Hi All,
I am going to attempt to get "American Force" 20x14 wheels installed in the rear of my 69 with offset trailing arms and fender flares. I am also going to shoot for 18x10s or 18x12s up front with the Mickey Thompson radials on all 4 corners. the 28x18R20s in the rear or contingency plan the 28x15R20s in the rear if the 18s are too too wide. And the 26x12R18 or 26x10R18 if the 12s are too wide. I think I can manage the 12s up front. The wheels are key, American Force seems to be very affordable and very pretty for what you get vs other companies that can run 2-3-4-5 times as much for the same size. Now I am picking a standard 5 spoke wheel nothing too crazy, but I must say the Torque Thrusts are just over done soooo many have picked them and I like them too but I want to do something completely different that others do not have.

American Force INDEPENDENCE wheel Comes in 12-13-14-15 inch widths and 18-19 and 20 inch diameters. Shooting for 20x14 rear and 18x12 up front if I can massage them all in with the correct offset/backspacing etc. with the Fender Flares I have access to......we will see.



Mickey Thompson Sportsman SR Radial Tires

Just wondering if anyone has attempted ANYTHING as wide as these in the past without having to convert the whole car to a race car with narrowed solid rear axles and chop the frame and fiberglass in the trunk area to hell and back before? I want the car to handle like its on rails, So the more I push the wheels OUT from the car the better it will handle vs making it look like a funny car and have everything tucked in behind the stock fenders on all 4 corners. Not liking that look at all. I get it has a purpose but not what I am after. I do not want to go full wide body with those squared off rear fenders and all that just nice wide 4-5-6 inch flares in the rear and 2-4 inch flares up front is what I am proposing to do and cut the original fiberglass open pretty wide and high so you do not even see a seam where the new flares go on and it looks like its supposed to be that way from the factory.
Just wanted to see if anyone has taken what most do with the standard 15-17-18-20 inch wheels running 10-11-12 in wide and pushed it to the extreme and made it work?
Doing simple math, stock wheel I think is 9 inches so +2 for the offset trailing arms, and + 4 for the rear flares should yield me about 15 inches of width so a 14 in wide wheel SHOULD be okay and manageable taking into account the flares come down and I do not want the tire to slam into the inside edge of the flare so by taking it in 1 inch from the outer edge of the flare should yield me enough space that at full suspension compression it will JUST miss the flares inner surface. I can always put custom bump stops in to make SURE the suspension does not allow the tire to rub and with either VanSteel or Global West tubular trailing arms and A Arms the front should be able to have the inner fender wells cut and molded to allow the extra space to get the wheels to turn just about all the way before it touches the frame rails and the flares up front can be placed a tad wider to allow for the extra travel space needed to swing a negative offset rim from lock to lock, and again can utilize bump stops to ensure the wheels and tires do not touch the frame rails.
So what do you all think? I would opt for the 18s on all 4 corners but I do not believe Mickey Thompson makes the 15 and 18 inch widths in their Sportsman S/R Radials in the 18 inch rim diameters, You have to bump to 20 to get those or drop all the way down to the 15s to get those widths and I just can NOT do the 15s on a car im doing up as modern and "today" fresh as I can create it. This car has the 1 piece flip front end from Ecklers from a long time ago and some meat head put a turbo 350 in it and yanked the original Muncie 4 speed out of it so I am going to put the 427 and Muncie back in it as it should be.
So am I insane or can I pull it off, Any tips, tricks or advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you all

Jenni

 

I have 15x10 on the front with 26x10r15 and 15x10 and 26x12r15 on the rear with stock arms.

 

First off, BEAUTIFUL Car!!!! How wide are your flares? 4 inch in rear 2 inch in front? Do you ever have any rubbing issues front or rear? Can you turn your steering wheel lock to lock or do you have to stop just shy to prevent rubbing the frame rails?
I was going to do the offset rear arms to allow more back spacing for the rear wheels which is how I was going to try to get a 14 inch wide wheel under it with an 18 inch wide tire under there. It SHOULD fit as long as the suspension has a bump stop to keep the tire from rubbing the inside of the flare. Sort of like a little prevention in case I hit a dip in the road and the car wants to squat down fully. With my old supercharged 80 vette I had 2 exhaust systems, the side pipes with the electric cut outs and a full system exiting the rear and when I would hit a dip the electric cut outs would scrape the ground so I learned where the ruts were in my local area and would approach them on an angle to have all 4 wheels go over the rut or dip individually to keep the car from squatting all the way down but Id prefer to avoid that with this car and ensure everything is tucked up as high as I can underneath and the wheels being 28-29 inches tall should provide adequate ground clearance for the exhaust because I plan on doing the 2 full exhaust systems again because I liked how I could open and close the side pipes with the flip of a switch in the center console and allow them to cool off before I get where I am going to prevent me from burning my legs. Short skirts and side pipes are not the best mix to be honest.
So you have no rubbing issues with the 26 inch tall tires front or rear? Unfortunately Mickey Thompson makes the tires that wide a little taller than 26 so I need to make sure the flares I install are high enough to clear with the suspension compressed fully. Most likely the car will have a slant like most old school muscle cars do with the *** end a little higher than the front as opposed to the leveled look of most cars today. If its what I have to do to stuff 18 inch wide steam roller tires under it then so be it. I can live with that. There will have to be some give an take with something this drastic.
I am going to order one rear wheel and one front wheel and ensure their fitment first, then ill order the tires afterwards and see of i can make some wood tire holder with the correct dimensions that the wheel has and see if it rubs or touches anywhere and make any modifications I need to before I mount the tires on the wheel cause once you mount a tire they wont return the wheel or return the tires so that's the key This is going to be pricey with the wheels running around 800 a piece and the tires at 450 each I dont want to have to eat a mistake and end up having this stuff sitting around unusable and a constant reminder I screwed up royally
Jennifur

 

First let me say VERY BEAUTIFUL CAR!
How wide are your flares? 4 inches in the rear and 2 up front? You have NO rubbing issues with 26 inch by 10 inch up front? and 12s with stock trailing arms out back? Unfortunately Mickey Thompson does not make 26x15 or 26x18 wide tires you have to bump up to 28 or 29 inches tall to get that extreme width so that's why I will have to maybe cut the frame and narrow a section of it where the tires are and the arms come out of that little nook or hole where they are hinged and move any emergency brake cable bracket to the inner side or top side of the trailing arms, shave down the cross leaf spring unless I decide to just go coil overs and do away with the cross leaf spring all together. Sort of like this (See photo below) I do not need to spend 1800.00 dollars on that kit when I can fab one up myself pretty easy. My business partner and I have 31 corvettes we are either building out or parting out so I have access to millions of parts and anything I could imagine I have at my finger tips. Our shop is taking off with part sales and car sales, I do the car restorations and builds while he handles all the parts for sale which is a MASSIVE job. I think a pair of QA1 coil overs in the back will be much better handling than the cross leaf setup that is adequate but with the double adjustable coil overs I can adjust the height of the car a touch and ensure the tires do not rub as well as having the offset trailing arms to allow some additional room inside and ill shave the frame down and reinforce it if need be to make it stronger than it ever was from the factory and use gussets inside if I shave 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch in width to allow these tires to fit and to make sure with the suspension fully compressed and relaxed that the tires are at least 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch away from the frame in any position. Put the car on the lift and I can see where it potentially can hit and mark it and cut it up.
Pull off a "Texas Metal" type of frame reinforcement on the inside with like 120 wall DOM tubing to ensure there is no flex or movement to the rear rails that go up and back. My other thought was to get one of those kits for 800 bucks where you get a 54-56-58 inch wide ford 9 inch rear end and use solid rear trailing arms to locate the rear and a pan hard rod to center it and keep it in place side to side with Heim Joints so it does not bind up anywhere and with 18 and 20 inch wheels the stock brakes or aftermarket 13-14 inch rotors should not interfere with any wheel fitment as well. I have put a lot of thought into it just do not know how I am going to pull it off until I order a wheel and tire for the front and for the back but I cannot mount the tires or then I can't return the wheel or tire if it does not fit and then I end up with expensive stuff that all I can do is put it on the wall and stare at it which is a colossal waste of money so I might even just make a wood wheel to put the tire on with the exact measurements of the wheel and bolt it on to make sure it fits and has no rubbing issues before I get the tires mounted. I just want something different than what everyone else seems to have, and while I like the Cragar and torque thrust look, its been done to death by most people and I just want to be completely different and also pull off what most say can't be done. Cause anything can be done, just depends on how far you are willing to go to make it work. With the increased wheel diameter being 28-29 inches, it should allow plenty of ground clearance because I also plan on installing my 2 exhaust systems like I did in my supercharged 1980 corvette with electric cut outs so I could flip a switch in the center console and open up the side pipes and close them whenever I was a few minutes away from where i was going so I would not burn my legs cause short skirts and 400+ degree side pies do NOT mix and I like my legs the way they are-------not charred and burnt and scarred up, I prefer to keep them that way. I used to scrape the cut outs when the car hit dips in the road so I learned where the car would squat and approach those spots on an angle so all 4 wheels would hit the dip at different times to keep the car from squatting all the way down but prefer to not have to do that with this 69 so having the adjust-ability in the suspension is key.
Thank you for your specs and photos Greatly appreciated.

Jennifur

(see

 

Are you aware they make fitment tools to help with what you are trying to do, below is just an example
https://www.summitracing.com/search/...s?N=4294947698

 

I have no rubbing issues front or rear. I am running the below flares. Backspacing on the rims is 3.77". Let know if you need more information or pictures.

https://www.classicaircraftautoinc.c...s/show/6801038

 

In your best guess or opinion, Would it be better to contact AMERICAN FORCE Directly or go through Summit Racing to purchase these wheels?
I am not at home right now so Ill have to wait until I can get precise measurements for back spacing and offset dimensions and all but I do not know if I should contact American Force directly or go through Summit Racing as a reseller to purchase these. What do you think?
Any suggestions and perspective from anyone would be greatly appreciated.
I just see there being pluses and minuses from going either route. Talking to the manufacturer chances are your order will be spot on but might have to pay more for the same item direct v s through a reseller like Summit Racing. Warranty Returns via Summit (as long as a tire has not been mounted on the wheel and its not bent or dinged up or scratched up should be fully returnable, vs the Manufacturer might not accept any returns at all, I do not know.)

Maybe I will call each and see what their rules are about returns and exchanges and such. I know these wheels are technically truck wheels but I really dont care, If the hub hole is larger than a typical car the lug nuts will center it being conical and maybe I can machine a ring if needed to center the hub on the car hubs if it can not be customized from American Force.
But again, any suggestions, perspectives from anyone would be very helpful and graciously accepted.

Thank you all, appreciate your time and efforts in your replies and value your opinions...........

Jennifur

 

MelWff,
Yes I had seen those things in the past, but the cost of some of them cost as much as a whole wheel brand spankin new. To me, Its not worth the dollar amount ($700-on up is CRAZY for that) The 60-70 dollar one, Yes I could justify spending that but anything more is to me absolutely ridiculous and I can not justify spending that for a very occasional use. Even though I build and restore these about 1-2 cars a year, I still can not justify that high of an investment. But thank you for bring that up.
Does anyone own or have seen or used that inexpensive plastic one? Is it worth the dollar amount and a good value for the $? Sometimes you think something will be somewhat durable and decent and when it shows up from Fed-Ex and the wind gets taken out of your sails really fast seeing what junk and garbage you just purchased for a decent chunk of money and to return something usually can end up costing you more in the long run with shipping to you and then shipping back as a return and their nonsense RESTOCKING FEES and their SHIPPING AND HANDLING fees, Some places will throw the FREE SHIPPING in your face left and right but charge you 20-25% of the items value or price to put it in a box with paper or peanuts or those plastic air bladder bag things so yeah shipping is free but a box costs 94 bucks right? Anyway enough of my silly ranting.
If anyone has ever used or seen and held this plastic inexpensive tire measure hub tool thing a ma hooptie jiggle doo dad, if you can let me and anyone else looking to do a custom wheel and tire combo, if its worth the $ or if its better to just use a little board with a sharpie mark every 1 inch and a pair of holes drilled in it to bolt to the lug nuts with a small block of wood screwed to the back to equal the exact measurements of the wheel you are looking to get and spin it all the way around and turn it with the suspension fully compressed and relaxed and try to figure every variable to ensure your wheels do not touch any brake items, suspension, frame, or even the fenders and lips of flares and all that. (that is what I had planned on doing to simulate the wheel, then make it so I could slip the tire on it and see if the sidewall and overall diameter fits and does not rub then I could buy the wheels at that point and if need be, return the tires if they are too wide and will not fit and I have to go back down to a 15 inch wide tire for the rear. I am sure it will still handle really well but just something about looking at the back of a 1969 corvette with 18 inch wide tires on each side just has to look mind blowing amazing. and not a tubbed funny car type look either, total street, handle like its on magnetic rails!!! That's the idea.
Thank you all,

Jennifur

PS this measurement hooptie doo dad thing a ma jiggy is $63.99 from Summit Racing.

Link to it is here, and the reviews are absolutely TERRIBLE............
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/php-01201/overview/

 

Jennifur

I was looking st the American Force rims and it looks like they don't come in a 5 x 4.75 bolt pattern. Have you looked at American racing? They have several rimes that should meet your needs.

 

Another thing to consider when thinking about large increases in wheel/tire dimensions is the original wheel bearings front and rear were designed for a 27" diameter tire/wheel, with an 8" wheel width, and a tire cross section a little more than 10", 255 mm. At what point is the load you are imposing on those bearings going to exceed their design tolerances?.

 

THe wheels can be drilled with any bolt pattern you select, but here on Sumits site, is the specs for a 14 inch wide with the 5 4 3/4 bolt pattern...........
Not sure what the manufacturers site says but there is a part number for this so I cant imagine they would ignore the most popular 5 bolt lug pattern on earth, From any CK type truck to Blazers, Jimmys, El Caminos and of course any "car" GM has pretty much ever made is always using that 5 4 3/4 pattern.
I will triple check to ensure but I can not imagine they would have a problem drilling these out at this size.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/afw-afta30640

 

https://tiresize.com/