Red Top Optima - Extremely Poor Quality
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,937
Likes: 848
From: melbourne florida
2023 C3 of the Year Finalist - Modified
its great we have a manufacturers representative to field questions .
i have had only good results with the optima batteries i have had and do not know anyone that feels otherwise . there have been a couple that looked like idiots because the alternator was sketchy or bad cables etc.
i think the title of this thread should be edited as it may imply a very negative opinion that people won't bother to read further.
i have had only good results with the optima batteries i have had and do not know anyone that feels otherwise . there have been a couple that looked like idiots because the alternator was sketchy or bad cables etc.
i think the title of this thread should be edited as it may imply a very negative opinion that people won't bother to read further.
Racer
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 425
Likes: 3
From: Jefferson City Missouri
Thanks for the input, Jim. At Advance, though, we didn't give out new batteries unless the one in question was proven defective. This was/is controlled by the computer system as a defective code from the testing machine was required to issue a new replacement battery.
I'm a little bias because my life mostly revolves around fixing and maintaining things while the owner/operators have no clue and just want to complain and demand about something they know nothing about. It's amazing how when things are properly cared for how well they work and how long they can last.
Opps, I just went off on a rant. Sorry!
Safety Car
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 3,717
Likes: 551
From: Seattle Washington
I have used the Optima Batteries for a long time. Probably not long after they came out, early 1990's ? I have killed my share of them off, generally from leaving a car with a par astatic drain for long periods with no trickle charger since they weren't as common as they are today. Probably the best job I did of killing one off was to leave the windshield wiper hung up on the bottom of the windshield. I shut off the switch and headed for Alaska for 6 months only to return to a dead battery. Little did I know the Wiper was hung up and trying to make its last swipe for the entire 6 months!
Doing some re search on the web I have found that people seem to be pleased using CTEK trickle Chargers. They have a Optima Battery mode just for these batteries. I don't know if it is really doing something different than other chargers or if its just letting you turn on a light that tells you want you want to see. I bought 4 of them and have been using them ever since. I have never had an issue since. I have 7 Red Tops that I can think of, I have them in Vettes, Trucks, Forklifts, and a Diesel Bobcat. Every thing I have sits for long periods of time when I leave for Alaska.
Probably my biggest complaint about them today is that Costco no longer sells them. They had a real good price on them and if I did something really stupid and managed to drain one down I could always count on them returning it with out so much as a glance to see if it was still red.
Doing some re search on the web I have found that people seem to be pleased using CTEK trickle Chargers. They have a Optima Battery mode just for these batteries. I don't know if it is really doing something different than other chargers or if its just letting you turn on a light that tells you want you want to see. I bought 4 of them and have been using them ever since. I have never had an issue since. I have 7 Red Tops that I can think of, I have them in Vettes, Trucks, Forklifts, and a Diesel Bobcat. Every thing I have sits for long periods of time when I leave for Alaska.
Probably my biggest complaint about them today is that Costco no longer sells them. They had a real good price on them and if I did something really stupid and managed to drain one down I could always count on them returning it with out so much as a glance to see if it was still red.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 7,426
Likes: 1,559
From: mount holly NC
2025 c3 ('74-'82) of the Year Finalist - Unmodified
2019 C3 of Year Finalist (appearance mods)
Still not sold on AGM batteries.
November 2000 I installed a NAPA #7578 lead acid battery.
June 2009 I installed a new (same part number) battery.
The old battery still worked but I felt it might fail because of the age.
The AGM batteries cost twice as much and now you need a special charger.
June 2009 I installed a new (same part number) battery.
The old battery still worked but I felt it might fail because of the age.
The AGM batteries cost twice as much and now you need a special charger.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,453
Likes: 976
From: RI, Now Franklin/Nashville TN
November 2000 I installed a NAPA #7578 lead acid battery.
June 2009 I installed a new (same part number) battery.
The old battery still worked but I felt it might fail because of the age.
The AGM batteries cost twice as much and now you need a special charger.
http://www.amazon.com/Optima-150-341.../dp/B009M3PQFA
June 2009 I installed a new (same part number) battery.
The old battery still worked but I felt it might fail because of the age.
The AGM batteries cost twice as much and now you need a special charger.
http://www.amazon.com/Optima-150-341.../dp/B009M3PQFA
Round 2 for my comments about using lead acid batteries and their incredible longevity in both my C3 and 94 Mustang GT Convertible which I had out today for the first time this year. Kirkland (Costco) battery-1998-still going strong. That's 16 Years!!!! Why in the world would someone pay $200 for a battery when a $70-80 will not only do but last 2-3 times as long-Beyond me…………..
I also have a Kirkland Costco battery in my 2001 Pontiac Grand Prix that I is driven daily all year round-temperatures under 0 degrees this past winter-6-7 years old now. Started and driven EVERY day-20,000-25,000 miles per year.
Last edited by jb78L-82; Apr 19, 2014 at 05:53 PM.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 413
Likes: 22
From: Justin TX
Hi TX-Techman, I noticed your post and wanted to offer some assistance. As KonaGolden indicated, Optima batteries are AGM batteries, not gel batteries (the electrolyte is absorbed into the glass mat, hence the moniker AGM). As such, they should never be charged on “gel” or even “gel/AGM” charger settings, as they may not fully-charge the battery and could damage it over time. Most chargers work just fine on Optima batteries, but one of the reasons we came out with our own chargers, was because many chargers will not deliver current to batteries discharged below a minimum voltage level, often as high as 10.5 volts. When batteries are discharged below that level, many chargers won't turn on or some will turn on briefly, but when the battery doesn't meet a minimum voltage level within a set period of time (usually a couple of minutes), the charger will turn off and show a fault code on the battery.
If you can fully-charge your RedTop to about 12.6-12.8 volts and disconnect it from your car, it should hold close to that voltage level for 12-24 hours afterwards. If it holds voltage when disconnected, but drops voltage when connected, something in your car is discharging your battery. If it drops significant voltage during that timespan, even when it is completely disconnected from your car, there is probably an issue with your battery.
Una4dbl55, battery warranties are from the original date of purchase and do no re-set with each subsequent replacement. What type of maintainer were you using during the winter, that failed to keep your battery charged while it was in storage?
tak82, if you are using one of our batteries, I would totally disagree with the advice offered to you regarding proper voltage maintenance. Whenever any battery is discharged below 12.4 volts and is left sitting in that state, sulfation begins to form in the battery, which diminishes capacity and lifespan. That makes a quality battery maintenance device an excellent investment for any vehicle that doesn't see regular use. The main concern with battery maintainers is finding one that will not overcharge a battery. Most modern battery chargers that are microprocessor-controlled will not overcharge a battery.
I would also respectfully disagree with hugie82's advice regarding charging our batteries, as it could damage the battery, create a very dangerous situation and void the warranty. We do not recommend a charge rate that exceeds 10 amps. A group 34/78 RedTop is a 50Ah battery, so charging it at 200 amps for even 30 minutes would essentially dump 100Ah into a 50Ah box (assuming 100% efficiency with the charger). That is a really bad idea.
While some folks will differeniate between chargers and maintainers, they can both function the same way. Chargers tend to charge at a higher amperage rate (7+ amps) while maintainers tend to charge at a lower amperage rate (less than 5 amps). Maintainers can charge a battery, they just take longer to do it if they are operating at a lower amperage rate. Chargers can also maintain batteries properly, if they have maintenance modes built into them.
The parallel charging technique redvetracr was trying to link to is also described in this YouTube video- Tech Tips 3: How do I recover a deeply-discharged battery? - YouTube
4SPDL81, I'm glad to hear your RedTop has been working well for you for ten years. If you are concerned about how much longer it may last, you can always have it load-tested at a local auto parts retailer. Many will offer this service for free. Just be sure the battery is fully-charged to at least 12.6 volts before you have it tested. As for the warranty, if any battery is going to fail from a manufacturing defect, it will likely do so well within the first year of use, if not the first few weeks. Beyond that, battery lifespan is largely correlated to use and maintenance.
roscobbc, people buy RedTop batteries for a lot of different reasons. C5 owners like them, because their batteries are mounted directly above their PCM, which can be ruined if acid were to leak on them. Corvette owners with immaculate paint jobs like them for the same reason. In an honest moment, some red Corvette owners might admit they bought them to match their paint. Our batteries are designed to last up to twice as long as flooded products, which is a popular reason for many folks.
Jim McIlvaine
eCare Manager, OPTIMA Batteries
www.pinterest.com/optimabatteries
If you can fully-charge your RedTop to about 12.6-12.8 volts and disconnect it from your car, it should hold close to that voltage level for 12-24 hours afterwards. If it holds voltage when disconnected, but drops voltage when connected, something in your car is discharging your battery. If it drops significant voltage during that timespan, even when it is completely disconnected from your car, there is probably an issue with your battery.
Una4dbl55, battery warranties are from the original date of purchase and do no re-set with each subsequent replacement. What type of maintainer were you using during the winter, that failed to keep your battery charged while it was in storage?
tak82, if you are using one of our batteries, I would totally disagree with the advice offered to you regarding proper voltage maintenance. Whenever any battery is discharged below 12.4 volts and is left sitting in that state, sulfation begins to form in the battery, which diminishes capacity and lifespan. That makes a quality battery maintenance device an excellent investment for any vehicle that doesn't see regular use. The main concern with battery maintainers is finding one that will not overcharge a battery. Most modern battery chargers that are microprocessor-controlled will not overcharge a battery.
I would also respectfully disagree with hugie82's advice regarding charging our batteries, as it could damage the battery, create a very dangerous situation and void the warranty. We do not recommend a charge rate that exceeds 10 amps. A group 34/78 RedTop is a 50Ah battery, so charging it at 200 amps for even 30 minutes would essentially dump 100Ah into a 50Ah box (assuming 100% efficiency with the charger). That is a really bad idea.
While some folks will differeniate between chargers and maintainers, they can both function the same way. Chargers tend to charge at a higher amperage rate (7+ amps) while maintainers tend to charge at a lower amperage rate (less than 5 amps). Maintainers can charge a battery, they just take longer to do it if they are operating at a lower amperage rate. Chargers can also maintain batteries properly, if they have maintenance modes built into them.
The parallel charging technique redvetracr was trying to link to is also described in this YouTube video- Tech Tips 3: How do I recover a deeply-discharged battery? - YouTube
4SPDL81, I'm glad to hear your RedTop has been working well for you for ten years. If you are concerned about how much longer it may last, you can always have it load-tested at a local auto parts retailer. Many will offer this service for free. Just be sure the battery is fully-charged to at least 12.6 volts before you have it tested. As for the warranty, if any battery is going to fail from a manufacturing defect, it will likely do so well within the first year of use, if not the first few weeks. Beyond that, battery lifespan is largely correlated to use and maintenance.
roscobbc, people buy RedTop batteries for a lot of different reasons. C5 owners like them, because their batteries are mounted directly above their PCM, which can be ruined if acid were to leak on them. Corvette owners with immaculate paint jobs like them for the same reason. In an honest moment, some red Corvette owners might admit they bought them to match their paint. Our batteries are designed to last up to twice as long as flooded products, which is a popular reason for many folks.
Jim McIlvaine
eCare Manager, OPTIMA Batteries
www.pinterest.com/optimabatteries
I really appreciate your input and I received great information from the tech I spoke to when I called in. My situation is interesting in that I had taken the car out a couple of weeks ago and driven it a few times over a two week period. During that time it was not on my Battery Tender but the battery disconnect was disabled. On the Monday before it failed I cranked and moved the car and it seemed fine. I did not drive the car the rest of the week until Friday (4 days) when on the way to our Vette club. I discovered the battery was completely discharged to under 4 volt. I connected my charger that has the correct settings for the Optima (AGM) and it reported a bad battery after being connected a few minutes.
After connecting the new battery I used a Fluke 87 to test the drain on the battery. It is only pulling 25ma, based on one chart it shows that the battery should last 256 days before it would be discharged to a point of not starting. Typically I have the disconnect open so that completely takes away all question of the car draining the battery.
I have had the alternator checked at a real alternator shop and it is working well.
My Battery Tender Jr only puts out .75 amps. I do not plan to use it on the new battery and plan to purchase the Optima maintainer after the summer. Do you think this could have been the culprit?
Thanks again for your input, I think several of us have learned a few things about Optima Batteries. I hope to see the life out of this one that others are reporting.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 413
Likes: 22
From: Justin TX
its great we have a manufacturers representative to field questions .
i have had only good results with the optima batteries i have had and do not know anyone that feels otherwise . there have been a couple that looked like idiots because the alternator was sketchy or bad cables etc.
i think the title of this thread should be edited as it may imply a very negative opinion that people won't bother to read further.
i have had only good results with the optima batteries i have had and do not know anyone that feels otherwise . there have been a couple that looked like idiots because the alternator was sketchy or bad cables etc.
i think the title of this thread should be edited as it may imply a very negative opinion that people won't bother to read further.
That is a great idea, I did not realize you could change titles. I expect I will have much better success after replacing my Battery Tender Jr with the Optima maintainer. My back ground is electrical engineering (old school). I did not realize there was so much to know about batteries, never stop learning. I am going to dig in a little further, I would like to know what the differences are between a AGM maintainer. I assume a difference in the electronics and what triggers the unit to output. The standard maintainers put out a constant voltage which really just cooks a AGM. I am guessing the AGM units only put out when needed.
Former Vendor
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 279
Likes: 20
From: Glendale Wisconsin
Thanks for the input, Jim. At Advance, though, we didn't give out new batteries unless the one in question was proven defective. This was/is controlled by the computer system as a defective code from the testing machine was required to issue a new replacement battery.
I saw on TV, ShipShape was the name of the show I believe, a while back where a tech explained that these batteries require more of a charge than the normal wet cell. He went on to say that if they were not maintained at full charge, it would shorten the battery's life. This may have been just for the yellow top, but I don't remember. Perhaps this is why the batteries returned were not fully charged. Maybe you could comment on this.
I saw on TV, ShipShape was the name of the show I believe, a while back where a tech explained that these batteries require more of a charge than the normal wet cell. He went on to say that if they were not maintained at full charge, it would shorten the battery's life. This may have been just for the yellow top, but I don't remember. Perhaps this is why the batteries returned were not fully charged. Maybe you could comment on this.
Not having watched the ShipShape show, it's difficult for me to comment on what was said by them. Based on your description, I would say none of our batteries require more of a charge than a flooded counterpart. Contrary to petes74ttop claim, in most instances, Optima batteries can be charged and maintained just as someone would with a flooded product- no special charger is needed. It is only when AGM batteries become deeply-discharged, that they may need a parallel charge, if the charging unit does not recognize or charge batteries discharged below a minimum voltage level. Any lead-acid battery that is discharged below 12.4 volts and is allowed to sit in that state will begin to sulfate, which diminishes both capacity and lifespan. That is true for any lead-acid battery, wet or dry.
TX-Techman, it sounds like you no longer have your old battery, but I would've been interested in knowing if it dropped significant voltage over 12-24 hours like you experienced, if it was totally disconnected from your car. When I had Brady Basner in from Powermaster Alternators to shoot a tech video, we discharged the battery on my '92 Silverado after we established baseline numbers. My YellowTop kept starting the engine, until we discharged it below 8.0 volts, so it is possible for deeply-discharged Optima batteries to keep turning an engine over even into the single digits. Less than 4 volts sounds very extreme though.
A typical battery, like our 34/78 RedTop is a 50Ah battery. If your vehicle has a 25-milliamp parasitic draw, that means it will discharge that battery at a rate of .6 amps per day (.025 x 24 hours). That would result in that battery being completely discharged in about 83 days. (50Ah/.6 amps). Those calculations assume the battery is in relatively good condition and fully-charged when the car is parked (most are not) and these timeframes can be shorter in hotter climates and longer in temperate climates. Most vehicles also need batteries that are well above a 0% state of charge to start. Even when batteries are completely disconnected from a vehicle, they will still have a small self-discharge rate, although AGM products will do a much better job of holding voltage over time, than a flooded product.
As for chargers, the best units are microprocessor-controlled and there are two basic types of maintenance chargers. Fully-automatic, “multi-stage or multi-step” chargers will monitor the battery and charge it as necessary. Multi-stage maintainers will charge at varying voltages and varying amperage (rarely exceeding 2 amps). Some of these multi-step chargers are also capable of being regular battery chargers (7 amps or more). These types of chargers are preferred.
Traditional “float” chargers provide constant voltage with tapering amperage to the battery, even when it is fully-charged. For float-charging, we recommend 1 amp max, 13.2-13.8 volts. These are OK too, but the multi-stage chargers are a better option.
Jim McIlvaine
eCare Manager, OPTIMA Batteries
www.pinterest.com/optimabatteries
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Verdad Gallardo
Race Director
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 10,560
Likes: 439
From: Wellington, FL
St. Jude Donor '11 thru '25
Jud, I know what sales associates are supposed to do when customers come in for warranty service, but that doesn't always end up happening. Whenever a discharged battery is tested, it will almost always come back as needing to be replaced, even if it would pass a test with flying colors once fully-recharged. Some units will suggest charging and re-testing, based on the voltage measured, but it is the extra step of first attempting to recharge a battery before testing, that is either missed by associates or an unacceptable inconvenience to an impatient customer.
Not having watched the ShipShape show, it's difficult for me to comment on what was said by them. Based on your description, I would say none of our batteries require more of a charge than a flooded counterpart. Contrary to petes74ttop claim, in most instances, Optima batteries can be charged and maintained just as someone would with a flooded product- no special charger is needed. It is only when AGM batteries become deeply-discharged, that they may need a parallel charge, if the charging unit does not recognize or charge batteries discharged below a minimum voltage level. Any lead-acid battery that is discharged below 12.4 volts and is allowed to sit in that state will begin to sulfate, which diminishes both capacity and lifespan. That is true for any lead-acid battery, wet or dry.
TX-Techman, it sounds like you no longer have your old battery, but I would've been interested in knowing if it dropped significant voltage over 12-24 hours like you experienced, if it was totally disconnected from your car. When I had Brady Basner in from Powermaster Alternators to shoot a tech video, we discharged the battery on my '92 Silverado after we established baseline numbers. My YellowTop kept starting the engine, until we discharged it below 8.0 volts, so it is possible for deeply-discharged Optima batteries to keep turning an engine over even into the single digits. Less than 4 volts sounds very extreme though.
A typical battery, like our 34/78 RedTop is a 50Ah battery. If your vehicle has a 25-milliamp parasitic draw, that means it will discharge that battery at a rate of .6 amps per day (.025 x 24 hours). That would result in that battery being completely discharged in about 83 days. (50Ah/.6 amps). Those calculations assume the battery is in relatively good condition and fully-charged when the car is parked (most are not) and these timeframes can be shorter in hotter climates and longer in temperate climates. Most vehicles also need batteries that are well above a 0% state of charge to start. Even when batteries are completely disconnected from a vehicle, they will still have a small self-discharge rate, although AGM products will do a much better job of holding voltage over time, than a flooded product.
As for chargers, the best units are microprocessor-controlled and there are two basic types of maintenance chargers. Fully-automatic, “multi-stage or multi-step” chargers will monitor the battery and charge it as necessary. Multi-stage maintainers will charge at varying voltages and varying amperage (rarely exceeding 2 amps). Some of these multi-step chargers are also capable of being regular battery chargers (7 amps or more). These types of chargers are preferred.
Traditional “float” chargers provide constant voltage with tapering amperage to the battery, even when it is fully-charged. For float-charging, we recommend 1 amp max, 13.2-13.8 volts. These are OK too, but the multi-stage chargers are a better option.
Jim McIlvaine
eCare Manager, OPTIMA Batteries
www.pinterest.com/optimabatteries
Not having watched the ShipShape show, it's difficult for me to comment on what was said by them. Based on your description, I would say none of our batteries require more of a charge than a flooded counterpart. Contrary to petes74ttop claim, in most instances, Optima batteries can be charged and maintained just as someone would with a flooded product- no special charger is needed. It is only when AGM batteries become deeply-discharged, that they may need a parallel charge, if the charging unit does not recognize or charge batteries discharged below a minimum voltage level. Any lead-acid battery that is discharged below 12.4 volts and is allowed to sit in that state will begin to sulfate, which diminishes both capacity and lifespan. That is true for any lead-acid battery, wet or dry.
TX-Techman, it sounds like you no longer have your old battery, but I would've been interested in knowing if it dropped significant voltage over 12-24 hours like you experienced, if it was totally disconnected from your car. When I had Brady Basner in from Powermaster Alternators to shoot a tech video, we discharged the battery on my '92 Silverado after we established baseline numbers. My YellowTop kept starting the engine, until we discharged it below 8.0 volts, so it is possible for deeply-discharged Optima batteries to keep turning an engine over even into the single digits. Less than 4 volts sounds very extreme though.
A typical battery, like our 34/78 RedTop is a 50Ah battery. If your vehicle has a 25-milliamp parasitic draw, that means it will discharge that battery at a rate of .6 amps per day (.025 x 24 hours). That would result in that battery being completely discharged in about 83 days. (50Ah/.6 amps). Those calculations assume the battery is in relatively good condition and fully-charged when the car is parked (most are not) and these timeframes can be shorter in hotter climates and longer in temperate climates. Most vehicles also need batteries that are well above a 0% state of charge to start. Even when batteries are completely disconnected from a vehicle, they will still have a small self-discharge rate, although AGM products will do a much better job of holding voltage over time, than a flooded product.
As for chargers, the best units are microprocessor-controlled and there are two basic types of maintenance chargers. Fully-automatic, “multi-stage or multi-step” chargers will monitor the battery and charge it as necessary. Multi-stage maintainers will charge at varying voltages and varying amperage (rarely exceeding 2 amps). Some of these multi-step chargers are also capable of being regular battery chargers (7 amps or more). These types of chargers are preferred.
Traditional “float” chargers provide constant voltage with tapering amperage to the battery, even when it is fully-charged. For float-charging, we recommend 1 amp max, 13.2-13.8 volts. These are OK too, but the multi-stage chargers are a better option.
Jim McIlvaine
eCare Manager, OPTIMA Batteries
www.pinterest.com/optimabatteries
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 24,160
Likes: 78
I buy Everstarts from WalMart and replace them on a 5 year schedule.
And I've had ZERO problems with them.
And I can buy 4 of those batteries for the price of 1 Optima. Do you think that Optima is going to last 20 years? Sure doesn't sound like it judging by the comments here and in the other tech forums.
And I've had ZERO problems with them.
And I can buy 4 of those batteries for the price of 1 Optima. Do you think that Optima is going to last 20 years? Sure doesn't sound like it judging by the comments here and in the other tech forums.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 413
Likes: 22
From: Justin TX
I buy Everstarts from WalMart and replace them on a 5 year schedule.
And I've had ZERO problems with them.
And I can buy 4 of those batteries for the price of 1 Optima. Do you think that Optima is going to last 20 years? Sure doesn't sound like it judging by the comments here and in the other tech forums.
And I've had ZERO problems with them.
And I can buy 4 of those batteries for the price of 1 Optima. Do you think that Optima is going to last 20 years? Sure doesn't sound like it judging by the comments here and in the other tech forums.
Here are a few reasons for my decision.
No worries about the case rupturing and bleeding acid all over me or the car.
They are totally sealed (NO Vapors) to explode. However they can still explode under certain circumstances (over charging)
They can be mounted in any position (even upside down if you want)
http://www.carquestprofessionals.com...q_myths.html#8
AGM Batteries may not totally eliminate these risk but they do greatly reduce the risk. To me this is worth the extra $100.
I hope that from what I have learned since starting this thread will help extend my battery life greatly on the replacement I just got.
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 24,160
Likes: 78
I appreciate your view and if cost is the only thing of interest, stay with the lead acid. The AGM is more costly, about double and maybe they don't last 20 or even 10 years. But I prefer not having a liquid filled battery sitting 6 inches behind my seat, which is why I purchased the first one in 2008. Why?
Here are a few reasons for my decision.
No worries about the case rupturing and bleeding acid all over me or the car.
They are totally sealed (NO Vapors) to explode. However they can still explode under certain circumstances (over charging)
They can be mounted in any position (even upside down if you want)
http://www.carquestprofessionals.com...q_myths.html#8
AGM Batteries may not totally eliminate these risk but they do greatly reduce the risk. To me this is worth the extra $100.
I hope that from what I have learned since starting this thread will help extend my battery life greatly on the replacement I just got.
Here are a few reasons for my decision.
No worries about the case rupturing and bleeding acid all over me or the car.
They are totally sealed (NO Vapors) to explode. However they can still explode under certain circumstances (over charging)
They can be mounted in any position (even upside down if you want)
http://www.carquestprofessionals.com...q_myths.html#8
AGM Batteries may not totally eliminate these risk but they do greatly reduce the risk. To me this is worth the extra $100.
I hope that from what I have learned since starting this thread will help extend my battery life greatly on the replacement I just got.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 413
Likes: 22
From: Justin TX
Chemically speaking, an AGM battery is the exact same thing as a typical lead-acid battery. They absolutely can still out-gas. You are mistaken there. The only advantage is the glass mat is not filled past is saturation point thus the battery can't leak. But do not mistake that to mean that an AGM battery cannot under any circumstances liberate itself of acid. They damn well can. Think of them just like a sponge. No, a sponge won't leak if it's under the saturation point, but squeeze it, sling it around, smack it ... liquid still comes out, right?
I think I am going to buy another one this month for my 2008, they have a promotion to get the maintainer free for the month of April. I can then move the maintainer between the 69 and 08 as needed.
Last edited by TX-Techman; Apr 22, 2014 at 10:42 PM.
Instructor
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
From: Kenosha Wi
an update on my last red top, my originally purchased red top was actually less than 2 years old when I returned it for replacement,
the replacement battery was 11 months old from time of purchase and 2 years 2 months old according to the "born on date" sticker, (sat on the shelf for over a year) I took it back to advance auto and she again tested it and mentioned it needed a charge, she told me she would charge it for half an hour then test it again, I received a call from her an hour and a half later stating that i could bring in the recipt and get the new exchange battery, thats the third one in just under 3 years,
I will admit I did not have any sort of charge on it over the winter, stored right next to my 80 corvette (with no charge either) in a heated garage, the battery in the corvette is a standard lead acid battery several years old and started no problem, the optima is in the 55 and the battery shut off was in off position, no parasitic drain,
when I charged the optima I did my home work and charged it as per Optima's suggestions, in parallel with a known good battery, 10 amps for as long as it takes to get the dead battery up to at least 10.5 volts then 1 amp till it is fully charged,
Battery would not come above 11.5 volts then drop down to just under 11 volts in a short time,
While I do like the optima batteries look and safety they're just too much trouble to maintain, I shouldn't have to babysit a battery all winter just to keep it in spec's, I wont buy another one until they resolve the issues I seem to have with them, maybe I'm just a lazy car guy?
the replacement battery was 11 months old from time of purchase and 2 years 2 months old according to the "born on date" sticker, (sat on the shelf for over a year) I took it back to advance auto and she again tested it and mentioned it needed a charge, she told me she would charge it for half an hour then test it again, I received a call from her an hour and a half later stating that i could bring in the recipt and get the new exchange battery, thats the third one in just under 3 years,
I will admit I did not have any sort of charge on it over the winter, stored right next to my 80 corvette (with no charge either) in a heated garage, the battery in the corvette is a standard lead acid battery several years old and started no problem, the optima is in the 55 and the battery shut off was in off position, no parasitic drain,
when I charged the optima I did my home work and charged it as per Optima's suggestions, in parallel with a known good battery, 10 amps for as long as it takes to get the dead battery up to at least 10.5 volts then 1 amp till it is fully charged,
Battery would not come above 11.5 volts then drop down to just under 11 volts in a short time,
While I do like the optima batteries look and safety they're just too much trouble to maintain, I shouldn't have to babysit a battery all winter just to keep it in spec's, I wont buy another one until they resolve the issues I seem to have with them, maybe I'm just a lazy car guy?
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 24,160
Likes: 78
AGM batteries ARE LEAD ACID BATTERIES. The risk of explosion is no different. But somehow you think the Optima is safer because it's sealed? If anything that makes it more prone to explosion not less. (bombs are really well sealed btw
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Former Vendor
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 279
Likes: 20
From: Glendale Wisconsin
Our batteries (and all lead-acid batteries) can vent gas that is both flammable and toxic in extreme situations, so we always recommend proper venting for any battery located in an enclosed area (interior or trunk). However, the chances of that happening with AGM batteries is far less than flooded batteries.
Una4dbl55, Optima batteries aren't that much different than flooded products in terms of the maintenance that should be performed on them- keep them fully-charged whenever possible and they'll last a long time. While a cut-off switch is a good idea, it works best when the battery is fully-charged. A battery that is already partially-discharged will still sulfate below 12.4 volts, even if it is disconnected from a car. I don't think you're a lazy car guy. After all, you went through the trouble and expense of storing your vehicles in a heated garage in Wisconsin. I don't know how much that runs you every winter, but I can guarantee you running a battery maintainer all winter long won't cost anywhere near as much.
Jim McIlvaine
eCare Manager, OPTIMA Batteries
www.pinterest.com/optimabatteries
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 24,160
Likes: 78
But either one would be a statistical outlier and is not particularly relevant to the discussion here.
Our batteries (and all lead-acid batteries) can vent gas that is both flammable and toxic in extreme situations, so we always recommend proper venting for any battery located in an enclosed area (interior or trunk). However, the chances of that happening with AGM batteries is far less than flooded batteries.
Last edited by wcsinx; Apr 23, 2014 at 11:15 AM.
Safety Car
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 3,717
Likes: 551
From: Seattle Washington
Since probably the biggest complaint is the cost of these Batteries where are we buying them ? Its been a long time since I needed one, the most I have ever paid was $140. Costco used to sell them for $100 to $120 depending on what year is was. ( they got cheaper, not more ) And a local Parts store used to sell blems for $69. These prices are not all the same model of red top, and are pretty dated with exception of Costco which was maybe 3 years ago.
Former Vendor
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 279
Likes: 20
From: Glendale Wisconsin
wcsinx, while it is not typical for our batteries to last 20 years or longer, it certainly isn't unheard of for that to happen. I'm willing to post more examples for every flooded lead-acid story you can find and we'll see who runs out of 20-year old batteries first.
As for gassing, it's not a matter of my opinion as to why Optima batteries are less prone to gassing, but fact. Oxygen gas recombination in AGM designs in general, limits water loss. This is a feature that is lacking in wet products. Optima's grid alloy is also one of the most corrosion-resistant alloys in production. The high purity of the alloy and it's simple binary composition minimizes gas generation. Typical wet or flat-plate AGM batteries use grid alloys that contain three of four elements, which results in lower overall purity and gassing characteristics that are not as good as Optima's binary lead alloy. As a result, Optima batteries will have less corrosion at elevated temperatures and less water loss when compared to conventional wet or flat-plate AGM products.
Jim McIlvaine
eCare Manager, OPTIMA Batteries
www.pinterest.com/optimabatteries
As for gassing, it's not a matter of my opinion as to why Optima batteries are less prone to gassing, but fact. Oxygen gas recombination in AGM designs in general, limits water loss. This is a feature that is lacking in wet products. Optima's grid alloy is also one of the most corrosion-resistant alloys in production. The high purity of the alloy and it's simple binary composition minimizes gas generation. Typical wet or flat-plate AGM batteries use grid alloys that contain three of four elements, which results in lower overall purity and gassing characteristics that are not as good as Optima's binary lead alloy. As a result, Optima batteries will have less corrosion at elevated temperatures and less water loss when compared to conventional wet or flat-plate AGM products.
Jim McIlvaine
eCare Manager, OPTIMA Batteries
www.pinterest.com/optimabatteries