but I'm a bit frightened to do this with all the pb blaster and brake fluid that's around it. I have also considered getting a small pipe wrench to use on it. Do any of these solutions sound ok? any other suggestions?




and finally, here are a couple of shots of the rotors. I'm not planning on having them turned. They're pretty smooth, both front and back. I don't think they've ever been removed from the hubs (49k miles in '99 and '59k now) and I don't want to worry too much about the run out stuff. The left front looks a bit worse than the right front. It was leaking worse than the right. Thoughts? Clean them up with brake cleaner? (the rotors spin freely and there is no play in the bearings that I can feel. (I'm pretty sure I replaced the bearings in '99 when I bought the car.)

left front:



right front:



Thanks for all the help.

 

That hose/tube is going to be a fight regardless. IT's made up it's mind and there's not a thing you can do about it.

Where is the other end of that left front tube? Where does it go? If you can get to the other end, and it's short enough, maybe remove the tube and hose as one piece. Get it out from under the car and go after it.
Past that, wash it down and gently apply some heat. I'm not a real fan of applying heat to a brake line- but the option is cutting the line off and re-flaring it. If the line is pretty short, NAPA sells brake lines with the armor wrap too.

 

it's the left front line. routes to the combo/proportioning valve. I've considered just replacing that line, but don't really want to start wrenching on the lines on the valve body if i don't have to. i have sprayed those down with pb blaster as well tho. If I cant get the nut to break lose with no damage that'll be my next move.

i'm starting to lose patience. my wife's that is. she says she wants her parking spot back.

 

You can put the flare wrench on the nut and the vice grip on the wrench.

The left front line is easy enough to change if all else fails.

 

If you can get a small pipe wrench on it, that should work.

 

wooo hoooo! smallest pipe wrench i could find was a 10". It would have been a bit easier with a 6" or 8". Shot it with more pb blaster couple times last night and then again this morning. Cleaned off the hose fitting a bit and then applied a little heat with a plumber's torch. Not much heat maybe 10 or 15 seconds worth. didn't even start smoking. just a bit of smell of burn. it popped right loose. and the nut is not too boogered up. 3/8" flare wrench still fits on it pretty good. hopefully i'll be able to tighten it back up ok. sprayed a bit of pb blaster on the bare threads and hit em with a wire brush.

 

Alright, I'm now bench bleeding my new master cylinder. I've never done this before. The instructions say to fill the resevoir, allow fluid to drip from each outlet port, attach blocking plugs in each port, push piston in 3/4" to 1", release and repeat until piston can't be depressed more than 1/8" and no air bubbles appear.

Before putting fluid in the resevoir I pushed the piston in about 1/2" or so just to get a feel for the resistance. I put the fluid in, got drip at both ports and plugged the ports. Since then I can only push the piston in just barely. I'm not even sure i'm getting to 1/8". There is a strong squirt of fluid from the bottom of the front resevoir and no air bubbles. I see very little squirt in the rear resevoir each time I depress the plunger and I only get one little bitty air bubble.

Am i on the right track? Just keep going until i see no air bubbles in rear resevoir?

 

 

pete, not really. first, my instructions say "NEVER clamp onto the body of the master cylinder as this will cause damage and will VOID THE WARRANTY." So i haven't clamped it into a vise. (i think that's what the picture shows.) But I do have it sitting on a shelf and I am pushing in on the piston pretty firmly. Second, looks like they are using bleeder tubes instead of port plugs. Are you saying that's what I need to do? Thanks for the reply.

 

Yes you need tubes not plugs.
The tubes screw into the M/C and the fluid goes out the tubes and back into the top of the M/C.

 

I was able to clamp the flange that bolts to the booster in my vise. I also agree with using tubes.

 

ok, i'll see if i can find some. or make some.

ArkyVette used the same master as I have and he said he didn't have to use the tubes. And Cardone's instructions don't use them. I went to the Cardone website and they have a video that doesn't use them but they do have the master inserted into a vise. ha. that syringe thing in their video looks pretty cool.

edit:

 

You can buy the tubes at most auto parts stores. In the help section.

 

I did find bleed tubes and connected them. Put the master in a vise. The piston was easy enough to push in but I got the same results in the resevoirs. The front resevoir bled out in just a couple of plunges. The rear did just as it did when I could only plunge the piston in ~1/8". Each plunge resulted in just one tiny bubble. It took probably 50 or 60 plunges to get to the point that no more bubbles formed.
Thanks for the advice.

 

I'm not sure if I have a problem in my brake lines or not. I installed the master cylinder but have not hooked up the brake lines to the calipers yet. I have opened all the brake lines at the wheels one at a time to flush them out good.

The two front lines seem to have a pretty good flow through them and the left rear is not too bad, but does not have as good a drip as the two front ones.

The right rear, however, will just barely drip at all. Is it just a function of how far it is from the master and the fluid having to travel to the left rear block and then across to the right? Or does it sound like the line is maybe clogged?

All the fluid that does make it through is clean, I'm just worried that it's not pushing out whatever gunk might be in the lines.

I would hate to finish installing the new calipers and have the seals start leaking again because of trash in the lines.

 

I'm not a pro but I've done a few master cylinders over the years (and I've stayed at a Holiday Inn recently), while bench bleading the MC using the tubes you should be able to push the plunger all the way in every time, it won't build any back pressure with using the tubes.

as far as the brake lines go, remember you are pushing fluid through the proportioning valve so you won't get as much flow to the rear brakes as the front. also, the rear brakes (right to left) work off of a "T" setup, so it's likely the fluid is just following the path of least resistance, try plugging the line that's got the best flow and see if the other line starts flowing better.

 

thanks for the reply. and yes, with the tubes i could push the plunger all the way in each time. i just thought it was strange that i only got one tiny bubble from the rear resevoir each time i pushed the plunger in.

I do have the 3 other lines plugged. The right front still drips a little bit, but that shouldn't have any effect on the rear since the front and rear are fed seperately by the front and rear resevoirs. FWIW, i would describe the rear as more of a "L" setup. I'm just wondering that with the left rear line plugged should i be getting better flow to the left side or if the greater distance plus the bends around the rear end really restrict a gravity flow that much.

I'm wondering if i wouldn't be better off replacing all the lines, blocks and proportioning valve now (do it right the first time.)

 

Get a helper. Close all the bleeder screws and press the brake pedal. Open the outer bleeder screw on the right rear. The brake pedal will go to the floor. Tighten the bleeder screw BEFORE releasing the brake pedal. If you don't get some flow within 3 or 4 tries then you might have a blockage.

 

I haven't hooked up the lines to the calipers yet and don't want to yet. If there is crud in the lines I don't want to force it thru the calipers. I'm thinking I'll figure out how to securely block off each line and then pressurize the lines (with my new motive bleeder .) I've also considered blowing compressed air thru them but I've read negative opinions about doing that with non dry air.

 

Edit: I've considered using someone to press the pedal to pressurize the lines but I'm concerned that the proportioning valve would defeat those efforts. Which is also a concern using the power bleeder.