Got the new shield. Sounds like my issue is the shield and or the starter or connections. I will not have a chance to get the shield in till one night during the week. I will let you know how it goes.

If I want to also install a hi torque starter are there any recommendations?

 

Tight engine is a new one but lets just say if you did have an engine with incorrect tolerances do to a bad or incorrect engine build then your engine wouldn't last 30 minutes under normal operation start up wouldn't be your only issue

 

I have heard lots of people solve the problem with heat shields, especially if you have Headers on the engine. I myself have never used a heat shield and do not think I have ever actually seen one on a car I have worked on. If the heat shield doesnt work, check all your cable connections and cables. I have had this issue before and its eitehr been the cables, weak battery, weak starter, or the timing a bit off.

 

You may know this already, but checking the connections doesn't mean just look at them. After a few unsuccessful attempts to start the car, actually put your hand on the battery terminals, starter battery connection and ground connections. If you have a bad connection at the post or terminal or a bunch of corrosion in the cable at a lug or ground connector just under the rubber sheath, the lug/connector/cable is going to be hot to the touch. That will tell you that there isn't a good electrical connection at that spot.

Have you put a voltmeter on the battery to see what it reads? My charger has a reading for percent of charge and voltage.

I recently had the same problem you report with a "tight" (brandy new), high compression, large displacement big block with a stock starter. Turned out that the 2 small wires going to the field windings on the alternator had a bunch of broken wire strands. At least, this is what I found and what I think was the problem, the car's apart for other reasons now, so I haven't run it yet since the fix. The logic is that the car would start, but would be using more juice than the alternator was putting out while being driven, so it would act like it was a typical "hot start" problem if I shut it off. Almost got stuck once and a second time I did get stuck (had to sit and let the engine cool off). Both times when I got back to the ranch, I put the charger on the car and the battery charge percentage was down. I suggest that you check your battery voltage when you leave and see if it is higher, lower or the same when you get back, to get a rough idea what your charging system is doing.

Good luck.

 

Ok, installed the shield and the problem is the same. I had an idea. I figured instead of adjusting the timing back I would simply pull the coil wire and see if it cranks freely. It still does not. So it is not timing. If I am wrong with this approach please advise. My CR is calculated as 9.5/1. So to me I should not need a hi torque starter.

 

I am pretty sure the suggestion for the timing was due to heat. Timing will not cause your engine to not turn over at all when it's hot.

The heat may have already fried your starter solenoid. The point of the high torque mini starter is not really the high torque part, it's the mini part. It moves it away from the hot parts so it stays cooler.

 

To be clear, it barely turns over but it does turn over. if i go and try to start it now it will be just fine.

 

You went with the easy fix.
Blaming solenoid , starter ....is usually bogus .....more likely current flow issues..

Those old school parts rarely fail
Time to do,the real work .

If you have a known , tested at auto store ALL cells working battery, yes they can have a cell go,bad , I've had NEW battery get a bad cell in a few weeks.Then you need to, most important check all your grounds . Looking does nothing , remove the lugs , clean them well, clean chassis contact points , clean faster ers.....you need correct current flow to operate a high torque motor ...the starter.

Just because the radio will work or the car starts when cold doesn't mean the grounds are good or the CABLES are good.

Poor connection MAY be just good enough for a cold start , BUT , poor ground may NOT let enough current pass to start the car when hot.

Also.....I'll bet you still have the original battery cables on the car .

You can NOt tell squat about your cables by just looking at them , and going oh they look good to me ....

Inside the coating , over 40 years internal corrosion builds up.....the resistance increases and Less current passes ....no matter HOW good your battery is.

So.....somewhere in a high current area , you have poor wring or a poor ground or connection.

Also any device such as a clutch safety switch can have dirty or worn internal contacts .....this can reduce the current flow to the starter

Doing some of these thing may help....but To get a car to start reliable like when it was new , it will need need new battery cables .

 

I'm in line with Mr. Pilot. Check your connections and cables.

I am running an 11:1 CR 540ci engine with 500 miles on it, headers and initial timing set at 14 degrees with the stock GM starter. Is there anything else that I could do to make this engine harder to turn over? When the 900CCA Optima is charged, the engine cranks and starts fine when cold. In what I wrote above, I found that my alternator was not putting out, so I had less cranking power after riding around for a while, plus a hot engine. Have you given any thought to your alternator? I would take it to an auto electric place to have them check the output after you're sure your cables and connections are good.