OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*(
Instructor
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 188
Likes: 0
From: Eastern Shore, AL
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (Maurice)
After you got the gas and it started running rough did you notice if it was running hotter? Sounds like water in the gas. :mad
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 866
Likes: 1
From: Peabody,MA,USA
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (Cookwithvette)
Make sure that the water pump isn't siezed. I know a guy who thought his engine siezed and rebuilt the 454. It did the same thing when he went to start the new engine. It ended up being a stuck water pump.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 3,286
Likes: 8
From: San Jose California
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (Maurice)
If you blew a head gasket, your car would run like a pig with water leaking into the combustion chamber. If water leaked into your cylinders while it was parked it won't turn over either, at least not without bending a connecting rod. Water does not compress!
Chuck
Chuck
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 42,487
Likes: 47
SPARTAN
CI 3-4-5-6-8-9-10 Vet
CI-9 AutoX Winner
CI-3 Go Kart Champ
St. Jude '03-'04-'05-'06-'07-'08-'09-'10-'11
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (Maurice)
Ouch. That's not sounding good. i don't like the conditions under which it died. Something mechanically wrong was happening inside the engine. I'm guessing that it was a bearing that decided to go for a spin. It finally decided to give up the ghost and seize on you. That's my vote anyhow. Let us know what you find.
Dave
Dave
Advanced
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 84
Likes: 0
From: Riockwall Texas
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (ddecart)
Sure sounds like you may have a hydraulic lock. The excessive use of fuel is an indicator that the carb could be leaking down into the engine. A cylinder with the intake valve open would fill with fuel, and lock the engine tight.
Pull the plugs first and look for evidence of a hydraulic lock. If the engine turns with the plugs out, you probably dodged a bullet. If this is it, make sure toi change the oil and repair the carb.
Good Luck.
Pull the plugs first and look for evidence of a hydraulic lock. If the engine turns with the plugs out, you probably dodged a bullet. If this is it, make sure toi change the oil and repair the carb.
Good Luck.
Race Director
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 10,866
Likes: 717
From: Beverly Hills/Pine Ridge Florida
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (Bob in Dallas)
Maurice mentioned in his post that he pulled all the plugs and tried to turn it over. If there was water in any of the cylinders, with the plugs out, it would have come out of the plug hole...so....with no compression, there can be no hydro-lock. :) Chuck
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 3,052
Likes: 0
From: Vancouver BC, Canada
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (Maurice)
:( You've got me in suspense, but I really hope it turns out to be something simple like the timing chain. Good luck. (I love to come give a hand if you could cover the flight... :D )
Corvette Stories
The Best of Corvette for Corvette Enthusiasts
How Much Horsepower Every Corvette Engine "LOST" in 1972
Joe Kucinski
Top 10 DOs and DON'Ts for Protecting Your Convertible Top!
Michael S. Palmer
Top 10 Most Explosive Corvettes Ever Made: Power-to-Weight Ratio Ranked!
Joe Kucinski
150 hp to 1,250 hp: Every Corvette Generation Compared by the Specs That Matter
Joe Kucinski
8 Coolest Corvette Pace Cars (and Replicas) of All Time
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Corvette Engines RANKED by Peak Torque (70+ Years of Muscle!)
Joe Kucinski
Corvette ZR1X Will Be Pacing the Indy 500, And Could Probably Race, Too!
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Corvettes Coming to Mecum Indy 2026!
Brett Foote
Top 10 C9 Corvette MUST-HAVES to Fix These C8 Generation Flaws!
Michael S. Palmer
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 3,569
Likes: 1
From: Hawaii
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (SharkGills)
It wasn't running any hotter when it was running poorly. When I pulled the spark plugs they all had a nice coat of soot from running a bit rich.
I will check the water pump tomorrow. Thanks for the tip.
I thought about a head gasket but the plugs were still dirty, someone told me my spark plug(s) would be shiny new. All had a bit of soot on them.
Ok, now for my stupid question, how would blowing a head gasket seize the engine while trying to start it? The engine turned over a couple of times before the small "boom" occured
I will check the water pump tomorrow. Thanks for the tip.
I thought about a head gasket but the plugs were still dirty, someone told me my spark plug(s) would be shiny new. All had a bit of soot on them.
Ok, now for my stupid question, how would blowing a head gasket seize the engine while trying to start it? The engine turned over a couple of times before the small "boom" occured
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 3,569
Likes: 1
From: Hawaii
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (Turbo-Jet)
:( You've got me in suspense, but I really hope it turns out to be something simple like the timing chain. Good luck. (I love to come give a hand if you could cover the flight... :D )
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,514
Likes: 1
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (Maurice)
Ok, now for my stupid question, how would blowing a head gasket seize the engine while trying to start it?
Scott
C6 the C5 of tomorrow
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 6,665
Likes: 2
From: Twin Cities Minnesota
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (Scott78)
Scott's right. I had a '69 Olds 442 that blew a head gasket. Sucked water into two or three clyinders ( don't remember, it's been a while ) The starter would just hum.
But I pulled the plugs and let me tell you it made a fine water pump! :lol: Got my brother soaking wet!
So I don't thinks a cracked head / gasket.
I think he carb float stuck and it was dumping fuel. the massive amounts of fuel washed the oil off the clyinder walls and a piston overheated and welded itself into the clyinder.....
Or a piston just decided to sieze for some other reason!
But I pulled the plugs and let me tell you it made a fine water pump! :lol: Got my brother soaking wet!
So I don't thinks a cracked head / gasket.
I think he carb float stuck and it was dumping fuel. the massive amounts of fuel washed the oil off the clyinder walls and a piston overheated and welded itself into the clyinder.....
Or a piston just decided to sieze for some other reason!
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 16,416
Likes: 1
From: NC,USA
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (427V8)
could it be a lightly bent rod and the piston got stuck on the up stroke?
Just an idea...
Good luck to you man :cheers:
Just an idea...
Good luck to you man :cheers:
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,547
Likes: 12
From: Carbondale Pa.
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (427V8)
Scott's right. I had a '69 Olds 442 that blew a head gasket. Sucked water into two or three clyinders ( don't remember, it's been a while ) The starter would just hum.
But I pulled the plugs and let me tell you it made a fine water pump! :lol: Got my brother soaking wet!
So I don't thinks a cracked head / gasket.
I think he carb float stuck and it was dumping fuel. the massive amounts of fuel washed the oil off the clyinder walls and a piston overheated and welded itself into the clyinder.....
Or a piston just decided to sieze for some other reason!
But I pulled the plugs and let me tell you it made a fine water pump! :lol: Got my brother soaking wet!
So I don't thinks a cracked head / gasket.
I think he carb float stuck and it was dumping fuel. the massive amounts of fuel washed the oil off the clyinder walls and a piston overheated and welded itself into the clyinder.....
Or a piston just decided to sieze for some other reason!
Racer
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 267
Likes: 0
From: Seattle, WA USA
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (moosie982)
I'm casting my vote for broken timing chain/gear. The inability to idle and poor mileage is a good indication of having 'jumped time'. The fact that it went away again before the engine failed entirely sounds consistent. If the top sprocket was the stock aluminum & nylon type, the normal condition in old age is that all the nylon tooth 'caps' break off and only the smaller aluminum 'skeleton' is left. It's small enough to allow the chain to jump to a retarded state on a hard acceleration and on occasion, to jump back again during hard deceleration. If left uncorrected, this state is usually followed by either the complete break-up of the top sprocket and subsequent 'wadding up' of the chain around the crank sprocket -OR- the chain jumping several teeth at once, resulting in valve-to-piston contact followed by total anihilation of several reciprocating engine parts.
Good luck...I don't envy you, no matter what the problem turns out to be.
Good luck...I don't envy you, no matter what the problem turns out to be.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 3,569
Likes: 1
From: Hawaii
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (427V8)
Update if it helps anybody.
Just drained the oil and it smelled very gasoline'ish. Didn't notice any metal parts or shavings in the oil. The oil was black.
My plan of action is to start at the top and work my way down. I am going to pull the intake a heads, then if I have to pull the engine, I will do that next. Anybody got a better plan?
Just drained the oil and it smelled very gasoline'ish. Didn't notice any metal parts or shavings in the oil. The oil was black.
My plan of action is to start at the top and work my way down. I am going to pull the intake a heads, then if I have to pull the engine, I will do that next. Anybody got a better plan?
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 3,569
Likes: 1
From: Hawaii
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (73Ken73)
Make sure that the water pump isn't siezed. I know a guy who thought his engine siezed and rebuilt the 454. It did the same thing when he went to start the new engine. It ended up being a stuck water pump.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 752
Likes: 31
From: Melbourne Australia
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (Maurice)
When you pull the intake manifold, you can look into timing case area and see the top of the cam sprocket. It's easy to see if the cam sprocket is destroyed.
Don't ask me how I know!
good luck,
Joe
Don't ask me how I know!
good luck,
Joe
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 3,052
Likes: 0
From: Vancouver BC, Canada
Re: OUCH - big engine problems, will not turnover even by hand :*( (Maurice)
Make sure that the water pump isn't siezed. I know a guy who thought his engine siezed and rebuilt the 454. It did the same thing when he went to start the new engine. It ended up being a stuck water pump.
How do you check for a siezed water pump? I loosened the belts and the water pump pulley spun around ok.
How do you check for a siezed water pump? I loosened the belts and the water pump pulley spun around ok.
I guess you're down to
-broken timing chain
-bottom end :(