no assist really for 1/2 a turn each way sounds about right. The stock LS pump is rated 3.5 gal/min and 1400 ish psi. I removed the back of the original pump that was on the car (prob not original) and it had a slightly smaller orrfice. I pulled out the back of the Saginaw that was on the car (not sure if its stock) and measured at .140”.

It looks like Jim Shea said that the factory 74-81 vette was 2.9 GPM. 70-73 was 1.6 GPM and the 82 was 1.9gpm.

He also said in that post the following:

.1144” throat DIA was good for 2 gpm
.130” was good for 2.5 gpm
.144” was good for 3 gpm

so if the factory pump out out 2.9 gpm that would mean a .144” throat and a spring that gives you 950psi or 1200psi max.

when I setup the new PS system I followed all the instructions for setting up the ram and it seemed to be fine. The top dead center and 1/2 turn each way was poor since I had the car on the road.

 

Even if you have the LS pump set up perfectly, you'll prefer the Borgeson steering box.

The only other reasonable option is manual steering, with a @GTR1999 -rebuilt steering box. Early boxes (and mine, after the rebuild) have a 3/4"-36 spline input shaft. So @augiedoggy could connect the Borgeson and early C3 input shafts together.

 

Just go to flaming river’s website.
They make many different combinations for different set ups.
They even made a specific joint for my stock steering box to my Ididit column.
They also make one from my Borgeson box to the Ididit column.
If you don’t see what you need, call them and they can set you up.

 

U joints come in pairs. The opposing joint takes the kink out of misalignment rather than transfer it down the line. If you install but one, you are in some way, however inconsequential, exerting a force somewhere else. If steering was a rapidly rotating shaft, you would feel a vibration. You can get away with this, I suppose, because the misalignment is negligible. But I see it as bad engineering.

 

I'm not really following what your saying here there are ujoints in many places under the car and those angles are not always straight? The single ujoint on my trucks steering system has shafts at either end that insect at different angles. /i understand this would be an issue if the angle was extreme and I understand there would be a vibration IF it was a fast moving rotating part but I also understand this to put a lot of stress on the rag disc as well perhaps leading to the increased reported failures vs people using the cheap rag discs in factory applications. I very well could be wrong here its just what its looking like to me.

I mean I use one u joint on the end of my socket wrench al the time with no issues as long as the angle is not so extreme that it causes binding.

 

[QUOTE=augiedoggy;1607842401......but I also understand this to put a lot of stress on the rag disc as well perhaps leading to the increased reported failures vs people using the cheap rag discs in factory applications. [/QUOTE]

Lock to lock on a car with a lot of caster. The red dot from a laser pointer shows how much movement there is on the Borgeson box vs. the frame.


All the other movement is due to the caster moving the car up and down. I do wish I'd put a marker on the steering column to see how it moves.

I'm not trying to change your mind about anything, it's a complex connection. I figure GM knew best.

 

I wonder if GM used the rag joint for other reasons though, jist like the collapsible column there were regulations and such I think. I mean they did abandon the whole rag joint design and replaced it with ujoints right? Or no? In either case I appreciate the comments, I am not an expert on this and don't claim to be. I just Ive owned a lot of vehicles with a ujoint on the steering and this is the only one where I've had to mess with replacing said joint already (rag joint in this case) and I wasn't thrilled to find all limited inferior replacement options at that.

 

GM used the rag joint because it could deflect along the axis as well. Since the steering box is on the frame, and your steering column is mounted on the body, there is the potential for movement between the two.

Since I don't have a source of OEM NOS rag joints, I went with U-Joints.

 

Isn't that how most vehicles are setup though? I mean to my knowledge it's how my trucks setup and they used a ujoint?

 

Does your new truck only have one U-joint, or multiple? And a steering rack too, I bet. The C3 chassis was designed for the 1965 model year.

 

A single u joint at the end of the column and then a shaft pointing that goes to a steering rack.
I'm going to wait and see what kind of space situation I have when I get the box in. I may tackle that today since I'm still waiting on my rotors delayed by amazon

 

The "1/2 turn each way" is the part that does not sound anywhere near correct to me. The car is capable of being able to respond to 1/8" turn of the wheel.

What I would inspect/test in order:
You need to determine where the issue exists:

• Issue one: Stock C3 steering box could be worn out. This is most likely. It is basically a grease filled manual box. Measure/video input shaft / rag joint movement vs pitman arm movement. (Wheels off the ground). It should be instant. A heavily worn 50 year old box could easily give you this "1/2 turn issue" if that is where the issue is. a 1/2 turn should be extremely easy to spot. You could measure pitman arm movement with a dial indicator at first movement, it is a 16:1 ratio so it does not move much at first. Two options: If the box is original and heavily worn I would send it to GTR1999 for the best results. Or replace the whole mess with a faster ratio Borgeson box.
• Issue two: The LS pump may not be spinning at a fast enough rpm to make 100-150 psi at idle. The max flow rate of a pump is spec'd at zero backpressure. The max pressure is spec'd at zero flow. Reality means it operates in the 150 to 400 psi from idle to full-force assist demanded. At some flow rate between max and zero. If it has too low psi at idle, the force to turn the steering wheel would be extremely high, like a manual box, and especially noticeable at zero mph, and then decreasing greatly at 5 mph. If that is the case I would call Turn One and discuss flow rates, pulley diameters, etc. Options are: change the pulleys, or change the flow orifice, or get a custom pump. Without pressure & flow gauges, you are "shooting in the dark" on a custom system. Bit they have the experience base to figure it out.

 

I just looked at my truck. It has what looks like a sealed CV joint (better than a U-joint), that makes a significant angle change, plus another section that could expand and contract. And a rack. So plenty of places to make up for movement between the chassis and cab.

I'm not knocking U-joints, I have them in both C3s, but GM used a rag joint for a reason.

 

I got mine installed yesterday, found out my lower steering column bearings were totally shot so I replaced those as well while pushing in the adjustable shaft. I decided to give the rag joint a shot because the one I got in the kit honestly looked like the stock material with the rag embedded in in the rubber. I used the stock half for the column though. I had no luck reusing the original carriage bolts as they just spun in the holes. my tires did not rub on them before so if they do now ill acquire some new bolts. but for now I used the hardened bolts that came with the ridetech support.

 

Just wanted to update. I was granted the day and had a solid 6hrs from start to finish which included lifting the front end up and removing everything. It all went pretty smooth as I just replaced most of the stuff last summer. I did have a few hiccups and one was the eBay 3/4 DD to 48 spline CV joint. The joint slipped right onto the column no problem but the DD did not fit on the borg. I test fit the column but forgot to test the box fitment. I had to get creative with some carbide bits to make it fit but I did end up getting it on. Save yourself the trouble and get the correct 18mm DD. The eBay CV joint was great quality for $18 though. Other hiccup was the oring adapter fittings I got to convert the box one seemed like it wasn’t fully threaded (return side) and had play in it after it was tight. So I antiseized it and cranked it down eventually getting it tight enough to keep the metal hose end from moving. I did the ridetech bracket and reused the stock hardware but also just bought a new forged and painted pitman arm. I didn’t take the stock one off at all and just used all new parts. Filled it with fluid and started it up going lock to lock while filling quite a few times. Had lots of bubbles/foam kinda but felt like it was filled enough and it was quiet. Put the wheel on, lowered it and took it for a drive. Immediately forgot about the higher turn ratio lol so much better but it can be sensitive going into a turn. The wheel is not too light but much better than stock and the turn ratio makes it a whole new car. I’m very pleased with the outcome and the car is a much better cruiser now. Def worth the upgrade!

 

Thanks for the update! I ended up milling out my U-joint end in a similar manner.

Glad it worked!

 

Yep! You need to slow your hands down now!
Driving instructors have a saying: "slow hands = fast times"
Doesn't make any sense until you try it. Slow down the hands, hold the tires at their limit more often, change your turn angle, straighten out the turn, late apex, etc...etc...
It all goes together and drops your times.
"slow hands = fast times" is much simpler!